May Be Illyrian may be Martian http://vukotic.atspace.com/alb.

htm

Indoalbanisches Etymologisches Wörterbuch

May be Illyrian may be Martian

What a shame!
Unbelievable!
Similar crap you can hardly find even by the most stupid folk- etymologist!
Below is the excerpt from the so-called "Proto-Indo-European Etymological Dictionary",
the book Abdullah has recently advertised.
______________________________________________________

[...meigh-, also meik-

[...Gk.αμορβος “dark” derived from Alb. mje(r)gule ̈ “ fog, darkness “ [common Gk. β < gw,
p < kw phonetic mutation]; Alb. proves that from Root mer-2 ; *extended mer-ek-: “to
shimmer, shine” derived the truncated Root meigh-, also meik- : “to glimmer, twinkle;
mist”...]
The above note is from the "revised" version of Pokorny's PIE dictionary*:
________________________________________________
My comment:
Abdulah (as well as his mentors G.Starostin and A, Lubotsky) does not know that his αμορβος
is αμαυρόβιος in reality, which means "living in darkness" (in fact αμαυρός + βίος; αμαυρώνω
/tarnish, blacken/; βίος life); cf. Serbian mrak, mrakèina, mraèno, mrko (dark, darkness, dusk):
Such foolishness could hardly be expect from an average highschool student!
May Be Illyrian may be Martian http://vukotic.atspace.com/alb.htm

On Jun 30, Abdullah Konushevci wrote a message in which

he tried to conceal his own ignorance and the ignorance of
his mentors - George Starostin and Alexander Lubotsky:
"Stupidity, your name is Dušan.
Mixing Gr adjective amorbos 'dark', where /b/ is from *gW
and -os is simple masculine ending of adjectives, pretending
to connect it with amauros and further with bios, speaks for
itself who the hell you are and what is your level of
education on linguistics. But, I used to be attacked
constantly from such outraged or manikos,
if you like it in Greek, person. Simply, don't wait to answer
on your provocations. I am feed-up from such kind of
craziness.
So, Hasta la Vista, baby!"

The next they (July 1, 2007) I replied to Abdullah:

"If Abdullah were not so uneducated he would understand
that even MORON and MAROON belonged to the MURKY
(Serb. MRKI dark or gloomy) sides of this world.
"Have you had any decent Greek dictionary in you hands?
Obviously not! If you had one you would not talk nonsense!
If you read a proper Greek you would know it was not me
who connected Greek αμαυρός and βίος into the compound
αμαυρόβιος (living in darkness); αμαυρός + βίος =
αμαυρόβιος: and αμορβος is just one of the contracted forms
of teh compound αμαυρόβιος (cf. αμορβαιος); there is no
man in the whole world (of an avarage intelligence) who
wouldnot notice that.
"Why did you put your prosthetic <R> between brackets -
mje(r)gule? Why did you not follow Demiraj who, without
blinking, inserted <R> into the Albanian word 'mjegull' (fog,
mist, haze). If there was a dialectal form of Albanian mjegull
with the sound 'R' without brackets, why did you not mention
it? Where is so-called Proto-Albanian form mergulƒ? What
happened, you do not recognize Demiraj as an authority in
Albanian "science"?
"I know, your task is to promote Shqip-Illyrian language and
so-called Illyrian origin of the Albanian people. Nevertheless,
you should be aware it has always been impossible to make
something from nothing! Albanian mjegull is a clear
borrowing from Greek ομίχλη (fog, mist): Greek OMIKHLE
- Serbian MAGLA => Albanian MJEGULL.
"Do you really believe you can insert a sound wherever you
find it suitable? Are you so stupid to think that you can use
your "magic rubber eraser" as you like? Haven't you noticed,
this is a serious science!; and not your wanton hamlet's fair!
"Finally, this ie book is not only Abdulah's shame; it is shame
for George Starostin and Alexander Lubotsky who revised
and recognized the internet edition of the "updated" and
"modernized" version of Julius Pokorny’s Indogermanisches
Etymologisches Wörterbuch. Both of them are bearing big
responsibility for allowing Abdullah to diseminate his
foolishness and blemish the name and work of the great
scientist Julius Pokorny. I advise them (George and
Alexander) to re-revise this book agian and save their own
honor and honor of those (probably Soros) who financed
them. Also, I think, George Starostin should think what his
father would say about such a negligence and irresponsible
behavior his son has manifested."

_____________________________________________

Akumincum

Note: Illyr. PN Acu-mincum ‘salt stone” : Alb. (*akû -̯ īlio̯ -) akull “ice, sharp ice”. Ger. Achel
f. “ear point, awn” from N.Ger. aggel (with spirant. g) from IE *akû -lā; O.E. āwel m. “fork”,
O.N. soð-āll “meat for (Gmc. *ahwala-, IE *ákû ̯-olo-); if here gallo-Lat. opulus “common
maple “ (Marstrander, Corr. Gmc.-celt. 18), would be placed IE *ok̂u-̯ olo- ; about O.N. uggr
etc. see e/o-stem, about O.E. éar see s-formant; Welsh ebill “drill”, mbr. ebil “peg, nail “
(*akû -̯ īlio̯ -);
May Be Illyrian may be Martian http://vukotic.atspace.com/alb.htm

Note: The mutation kw > p, b in Celtic tongues, Lat. and Gk. Balt *ašus in Ltv. ass “ sharp,
pointed “, Lith. ašutaĩ m. pl. “coarse horse hair “ = Slav.*ošuta m. “ Thistle “ in Church
Slavic оsъtъ, Russ. osot́ . On account of here Toch. A āc̨āwe “rough” (Van Windekens Lexique
15)? see under *ōkû -s “ fast (sharp in the movement) “. 4. With m-formant:
The excerpt from the Indo-European Dictionary; Language Association – http://dnghu.org/
_______________________________________________________________
Acumincum was the Celtic stronghold and it is believed that the Celts were those who named
that station. Acumincum could not be translated as "salt-stone" ("salt-stone" is the Serbian name
- Slan-Kamen) if someone believed it was the Latin name, but eventually "sharp- stone" ('acus'
pin, needle) or “sour/acid stone” (aceo acere be sour). It is interesting to mention that Celtic
Acamincum sounds almost the same as Serbian word Kamenac (a small stone). If it was a
coincidence we must admit that such a coincidence is very unusual.
Namely, if Acumincum was a compound word and first word was acu- (doesn't matter if it was
akus or aceo) what the second part of that word meant? I think, there is no Latin word
‘minci/um’ that will have the meaning “stone”. Of course, there are Latin words caementum (a
quarry-stone, used for walls; cf. English cement) and cæmenta (stone chips used for making
mortar), both words obviously related to the Serbian word 'kamen' (Serb.adj. 'kamenit' stony).
Now comes the most interesting part of this story: if the Scordisci (Celtic tribe) were the one to
name Acumincum why the Celtic/Gaelic languages do not have a word (as far as I know) for
stone similar to Latin cementum and Serbian kamen/ kamenac? Finally, if the Celts had word
similar to kamen or cement, is it possible to find out the history of that word and see what
language
The man who wrote the above notation mentioned the Albanian word 'akull' (ice; akull doesn't
mean "sharp ice" as the author tried to mislead his readers), a clear Latin borrowing (from
gelidus via Common Romanian; cf. Romanian gheaþã), related to Germanic kald- and Slavic
holod-. In fact, the man who wrote this part of the "improved" Pokorny's book, thought that he
must somehow connect Albanian akull with the Latin acus (pin, needle); or acula (little needle),
aculeolus (little needle, pin) and Slavic igla (Serbian igla /needle/, Czech jehla /needle/, Russian
игла; cf. Serbian klin /nail, wedge, bolt, pin/); if it was not possible otherwise why would he not
use the well- known fact that ice might be very sharp when broken! ;-)

However, this writer used the "holy" Pokorny's book to propagate his own ideas about Illyirian
language and Illyrian origin of Albanian people.

There are a lot of Serbian place names Kamenica. A dozen of villages and two larger cities in
Serbia - Sremska Kamenica and Kosovska Kamenica. The whole Balkan area is full of
Kamenica geographical names. Author of the above note seems to have really believed that
Kamenica was an Illyrian toponym. Of course, he has the right to believe whatever he want but
he has no right to pollute a great work, as Pokorny's Indogermanisches Wörterbuch is, with his
folk-etymology's interpretation and overheated nationalistic dreams. As we have already seen,
Latin, Celtic and Serbian (Greek also: κουνώ, άκμων) vocabularies possess the word related to
Acumincum-Kamenac-Kamenica, with the proper meaning - stone, rock. Only language where
such a word does not exist is Albanian.

If the people who have revised this book were thinking about the credibility of science and their
own credibility they would advise the author of these passages to draw back all his unproven
and uncertain theries and hypotheses and would demand him to abide strictly by the
well-known scientific methods and standards.
________________________________________________________

abhro- (*hebhro-) Page-5

Maybe Illyr. VN Α'βροι, Thrac. PN Α'βρο- : Alb. (*Α'βροι) afronj “bring close, squeeze”, afër
“near” similar to formations of Ltv. blaizit ‘squeeze, clash, hit” : O.C.S. blizь, blizъ adv. “
nigh, near “ (lit. “ adjacent “).

The excerpt from the Indo-European Dictionary; Language Association – http://dnghu.org/

______________________________________________________

My comment:

"Wrong! Albanian afroj, afer (squeeze, near) and O.C.S. blizь (Serbian blizu /near, nigh, close
to/) have nothing to do with each other, because they are coming from different basis (afroj
from BR-GON and blizu from BEL-GON).

I wonder what "similar" Abdullah could have found between this two words. Albanian afroj
may be compared with the Serbian words priæi (from prigoniti; come closer) and prionuti
(prijanja stick together, cleave; cf. German Freund, English friend, Serbian prijatelj, prijan, prika
/friend/): once again Serbian prijanja (stick together, cleave) <=> Albanian afroj/afronj (near,
bring close, squeeze)... Of course there are other cognates like Serbian prezanje/na-prezanje
/pregnuæe

(pressing), English press (from Latin presso, pressare); Greek βαρησις (pressure, oppression);
Serbian prignati/prigoniti (drive closer) and the great number of words in other IE languages,
May Be Illyrian may be Martian http://vukotic.atspace.com/alb.htm

which are expressing the status of reciprocal action with the opposite directions."

__________________________________________________________

Abdullah's trying to sidetrack the discussion:

"Cleansing the history through burning earth, a well-know strategy of Serbian Army, was
judged as a crime against humanity. The same could be seen in your messages, cleansing the
history through equation of Illyrians with Martians. You have no clue about l/r shift in many
PIE roots, so what the hell do you ask from anyone to reply on your disgusting posts. I will beg
moderators of sci.lang to save some level of decency, for VD and Alexander Lubotsky are two
uncomparable measures."

Konushevci

My answer was precise:

"I cannot see what the Serbian army has to do with your linguistic ignorance; stop complaining
to everyone and try to be a grown up man.What l/r shift?; are we talking about Japanese kind of
rhotacism? Are you suggesting that Slavic bliz- turned to be Albanian afroj or it happened the
other way round. Both of the above assumptions, in connection with l/r shift, are wrong; maybe
you have another (hidden) option on your mind.

Blizu and afroj were born from different basis; are you really unable to understand it?"

_______________________________________________________________

ai-dh-, i-dh-, nasal. i-n-dh- (*heu̯i -ĝh-) Page-26

Maybe Alb. (*aestā-, *vesna, *vièsientá) vjeshta “autumn, harvest time (long summer)”: Go.
asans “harvest time, summer” [common Alb. prothetic v- before bare initial vowels] hence
Vesta “goddess of hearth and its sacred fire” was an Illyrian goddess, also Alb. vatra
(*vastra) “hearth” with -tre suffix.

The excerpt from the Indo-European Dictionary; Language Association – http://dnghu.org/

________________________________________________________________

My comment:

"If I were following the Abdullah's way of thinking I could say that Vesta was a Serbian
goddess, a reduced form of the Serbian ne-vesta (bride, not married, unleashed); from the
Serbian verb vezati (tie, bond). If not from Serbian it could be from the English word fasten or
even West. Abdulalh is somewhere inbetween because he believes that Roman goddess Vesta
(Greek Hestia) was in fact West-Illyrian or, closer, West- Albanian female deity. Of course,
quite logical, if Vesta was the goddess of hearth (fireplace), it must be connected to some of the
words from the Shqip-Illyro-Albanian vocabulary... and of coruse, the word 'vatër' imposed
itself in a most natural way. In fact, we are going to take the Albanian vatër (fireplace) in
pluralform - 'vatra' -and "spice" it with the <s> infix. What we have achieved? VASTRA! OK.
With the help of the special AlbanianwRRRenching tool, the unnecessary R intRRRuder will be
removed and - VASTA is born! Finally, some fine ablaut-adjustment is needed before we could
see, in all her brilliancy, the Shqip-Illyro-Albanian female

SINGULAR deity - VESTA !! "

________________________________________________________________

Inat - Hunt - Enoy

English meaning: to drive, to overwhelm, harm Deutsche Übersetzung: “worauf eindringen,
treiben, überwältigen, kränken” Material: present *(a)i-neu-mi : O.Ind. inóti, ínvati, Imper.
inuhí, participle -inita- (úpenita- “ pushed, cut into “), “ penetrate into something, master “,
Av. inaoiti, Inf. aēnaŋhe “violate, hurt “, ainita (from *an-inita by haplology) “ not violated,
not painedly “ (from ai énas- n. “Crime, sin, misfortune “ = Av. aēnah- “ act of violence,
crime “, in addition m. “ evildoer”?),Av. intay-” rape, injury; torture “, O.Ind. iná-‘strong; m.
master “,maybe also īti-ḥ f. “plague,need”; Gk. αινος “tremendous”; maybe Alb. inati
“anger; ire; rage; dander; dudgeon; rampage;down;disappointment; malice; blood; rancour;
rancor; pique; spunk; miff; temper; must”.maybe here-in- in Goth. faír-ina “guilt, reproach”,
O.H.G. firinōn ‘sin”, O.Ice. firn n. pl. “the extraordinary” (cf Weisweiler IF. 41, 29 f.), if
original meaning (as in the Heliand) “ act of violence “.

References: WP. I 1, Feist 139/140.

Page(s): 10

Indo-European Language Association – http ://dnghu.org/ Page 35

____________________________________________________________________

My comment:
May Be Illyrian may be Martian http://vukotic.atspace.com/alb.htm

"Albanian word <inat> (anger, grudge, resentment) is the loan word from Serbian <inat>
(defiance, grudge, anger); the basis of this word is the reduplicated primal basis (Gon); most
simply, it can be connected to the Serbian word 'gonjenje' (driving, chasing) or English 'hunting'.
Other cognate of the word 'inat' are the Serbian words 'junak' (hero) and 'junoša' (young man)
and English 'young' (cf.English anger, Greek ankhein squeeze; Latin ango press thight, cause
pain, strangle; Serbian 'uzano/usko' narrow from Serb. 'nagnati' press together or 'ugoniti' drive
in, as if driving the sheep into the sheepfold); Serb. ganuti "feel the pain")."

________________________________________________________

aisk- ISKRA

English meaning: bright, shining Deutsche Übersetzung: “klar, hell, leuchtend” Material:
AwN.. eiskra “ rage before hot excitement “, Mod.Ice. iskra also from burning pain. Lith.
áiškus, where beside zero grade O.Lith. iškùs “clear, bright “. Russ. dial. jáska, demin.
jásoèka “ bright star “, beside it O.Bulg. jasno adv. “clear, bright,distinct”, Russ. jásnyj
“light, clear, bright” from *aiskno-; Pol. jaskry, jaskrawy “blinding,dazzling, brilliant “ from
*aiskro-; O.Bulg. iskra “ spark “ etc. from *iskrā. Maybe zero grade in Alb. (*aiskno-)
shkëndijë ‘spark” [common Alb. n > nd phonetic mutation]. Also Alb. zero grade (*jaskry),
shkrinj “melt, burn”, participle *scrum > shkrumb “ashes” [common Alb. m > mb shift]
loaned in Rom. scrum “ashes”. Russ. dial. jáska, demin. jásoèka “ bright star “, besides
O.Bulg. jasno adv. “ clear, distinct “, Russ. jásnyj “ bright, clear “ from *aiskno; Pol. jaskry,
jaskrawy “ brilliant, sparkling “ from *aiskro; O.Bulg. iskra ‘spark” etc. from *iskrā.

Here the FlN Ger. Aisch (Bavaria), Eysch(en) (Luxembourg), nEng. Axe from Celt. or
Ven.-Illyr. *Aiskā. Maybe Alb. (*aiskā) eshkë “mushroom (when dried used to kindle the fire)”
related to Lat.esca -ae f. “food, victuals, esp. as bait”,

References: WP. I 2, Trautmann 4, Pokorny UrIllyr. 70, 113, M. Förster

Themse 839.

See also: perhaps originated from *aidh-sk- , or from *ai-sk- in āi-̆

4.

Page(s): 16-17

Indo-European Language Association – http ://dnghu.org/ Page 39

___________________________________________________________________

My comment:

"Slavic "iskra" (sparkle) and "jasno" (clear, bright) are not the offsprings of the same
"progenitor"; it means that the root *aisk- could be the source only of the word 'iskra' (sparkle).
What's happened in reality? Slavic 'jasno' (bright, clear) is the word which comes from the
ancient Bel-Gon basis. 'Jasno' is a reduced form of the verb 'bljesnuti' (flash; Ger. Blitz) and
'obasjati' (lighten); we can throw the parallel here between Serbian bljesnuti (flash) => objasniti
(clarify) => jasno (clear, bright) and German blitzen (twinkling) => leuchten (shine, flash) =>
licht (light);

On the other side, Slavic 'iskra' was born from the basis Sur-Hor (Serb. sagoreti, izgoreti /burn,
cremate, burn down/. The Albanian 'shkrinj' (melt, burn) comes from the same Sur-Hor basis
(and thanks God, Abdullah finally put something right), and it is equal to Serbian 'izgaranje'
(burning). Abdullah is also right here (although he is uncertain as usual; his maybe-
yes-maybe-no sanctuary!) when saying that skrumb (char, cinder; not ashes as Abdullah
claimed; ash/ashes = hi/hira in Albanian) and Romanian scrum (ashes) belong to the words
ofthe same origin as Slavic 'iskra' (sparkle) and 'sagoreti/ izgoreti' (burn)."

_________________________________________________

aiu-, aiu- EVER; always; EWIG - UVEK

Page(s): 17-18

Indo-European Language Association – http ://dnghu.org/ Page 44

____________________________________________________

My comment:
May Be Illyrian may be Martian http://vukotic.atspace.com/alb.htm

"Let us compare Serbian adverb 'uvek' (always) and German 'ewig' (eternal). I hope we could
agree that notion eternal is closely related with "always". In addition, we will see that Serbian
word'vek' has the meanings 'century' (a period of 100 years) and "age" (lifetime). The other
Serbian word, derived from the Bel-Gon basis, is the adjective 'veèno', which has the same
meaning as the above-mentioned German 'ewig' (eternal). Now it became clear that Serbian
'uvek' is the cognate to German 'ewig'. ;-)Abdullah is ALWAYS trying to find an Albanian word
that could be suitable for a certain Pokorny's root. And it would be OK if it were not so
compulsively done. In this case Pokorny found the Albanian word 'eshe, (tanks to Norbert Jokl;
Zeitraum, span of time), but I cannot see how that word could be classified among the other IE
words with the meaning 'always'. Maybe Abdullah could help me to understand this item better.

As I told many times before, Albanian language was compiled from the surrounding languages,
mostly from Greek, Italian and Serbian without any rule or system. It is the reason why the
Albanian language is so difficult to decipher. For example. Albanian 'vjeshtë' means autumn and
'vejushë' is widow. It is hard to say how this words suffered such a deep and unusual sound
changes. Explanation probably lies in the fact that Albanian adopted foreign words according to
the way they heard and understood it."

__________________________________________________

pūk-1, peuk- WOLF - VOLK

O.Ind. púccha-, -m “tail, member, rod” (kann *pu[k]-sko- sein); after dem buschigen Schwanz
benannt, seems Goth. faúhō, O.Ice. fōa, O.H.G. foha “ vixen “ (Gmc.-ōn), besides with masc.
-s-: O.E. fox, O.H.G. fuhs “fox” etc.; Lith. paustìs “Tierhaar”; Russ.-Pol. puch (*peukso-,
poukso-) “Flaumfedern, Daunen, feines wolliges Haar an animals” (outof it Lith. pũkas
“Flaumfeder”), Russ. pušistyj “fleecy, dense, buschig”, pušnój továr “Pelzwerk”, Cz.-nsorb.
o-puš (*puchъ), opyš “tail”, Russ. opúška, opušina “edge (of Waldes), hem, Verbrämung”.

Pokorny Page: 849

And what to say about Abdullah's scientific approach? Commenting above Pokorny's root
pūk-1, peuk- Abdullah (or his mentors Starostin and Lubotsky) claimed that "Alb. suggests that
Root pūk-1, peuk- : (thick-haired, *fox) is a reduced root of older Lat. volpes “fox”, Gk.
alôpêx a fox. Root ulp-,lup-, lup- : [a kind of carnivore (fox, wolf)...]*.

My comment:

"In this case not only that Abdullah forgot to denote the Albanian word (or whatever Albanian)
that "suggest" something, but he also mixed wolf and fox with dormouse (small furry-tailed
squirrel-like rodent) - Serbian puh. Although Abdullah can speak Serbian fluently (at school he
has been taught in Serbian) he did not connect the name 'puh' (dormouse) with the Serbian verb
puhati/puhnuti (blow) and adjective na-puhan (inflated, blown up). Logically, dormouse's tail
and body looks like "na-puhano" (inflated) because of its "blown-up" fur hairs. The Serbian
verb 'puhnuti' (blow, inflate) is cognate of the English blow (both stemmed from Bel-Gon basis)
and we can understand it completely if we compare the meanings of English 'blow' and Serbian
verbs 'puhnuti' (blow) and 'puknuti' (explode).

"On the other side is volpe (Latin belua, English wolf), derived from the reduplicated Bel basis;
and it means that 'puh' (dormouse) cannot be compared with Latin volpe (fox; Greek alopex).

"It could be interesting to mention that Serbian word 'lopov' (thief, burglar; cf. volpe) has been
derived from the same reduplicated Bel basis. Theft and burglary are the main practices of that
animal (fox), including cunningness (Serbian lukav, lukavost) what is returning us again to the
Bel-Gon basis; i.e. to Slavic volk, vlk, Greek lycos) Slavic volk (volf) is the word from the same
source (Bel-Gon) as above mentioned puh (dormouse).

"The final conclusion is unquestionable: root pūk-1, peuk- is not and cannot be the reduced
form of ulp-,lup-, but the fact is that both of these roots could be derived from the larger basis
Bel-Bel-Gon, if we consider Greek alopex (Serbian lopina, lopuža /thief/)...

"Of course, this roots and different IE words for animals like wolf and fox demand much
deeper analyzis, for to be exposed in all possible details.

ulp-, lup- (*suilkW-)

COW EATING WOLF
Listen to this stupidity: "Maybe Alb. lopë “cow, (huge
consuming animal; cow eaten by wolves)”, llup “devour”,
llapë “tongue” : Lith. lapenti “to swallow food”.
Page 2737 dnghu.org; Pokorny 1179
_________________________________________________
My comment:

"Interesting, cow has been named in Albanian 'lopë' and,

according to Abdullah's opinion, it is related to the Latin
word lupus (wolf); on the other side, wolf is called ulk/ujk in
Albanian. What a miraculous Sqip-Illyrian naming;
something in style of Polat Kaya, the "famous" Turkish
etymologist whose crankiness Abdullah mentioned recently,
May Be Illyrian may be Martian http://vukotic.atspace.com/alb.htm

when he attacked me, safely hidden behind Cybalist

"moderated" curtain.
"I just wander why the Albanians did not name sheep in
accordance with the Latin lupus/volpes; sheep is much more
favorite pray for wolf/fox than cow - particularly a grown up
one!"Using such a special word and sound-change
"technology" there is nothing in the world that you cannot
"prove". Associated with two others great scientists (G.S. and
A.L.), Abdulah taught Pokorny that his root *lup- was
derived from *ulkW- (most sanative kw => p Indo-Illyrian
sound change).
"Neither Abdullah nor his two soul-trading mentors were
able to understand that Slavic volk (wolf) and lisica (fox)
originated from the Bel-Gon basis while lupus (wolf) and
volpes (fox) sprang from the reduplicated Bel ur-syllable.
There is a Serbian word 'lupež' (thief, crook; also lopina,
lopuža, lopušina) which is obviously connected to Latin
lupus (wolf) and Greek αλωπεκίς/alopekis (fox) and... in
Serbian, the history of these words is clear.
"I was talking many times here about the Bel-Gon basis and
words like English begin and Serbian pogon, waggon, way,
voziti, Weg, pulse and Serbian polazak (start, outset); In case
of the noun volk and lisica the word obilaziti (resort, range,
roam); hence obilazak (visit) => (b)liska => lisica (fox) =>
lija; on the other side, Serbian word 'obilaženje' (in sense of
visit) can also be uvlaèenje (prowling, move about in a
predatory manner; from the sam Bel-Gon basis as 'obilaženje'
visiting), uvlaka, volk, vuk (wolf).
"In order to understand how interesting the development and
history of a certain words can be, let me mention the Latin
word veterinus (from vehiterinus; veho bear, carry, ride,
pass), i.e. vehi-terinus is the same as Serbian "vuèna
životinja" (burden-bearing or pulling animal). Now we are
coming back to the above mentioned "begining' and the
words pogon, waggon, way, voziti, Weg, pulse... However,
Slavic 'volk' is not a pulling animal although the Slavic "volk"
name has been derived from the noun 'vlaèenje' (vlak, volk,
vuk, vuèji)...
"And, please, do not mix Latin fera with German Tier or
maybe with Slavic 'zver', Swedish 'djur', Sanskrit 'tiryanc'
(tiryan), dhúrya (beast of burden)...

_________________________________________________________

ades-, ados-
It seems Root ades-, ados- : ‘sort of cereal” evolved from an older root *heĝh- “ a kind of
grain “. This root was suffixed with common -ska formant in Gmc. branch Gmc. *atisk- a-,
while in Anatolian branch the root was suffixed with common PIE -tar formant. The old
laryngeal (Centum h- > a-, e- : Satem h- > s- ) was lost except in Hitt. and Arm. Clearly Gmc.
tongues borrowed the cognate from a reduced Lat. (*hattar-) adoris > Gmc. *at-isk-a-.
Finally zero grade in Alb. (< adōris) *dris, drizë “thorny plant”, (< dris) drithë “grain”
where the Lat. -is ending has been solidified.

The surprise is the phonetic mutation -ĝh- > -d- found only in Av. - Illyr.- Balt languages.

_______________________________
*Above note is from the "updated" and "enhanced" Proto-Indo- European Etymological
Dictionary ;A Revised Edition of Julius Pokorny’s Indogermanisches Etymologisches
Wörterbuch http://dnghu.org/ - "revised" by George Starostin and Alexander Lubotsky.

_____________________________________________________________________________

My comment:

Latin ador -oris (grain, spelt) and granum -i (grain, seed). First, we must know that these two
Latin words came from the same Hor-Gon basis; or more exactly, from the Hor-Goon and its
inverted Gon-Hor basis (Cf. Serbian <okretati> turn, rotate, revolve and <koturati> turn, rotate
revolve). Latin granum and Serbian zrno (grain) are a clear-cut "products" of the "circle"
(Serbian krug, Latin cicino, corona). In Serbian, there are the words <okrug> and <kotar>, both
with the meaning 'district'; equal to Greek <agros> (χώρα) and Latin <regio -onis> (region).
Now, if we compare Serbian word <jedro> (nucleus, core; from Gon-Hor basis) and Latin
<ador> (grain; Gon-Hor basis aagain) we will be able to comprehend the whole scale of
phonetic changes, which have metamorphosed inverted Hor-Gon basis in accordance with the
demands of different (in this case Latin and Serbian) IE languages. Above mentioned Serbian
<kotar> 'district' is known in the northern part of Serbia as <atar> 'area' and it sounds almost the
same as Hittite <hattar> 'cereal'. These examples are showing that the notion of 'circle' (Latin
May Be Illyrian may be Martian http://vukotic.atspace.com/alb.htm

cirkino, Greek kirkos/krigos, Serbian krug/kotur) has been very inspiring in sense of naming
different things in different IE languages.

Abdullah, as we can see from his above statement, tried again to introduce his Illyrian
confabulation as an undeniable fact. Unfortunately, Lubotsky and G. Starostin helped him to
advertise his national dream in their newest edition of Pokorny's PIE Dictionary. Namely,
Abdullah is "surprised" by seeing that -ĝh- > -d- phonetic mutation "could be found only in Av.
- Illyr.- Balt languages" (of course, an invented Illyrian is equal here to the compiled Albanian)
. In reality, Albanian <drithë> (grain) is a disguised loanword from Serbian <jedro> 'nucleus',
'core' or Greek <σιτηρά> (Lat. ador grain). On the other side, Albanian <drizë> 'thorny plant'
has nothing to do with the above "cereal" and "grain" words, because it was borrowed from
Greek - <ternax> 'stalk of the cactus' (cf. Serbian trn, English thorn)

______________________________________________

Page 12
ad(u)-, ad-ro- (*heĝhero)* JEZERO-
JEDRO-JEZGRO
English meaning: water current
Deutsche Übersetzung: “Wasserlauf”
Note: From Root ang (h)Wi- : ‘snake, worm” derived Root
akWā- (more properly ekWā): ēkW-: “water, river”; Root
eĝhero- : “lake, inner sea”; Root ad(u)-, ad-ro- : “water
current”: Illyr. pannon. VN Οσεριτες [common
Alb.-Illyr.-Balt -ĝh- > -d-, -z- phonetic mutation]. From
Root akWā- “water, river” nasalized in *akuent- (suffixed
in -er, -or) derived Root au(e)-9, aued-, auer- : “to flow, to
wet; water, etc.”
____________________________________________
My comment:

"What is the meaning of Abdullah's "common Alb.-Illyr.-Balt

-ĝh- > -d-, -z- phonetic mutation"? Did he ever hear about
the "common" Slavic kgh/czs palatalization? What a shame
for Lubotsky and G. Starostin; they allowed one uneducated
person to access Pokorny's PIE dictionary; doesn't matter if it
was electronic edition.
"Slavic <ozero>, <jezero> lake has its completely
transparent etymology in Slavic languages and I do not
understand that someone dares to say that such a word
belong to some confabulated (non-existent) Illyrian.
"I already told that Albanian name for lake (liqen) is
borrowed from Romance <lac>, while the words like
<vlagët> 'wet' and <baticë> (tide) are loanwords from
Serbian <vlaga> 'wetness' and <potok, potoci> 'brook,
stream' (Serbian 'poteæi' run off water). The Albanian words
<uje> 'water' and <shi> are specially interesting because in
both words the elision of initial sounds ('v' or 'k') is clearly
visible: Namely, Albanian 'uje' is Slavic <voda>, probably
acquired via Serbian 'piti/pojiti' (drink; Albanian pi, pije =>
uje; cf. Alb ujk wolf and Slavic volk/vlk/vuk, v-ujko) while
<shi> must be a shortened form of Serbian <KISHI> 'it's
raining'; it means that Albanians misheard that Serbian word -
SHI instead of KI-SHI. Finally there is Albanian <spërkatje>
borrowed from Italian <spruzzo> or Serbian <isprskati>
'splash'. We can see that there is not a single word in sense of
water that Albanians inherited from their Caucasian
motherland - just loanwords!
"In my previous message I wrote about the Serbian words
KRUG/KOTUR (circle) and I explained what happened and
how 'kotur' became 'jedro' (nucleus). There is another
Serbian word coming from the Gon-Hor basis - it is 'jezgro'
(same meaning as 'jedro'); it shows that the ancient Gon basis
was "laryngealized" and it first sounded as GoHn (wherefrom
German gehen). Thus we have got GeHn-Hor => Ges-Hor
=> geshero (like Icelandic geyser) => jezero (Slavic lake). I
would not be suprised if I hear that Abdullah is explaining
words like Latin cezar and German Keiser with the help of
his invented Illyrian and compiled Albanian. These words are
related to the word 'hunter'... but about it next time

________________________________________________

Page 16
May Be Illyrian may be Martian http://vukotic.atspace.com/alb.htm

Maybe nasalized Alb. (*an´ gas) ne¨kon´ j, Gheg angoj´ “groan, sigh, complain of pain, evil”
(*enq-); prove the link between Root agos- : [fault, guilt, blame, sin (damage, injury,
sacrilege, evil)] and Root enq-, onq- : (to sigh, groan) [see below] Note: It is possible Root
agos- (*hege-): “fault, sin, *blood guilt” is a zero grade of Lat. sangue “blood”, Alb. gjak
“blood” see Root s(u?)ek?o-s : ‘sap, pitch, *blood”.

________________________________________________________

My comment:

"First, Gheg <ankoj/angoj> is a reduced form of the verb <rënkoj> groan; and this word also
lost its initial velar, because <rënkoj> is borrowed from Serbian <groktanje> (grunting),
<graknuti> 'caw, croak' or from Italian <grugnito> grunt.

"This words are a good example that can help us to understand the way in wich the Albanians
were adopting the foreign words: often by elision of initial consonant and sometimes by
removing the whole first syllable (for instance, Albanian <vlagë> 'humidity' is a loanword from
Serbian <vlaga> 'humidity' and <vlagët> and <lagët> are words with the meaning 'wet' /Serbian
'vlažan'/; Albanian <udhëtoj> 'travel' from Serbian <voditi> 'lead', <udhëheq> 'guide' from
Serbian <vodic> 'guide'; Albanian <ujk> 'wolf' from Serbian hypocoristic form for wolf -
<vujko> 'wolf' (cf. Serbian surname Vujk-ovic); Albanian <grusht> 'fist', 'handfull' from Serbian
<pre-gršt> 'handfull' /from gruda, grozd lump: from KRUG circle/; most interesting seems to be
the Albanian word <shi> 'rain' from Serbian <ki-shi!> 'it rains'; from 'kisnuti' - triplicated Gon
syllable, like in Serbian 'nagoniti' (drive, to force); hence also Serb. <sneg> 'snow' and <snaga>
'power, force'.

There is another Albanian word with the meaning groan, sigh - it is <kërcitje> which
additionally proves that above-mentioned <ankoj> and <rënkoj> are the shortened forms of the
IE words like Serbian <krecati>, <kriknuti> 'cry.

"Albanian <gjakësi> 'murder' is clearly connected to the Albanian word for blood <gjak> and it
shows that this word has nothing to do with the IE root s(u)okW-o- (Serbian sok juice, juha
soup or Latin jus): it means that Albanian <gjak> is related to other Albanian words: <gjah>
'hunting, prey' and <gjahtar> 'hunter'; the fact is that Albanian <gjak> was derived from the
reduplicated Gon basis, as it happened to

"Latin 'jus' or Serbian 'juha' (soup), but the logic here was different because Albanian <gjak>
'blood' is transparently connected to the other Albanians words referring to murder <gjakësi>,
hunting <gjah> and <gjahtar> 'hunter'.

"Latin sanguis is related to the Serbian word <snaga> 'strength', 'power' and we can see it via
additional meanings of sanguis (blood- relationship, life-blood, strength, vigor); from
Sur-Gon-Gon basis; sur-tong => strong; sur-nonga => snaga; sur-gnuti => Serb. suknuti (a
sudden rapid flow, gush /water, smoke/; cf. Serbian kisnuti (get wet by rain) <=> suknuti (gush)

In one of his messages Abdullah wrote: "Dear Trond,

As you may have noticed, I was very tired from some other
non-pleasant posts. I will try to make some further
explanation about some place, folks, river and personal
names and from time to time to enlarge as much as possible
the list.

"Lets start from first entry: abhro- 'strong, mighty': 1a. Alb
afër 'close, near', cf O.C.S. blizь (r/l shift); b. afronj 'bring
close, squeeze', cf. Ltv. blaîzît ‘squeeze, clash, hit'. I will add
here freely Dardanian folk name (FN) Gal-abroi (Strabo,
Geographica, VII, 3,18) as well as Illyrian FN Abroi and
Thrac PN Abro-.*ab-/*ap- 'water, river'. 1. Alb amë 'river,
source', pl. emna, from *ab-no through -bn-/-mn- mutation;
amull 'backwater' derived from *akWa:-/*agWa;- through
the shift -gW- > -b-, -kW- > -p-, attested in Greek, Illyrian
and Celtic languages, as well as in some Albanian
derivatives, cf. Lat amnis 'river', Ir ab 'river' and Illyrian
place name Am-antia/Ab-antia, RN Am-ar, Am-ana (Krahe,
Beekes). It is to be notices m/b alternation like in other
words.

"Root *ades-/*ados- 'sort of cereal' evolved from an older

root *heg'h- 'a kind of grain' through phonetic mutation
-g'h- > -d- found only in Alb-Illyrian and Baltic languages,
cf. Alb dardhë ‘pear, pear tree’ from *Heg’hord- with
regular change -g’h- > -d- from full-grade *g’hord- and
Greek akhrados ‘wild pear’ Huld, BAE, page 48).
Botanically is proved that Dard-ania was the most suitable
region of growing of wild pear. There are many place
names with appellative dardhë ‘pear’ in Albania and
Dardania (now Kosova). So, till now, we have these
May Be Illyrian may be Martian http://vukotic.atspace.com/alb.htm

material: ABROI, GAL-ABROI, probably ABRO,

AM-ANTIA/AB-ANTIA, AM-AR, AM-ANA, DARD-ANIA that
could be explained with Albanian appellatives afr-onj, amë,
dardhë. We have as well –g’h- > -d- and –gW- > -b- and
-kW- > -p- mutation and m/b alternation.

***

Yes, as far as I know, -gW- > -b- and -kW- > -p- is regular
phonetic mutation on Greek, Celtic, Illyrian-Albanian, cf.
Rom apa 'water' from*akWa:- or Dardanian Ulkiana
(*wl.kWo-ana), besides Ulpiana or Alb umb 'small
polwshare' from * from *unkW-ni, zero-grade of *wekW-ni
(gW and kW - labiovelars).

Regards,
Konushevci

My comment was: "Thanks Abdullah!

Now I understand that the Serbian word 'luk' (arcus) is
derived from the English loop, or... it was vice versa - loop is
some kind of arc?
"Thanks for explaining me that Latin volpe (fox) was derived
from Slavic volk (wolf)! How else could I know that Serbian
verb ''ulivati' (to pour in) came from other Serbian word with
the almost same meaning - 'ulokati se' (booze); of course, we
just need a famous Abdullah's Shqip-Illyrian law ulk => ulb;
a miracle sound-change we have been waiting for
millenniums!

"Why do you not say people that Ulkiana is the name you
invented yourself. Would you be so kind to specify the
source where that, so-called Illyrian place, was mentioned
under the name Ulkiana.Maybe you thought Ullikana, a
Hawaiian tale!
"Try to google it: Ulpiana 30,800 Ulkiana; 58 (mainly
Albanian web pages); Books: Ulpiana 640, Ulkiana none(!)

Abdullah: Try Ulciana. It was my tipo.

My answer: "Maybe you think Portuguese province Luciana

(prefecture Ulciana)!

Again only Albanian web pages...

[...Po ky fenomen, sipas mendimit tim, do t'i ketë përfshirë
edhe emrat Ulcinium - Ulqin; Ulciana - Ulpiana të formuara
nga fjala ilire ulk e ruajtur edhe në shqipen po si ulk, ujk..]

Translated from Albanian: "But this phenomenon (wolf),

according to some opinions, includes also the names Ulcinum
- Ulqin; Ulciana - Ulpiana; from where the Albanian words
like ulk and ujk were [allegedly] formed...

Abdullah and other Albanian scientist are trying to say that

Albanian word 'ujk' (wolf) is derived from a certain Illyrian
word. Of course, Albanian 'ulk/ujk' is a clear derivative of the
Slavic volk (wolf). Nevertheless, the name of this city (Ulcinj,
Ulcinum) probably has not been connected with the name of
volk (wolf). Ulcinj is well-know after its numerous (coastal)
olive trees and it is more plausible that this city aquired its
name in accordance with the Serbian/Slavic word 'ulje' (oil)
or Latin oleum, olei; similar to the name Uljanik (island in
Croatia, also known after its Olive production).

"Finally, as we can see, it does not matter if Ulcinj (Lat.

Ulcinum) has got the name from 'volk' (wolf) or 'ulje' (oil),
because both words clearly belong to the Slavic vocabulary
(or Latin - oleum.olei).

"There is another possibility that Ulcinj was named by the

Slavic word 'luka' (port), for instance, Serbian 'uluèiti brod'
(bringing a ship into a port; luka comes from uvlaka bay;
uvlaèiti => uluèiti), but I do not know that Ulcinj ever was
an important port town.

________________________________________
May Be Illyrian may be Martian http://vukotic.atspace.com/alb.htm

Root gWher-

The phonetic shift gWh > zj took place in Alb. alone as a typical Alb. phonetic mutatIon.
Hence Slav languages borrowed Alb. (Illyrian) cognate in O.C.S. žeravъ “ blazing “, požarъ
“blaze”.Maybe other Alb. cognates: zjej “boil, cook”, zi adj., m.”black, burnt”, (duplicated
zezë adj., f. “black, burnt”. Also Alb.Tosk zjarr “fire, glow, heat, fervour “ : Rom. jar “fire,
glow, heat, fervour “ which proves the migration from Albania to Rumania after the Turkish
invasIon.Lat. formus “warm” (Festus), fornus, furnus (*gWhorno-s), fornāx “oven (latter in a
fem. āstembe ing based on), fornix, -icis “ dome“ (*fornicos “die Gestalt an Ofens habend”);

_________________________________________________________

My comment:

What to say about Abdullah's, G. Starostin's and Lubotsky's insolence? What to say about G.
Starostin's and A. Lubotsky's (un)wittingly negligence? Please my dear friends, would you mind
to read again this Abdulah's unbelievable statement. He says: "gWh > zj is typical Alb. phonetic
mutation... "HENCE SLAVIC LANGUAGES BORROWED ALBANIAN (ILLYRIAN)
COGNATE IN O.C.S." ŽERAV blazing, POŽAR blaze."

"Slavic žerav and žar are clearly and logically connected to the Common- Slavic root *gērъ or
common IE basis Hor-Gon (Serbian goreti burn, Czech vyhoøet burn down, Russian
горящий/garyashciy burning, Slovak horiet). Slavic žar and žerav are the words that were
derived from the lengthened basis Bel-Hor-Gon (Serbian pogoreti /burn down/; same as the
above Czech vyhoøet. It means that verb 'pogoreti' (burn down) gave the noun 'požar'
(palatalization) and 'žar' was a product of the reduction of the noun 'po-žar'. Once again:
POGORETI => POŽAR =>ŽAR and its later derivation ŽERAVICA.

"On the other side, we have no word in Albanian with the meaning of burning, that begins with
velar except (as far as I know) hi, hiri (ashes). Ash is the product of burning and if it is derived
from the IE root gWher- it means that it comes at the end of a logical process; burning begins
with fire and ends with ashes. Only in the heads of Albanian (Shqip-Illyrian scientists it looks
different - it starts in an inverted manner - first ashes and then fire!

Albanian djeg - burn (a borrowing form Slavic/Serbian žega; this word is derived from
reduplicate Gon basis - Serbian džagnuti, džagati, prodžagati (poke the fire); cf. Serbian žacnuti
(sting /like a bee/; in sense of burning); there are a great number of similar Gon derivatives in
Serbian like æušnuti, kucnuti, kuèiti, èuknuti, tuknuti/ taknuti/tuæi (all with the meaning close to
English kick); Irish dóigh burn, Lithuanian dagas fire, heat; Serbian žestok (furious, scorching);
žestoka vatra (wild fire), žestina (ardor, fervor, zeal), žiža (focus), žižak/žiška (ember) and
hundreds of other Serbian words which are clearly and logically interlaced. Of course this
analysis should also take in consideration words like German Tag, Serbian dan (day) and many
others from different European languages, but I have no time for this at the moment.
Nevertheless, above examples would be enough to understand that Albanian is the last language
in Europe that would be able to help us to understand the history of any (single) Indo-European
word. Why? Because Albanian is formed of loan words altogether... Greek, Latin (Italian,
Romanian) and Serbian

Albanian zjarr - fire (the word is borrowed from Slavic; there is no way that anyone can explain
the history of that word in Albanian; If you do not believe me - please ask Abdulah - he will
confirm my words).

tym - smoke (loan word from Serbian 'dim'; also word derived from reduplicated Gon basis (see
above-mentioned Irish dóigh and Lithuanian dagas burn, fire); in fact, dim came from the
Serbian/Slavic verb 'duhnuti/dunuti/dahnuti' blow, breathe; disati (breathe);

Molossia and Malesors

Abdullah wrote:
"Aleta (Ptoleme II, 15) not identified. Same suffix like in
royal Molosian name Alk-eta. Resemblance with Aletium in
Apulia is striking. A town Halata is in present Monte-Negro.
According to Krahe, the element al- appears also in city
name Al-eva, Al-eta in Sicilia (Ptol. 3,4), Al-etius, Venetian
person name; also Aletrium mons in Latium with identical
suffix like Illyrian Andetrium (see below). Variant forms
Al-ata, Nal-ata suggest that it may be related to PAlb nal-të
‘high (place, mountain)’. So, the root is probably *H2el- ‘to
grow’.(Pokorny 2. al- 26.)"
May Be Illyrian may be Martian http://vukotic.atspace.com/alb.htm

My comment:
"Abdullah probably never heard for a dog called Molosser
(name derived from Molossia, a country once located in
Western Greece). Molosser could be translated from Greek
as Black Mountain dog. Albanian Malësor has the same
meaning as Crnogorac or Montenegrin.
"I would like to see what alchemy Abdulah has used to
acquire the meaning 'high' from so-called PAlb nal-të; or it
happened so because the Greek word μελας/melas (black)
was misunderstood by the Albanians, MELAS-ORO/S
μελας/ορο-ς means BLACK MOUNTAIN in Greek and
Albanian MALESOR's real meaning is not "highlander" but
Black Highlander or Montenegrin.
"Present Republic of Montenegro (Serbian Crna Gora) is a
Black Mountain; the same Black Mountain exist in
Macedonia (Skopska Crna Gora) compared with Melas-oro
(also Black Mountain) in Greek. As we can see, only
Albanians and Albanian language missed BLACK MONTAIN
because of their inaptitude to understand foreign languages
(in this case Greek) properly.
"Actually, the Albanians adopted Greek μελας/MELAS,
"translating" it to their own 'mountain'. Finally, the logcial
question imposes itself: if the Albanians borrowed the Greek
MELAS (black) in order to name the mountains where they
were allegedly born, how can anyone talk about about
so-called Illyrian heritage in Albanian?
"It means: had the Albanians been the true natives of Balkan
they must have had their own (inherited) name for mountain.
Malisors (Greek melas oro/s) are the Black Mountaineers;
Crnogorci are the Black Mountaineers or Monte Negrins;
Greek Melas Oros (Black Mountain; Kara-dag in Turkish)
became Albanian Malisor (mountaineer); it is the way how
the Greek word melas (black) became Albanian "mountain".
"There is no borrowing from Albanian into Greek or any
other language in Balkan, simply, because Albanians were
colonized in Balkan during 12th century (in a small and
negligible number). It took them a few centuries to become a
real and recognizable nation.

_________________________________________________

Abdullah: "*ab-/*ap- 'water, river'. 1. Alb amë 'river, source', pl. emna, from *ab-no through
-bn-/-mn- mutation; amull 'backwater' derived from *akWa:-/*agWa;- through the shift -gW-
> -b-, -kW- > -p , attested in Greek, Illyrian and Celtic languages, as well as in some Albanian
derivatives, cf. Lat amnis 'river', Ir ab 'river' and Illyrian place name Am-antia/Ab-antia, RN
Am-ar, Am-ana (Krahe, Beekes). It is to be notices m/b alternation like in other words."

Dušan: "No, it is not truth! Compare Latin flumen, fluminis, and amnis and you will understand
whence comes the Albanian river (emna); Latin fluminis - amnis; Albanian lumë pl. lumenj =>
ame, emna. This words, both Latin and Albanian have nothing in commen with aqua or root
*akWa, because they were derived from the same source as English lake, Serbian plima (tide)
or Greek λίμνη (lake); compare Greek ληνός (trough) and Serbian oluk (trough) just for a little
brain gymnastics; Serbian plinuti (pour down), plimni (tidal)."

Abdullah: Root *ades-/*ados- 'sort of cereal' evolved from an older root *heg'h- 'a kind of
grain' through phonetic mutation -g'h- > -d- found only in Alb-Illyrian and Baltic languages,
cf. Alb dardhë ‘pear, pear tree’ from *Heg’hord- with regular change -g’h- > -d- from
full-grade *g’hord- and Greek akhrados ‘wild pear’ Huld, BAE, page 48). Botanically is
proved that Dard-ania was the most suitable region of growing of wild pear. There are many
place names with appellative dardhë ‘pear’ in Albania and Dardania (now Kosova). So, till
now, we have these material: ABROI, GAL-ABROI, probably ABRO, AM-ANTIA/AB-ANTIA,
AM-AR, AM-ANA, DARD-ANIA that could be explained with Albanian appellatives afr-onj,
amë, dardhë. We have as well –g’h- ..."

Dušan: Albanian dardhë is the borrowing from Greek άχερδος and you explained well the
phonetic changes g/h => d. Do you not see that Greek akherdos, Serbian kruška and Albanian
were derived from the same Hor-Gon basis or, to be more understandable, from the word which
denotes CIRCLE (Greek κρίκος, Serbian krug, Albanian rreth). And you are saying:
"Botanically is proved that Dardania was the most suitable region of growing of wild pear."
Using such childish logic I would also say that Dardani were Darodani (Slavic name Darodan)
and in Sebian 'darodan' or 'nadaren' means 'gifted' ; in Bulgaria Darodan is "the one who was
given as a gift" (Дародан - който е даден в дар).

Which one of these two crazy stories (your "pear-Dardanians" and my"gifted-Dardanians") is
May Be Illyrian may be Martian http://vukotic.atspace.com/alb.htm

more plausible? Do you not see a difference between folk-etymology and real science? I am
surprised that people (some of them are serious scientists or should be serious) on Sci.lang seem
to believe in your Cinderella's midnight runaway chariot and lost shoo. Ridiculous!

______________________________________________________

Page 25

OGANJ-JAGNJE-AGNUS
Note: The old laryngeal centum h- > a-, e- : satem h- > s- in PIE; only Alb. and Umbr. and
Slavic preserved the old laryngeal through Alb. h- > k- phonetic mutatIon. Alb.Gheg kinxh,
tosk (*egh-) qengj “lamb” : Umbr. habina(f) “ of a lamb “ : Lat. haedīnus “of a kid” : O.C.S.:
(j)agne “lamb” [common Alb. gh- > gl- > gj- : lith. gh- > dz- phoneticmutation]. Gk. (*agnos,
abnos) αμνος derived from an earlier *abnos “lamb” [common Gk. κW > p gW > b phonetic
mutation, later b > mb > m common Illyr.-Gk. phonetic mutation] Gk. αμνος m. f., αμνη f.
“lamb”; Lat. agnus, - ī, fem.-a “lamb” (agnīle ‘sheep stable”, lacking suffix affinity with
O.C.S. jagnilo“ place where the sheep lamb “, a derivative of the verb jagniti “to lamb");
O.Ir. ūan Welsh oen, O.Corn. oin, Bret. oan “lamb” (urk. *ognos with -gn- would have derived
from *-gWhn-, not-*gWn-, in spite of Pedersen KG. I 109-bn; o- probably influence from
*ouis ‘sheep”); O.E. ēanian, Eng. to yean “to lamb”, Dutch oonen ds. (from *aunōn from
*auna- = IE *agWhno-); O.C.S. (j)agne “lamb” (with formants-et- broadened around popular
names of young animals), (j)agnьcь “lambkins” contain fullgradatIon. Or is placed IE
*og(h)no- : to *egW(h)no-? Through the Gmc. and Celt. presumed voiced-aspirated also
would underlie the basis of Lat. and Slav. forms, so that Gk. αμνος (at first from *αβνος)
remains the only dependable indication in voiced-nonaspirated gW. If Umbr. habina(f) “ of a
lamb “ could be explained from intersection from *hedino- = Lat. haedīnus “of a kid” and
*abnīno- = Lat. agninus “of a lamb; f. as subst., lamb’s flesh”, however, would point Umbr. b
to voiced-nonaspirated. But maybe it has become gWh in Osc.-Umbr. to b. Note: Celtic
Illyrian concordances: common Illyr. -gW- > -b-, -d- : Alb. -gW- > -d- phonetic mutatIon.
__________________________________________________
My comment:

Is it possible that nobody is seeing that Slavic (j)agne (Czech jehnì, Russian ягненок, Bulgarian
агне; Serbian jagnje; Latin agnus) is closely related to the word 'oganj' (fire; Russian огонь,
Czech ohen; Serbian oganj; Latin ignis; Hettite agniš). I am suprised that all "clever" minds on
Sci. lang are not able (because of stupidity or something else) to understand that Abdullah (with
the help of Lubotsky and G. Starostin) is leading every one here by the nose.

1) Is there anyone who is able to explain what Abdullah thought when he said that "Slavic
preserved the old laryngeal through Alb. h- > k- phonetic mutatIon"? Did he mean that Slavic
had to be grateful to the compiled Albanian for its own existence?

2) He is also talking about "common Alb. gh- > gl- > gj" mutation; is there any phonetic
mutation that is not possible in Albanian? Which one of the Sci. lang wise guys could be able to
explain (or comprehend) Abdullah's gh => gl "common" mutation?

3) Do you really believe that Greek 'amnos' came from 'agnos' via 'abnos'? Please, would you
answer this question just to see how many fools we have on this forum?

4) No body in the world knows nothing about fucking "Illyrian"; the language that was
presumed from a dozen of words that have reached our time indirectly - through Greek or Latin.
Are you people without your own opinion and sound logic?

Go and read ALBANIAN: The Language of God and you will probably be able to understand
Abdullah's real intentions and Squip-Illyrian Paleo-Balkan dreams.
[...As Darwin's theory might be referred to as the 'language of nature', the Illyrian (Albanian)
language could be referred to as the 'language of god'...]

5) It seems that converted Slavs (as Konushevci) are showing more national zealotry than native
Shqipetars. Abdullah's Slavic kinsfolk are spread across the continent - even in Russia. Look for
yourself: [Konusevic] Конусевич, Е. Н. "Иван Серегеевич Тургенев." Литературное
обозрение, 1993, № 11/12, 4?10. T ? memoirs of him

_______________________________
All above notes are from the "updated" and "enhanced" Proto-Indo- European Etymological
Dictionary; A Revised Edition of Julius Pokorny’s Indogermanisches Etymologisches
Wörterbuch http://dnghu.org/ - "revised" and crippled by George Starostin and Alexander
Lubotsky.