The POVERTY of NATIONS

A CONVERSATION ABOUT USURY

CHRISTOPHER HAYDEN with ANTHONY MIGCHELS

MODUS ARTS GROUP

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Dedicated with all the sincere respect in the World to Bill Still.

MODUS ARTS GROUP Copyright 2014 a.d. All rights reserved.

PREFACE
Once in a while you learn something that changes everything. Everything you thought you knew, everything you will ever learn thereafter. This has happened to me a few times over the span of my life. In 2010 I was living alone in a small apartment in the Old North End of Burlington, Vermont. I had a nice laptop computer and a beautiful, flat-screen, high definition television which I was using as a second monitor. I discovered a website called justin.tv that featured dozens of channels of streaming video. These channels were really being uploaded to the site in real time by users located all over the planet. There were channels dedicated to specific television shows and others that were providing eclectic play-lists of documentaries about everything from science to history to economics. And so it was on one of those channels that I had the good fortune to discover the films of a contrarian economist named Bill Still. THE MONEY MASTERS and THE SECRET OF OZ opened my mind for the first time to the secret of the age our national monetary policy had been hijacked by private interests way back in 1913 with the advent of the so-called Federal Reserve Act. While I cannot even begin to summarize all the information contained in these revolutionary documentaries I can assure you, Dear Reader, that if that knowledge was made common to the citizenry of this country, we would have a revolution overnight, just as Henry Ford once asserted. Everyone should watch those films. At some point later I met an unconventional Dutch economist on Facebook named Anthony Migchels who publishes articles on his own website: REAL CURRENCIES (realcurrencies.wordpress.com) It turns out that Anthony too had first been introduced to this angst-ridden realm of thinking by the films of Bill Still. Over time I have gotten to know Anthony for the gentle and sincere Soul that he is. We have been connected as 'friends on Facebook for about a year at the time of this writing and from time to time we have chewed the fat on any number of social issues raging from the problems of bankster-usury to the subversive influence of Jewish cultural Marxism on our respective nations. Though we have agreed to disagree a myriad number of times, I respect Anthony as a person and a thinker and always enjoy his posts and comments.
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The following is a conversation we recently had within the realm of Mark Zuckerbergs Facebook (having only been lightly edited for spelling and grammar.) Enjoy! - CHRISTOPHER HAYDEN Burlington, Vermont April, 2014

ANTHONY MIGCHELS & BILL STILL

ANTHONY MIGCHELS : Jeepers people! Believe it or not, but it has finally happened! A best-selling book is FINALLY exposing the blatantly obvious in the mainstream: the rich get richer at the expense of everybody else..... because of capital gains on their invested money (Usury)! Capitalism is Usury and 'return on investment' is the extended version of interest on loans of money and unthinkable without it. Thomas Piketty is our hero! This book is not important because of any 'news', but because it reaches the mainstream and has a major impact with economists, the media, politicians and other influential people. The book does some painstaking quantitative analysis over centuries of tax returns and the data is hard. In this respect it is as useful as Helmut Creutz' fundamental work, who showed the same a few decades ago from Bundesbank figures.
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Bottom line: Capitalism and the 'trickle down economics' hoax is the typical Orwellian Ministry of Truth great turn around of 'trickle UP economics'. Next: Capitalism and its evil twin Marxism are the New World Order and the Jewish Question. Forget all the rest. INTEREST FREE MONEY NOW! ---------CHRISTOPHER HAYDEN : American legislators don't even read the Bills they vote into law - why would they be expected to read a 700 page book on something so important as ending slavery (usury) in our times? ---------ANTHONY MIGCHELS : Change only comes from a change of thinking in society Christopher. This is not a drop, but a bucket of water building the deluge that will sweep 'em all away. ---------CHRISTOPHER HAYDEN : So long as poor people are jailed for decades for a little pot but bankers get a pass for laundering billions for the drug cartels, so long as cops are hired for their low IQs and regulatory agencies are run by the executives of the corporations they are supposed to police, so long as people lay back in porn-fueled sexual intoxication while their last remaining rights are incrementally removed, the only 'change' we are going to see is the change for the worse that we are all drowning in already. ---------ANTHONY MIGCHELS : Absolutely, but these issues are all a direct consequence of Capitalism, which in turn is Usury and can only exist because of our worship of the rich as the prophets of Mammon. ---------CHRISTOPHER HAYDEN : 'Capitalism' has never been given a chance to function the way it is actually designed and this is due to the imposition of these Marxist central banks and the slight of hand that goes with them wherein interest is charged against the tax revenues of
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nations on fiat currencies that are produced out of thin air like rabbits from a hat. Yes 'capitalism' is a matter of Capital versus Labor and inequality is built into the system but what alternatives have we to choose from? As things stand we live in the shadow of Karl Marx and the Bolsheviks in every meaningful sense; surely you don't believe that 'Marxism' is a share the wealth program that just needs one more spin at the wheel to get it right this time? Communism is and always will be the most violent, the most cruel, the most inhumane, the most bloody path from capitalism to capitalism. End the Fed. Regulate banking and shrink that gorilla down to its rational proportions - no one deserves to gain the whole world simply for doing the bookkeeping. ---------ANTHONY MIGCHELS : In general I agree with this of course Christopher. But it's a common misconception to think of our current situation as some sort of failed Capitalism. It's not. Capitalism is exactly what it was intended to be. (Central) Banking is at the heart of Capitalism and unthinkable without it. The fact that the Marxists wanted it too is simply because Marxism is Capitalism on steroids. The first major central Bank was the Amsterdam Wisselbank, the core of the Dutch Empire, where Capitalism began. It migrated to Britain in 1688 after a failed attempt in the 1640's (Cromwell.) Both the 'glorious revolution' and Cromwell were basically Amsterdam/Jewish finance. The rest is history. People think of Capitalism as 'free markets'. But Ueber Capitalist Rockefeller simply put: 'Competition is sin' and Capitalism = Monopoly.
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What we want is interest free money with free enterprise. ---------CHRISTOPHER HAYDEN : Interest free? I'm not so sure. Until very lately I would have agreed wholeheartedly but I have been thinking about it and re-watching the Still films and reviewing some other materials (including Real Currencies.) At present I am contemplating an economic model that provides sound money while prohibiting governments from borrowing. I envision a fiat currency issued directly by the national government - the amount of which in circulation is dictated by production indexes and not manipulated by private 'elites.' When governments stop borrowing they stop paying interest - something they never should have been tricked into doing! But to dismiss all interest bearing debts in the commercial and private sectors seems irrational and ultimately counterproductive due to the beneficial mechanisms we can still salvage from, for instance, allowing nonfractional reserve lending of tangible REAL money which has been earned through REAL labor, saved in interest bearing bank accounts and then loaned at rational (relatively modest) interest rates. Caution must be mandated by law; in the United States one or more new Constitutional Amendments could be utilized to enshrine forever the chief pillars of this scheme. 1. No more private central banks. 2. No more private manipulation of the amount of money in circulation. 3. No more fractional reserve counterfeiting. 4. Specific and absolute rules for determining/adjusting the amount of money in existence based strictly on production indexes and NOT the whims of anyone. 5. Specific and absolute limits on interest rates. In my view, this should serve to level the playing field for all, eliminate mercenary monetary speculation and other economy-destroying gangsterisms and - finally - make money a tool for mankind rather than a club with which we beat each other.

(and

of course 6. The Jews must be rounded up and made to walk out onto the mud-flats at low tide like they did in Merry Olde England in the good old days when Christendom was still Christendom and Men were still Men.) Oi! I will even permit my countrymen to call it THE HAYDEN SCRIP ACT. If and when I pen my full manifesto I shall title it THE POVERTY OF NATIONS and dedicate it to Bill Still. In the meantime, I've got drinking to do....(Adam Smith was a pussy.)

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ANTHONY MIGCHELS : Now that Libertarianism is dead for people who still have one or two functioning braincells, this is where the money debate stands: Still, Zarlenga, Brown, Positive Money. They basically claim the problem is that money is private and that nationalization will solve it. Unfortunately they overlook that the State is not exactly a sugar daddy or very reliable partner. That the State has been owned by the Plutocracy since the days of Rome and Athens and probably Babylon itself already. Full Reserve Banking (lending 'real' savings) is a total hoax: who will do the saving? Well, the wealthy of course. It will be the people that will be borrowing. Thus Usury is not solved and both Money Scarcity and Plutocracy unavoidable. People often think Usury is not so bad if corporations are doing the borrowing. They will say, it's productive and the businesses can pay. They forget that the business will pass on these costs to the consumer, meaning you and me, while paying the interest to the rich. But: you'll only find this info on Real Currencies (and with MPE, although there are some other volume related issues there.)
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All the rest are dancing around the Usury issue elegantly, not wishing to insult the Jews and the ueberwealthy. ---------CHRISTOPHER HAYDEN : But full reserve lending isn't necessarily a hoax and I'll tell you why I think so - prior to (or perhaps concurrent to) the establishment of such an economic system the old one would be torn down and utterly destroyed. Everyone would be rounded up and driven out of the cities and into the rural wilderness to special political re-education camps where the rules and principals of the new system would be taught by inner-party political appointees selected by me personally. Individuals who 'get it' would then be processed back into the new society to begin the early stages of setting this new economic model into motion. (Of course I would have no time for groussers; those who 'don't get it' will fucking wish they had.) Everyone, upon their return to the free world and the free markets, would receive an equal share of the sum total of all assets and be assigned an equal share of the industrial and agricultural labor that the population would require to feed and cloth and house itself. The process would eventually result in a new and natural socio-economic hierarchy based on merit. I cannot guarantee elections for the first few years but as soon as the ball was rolling in the right direction I would step aside as High Lord Protector and permit the new Republic to run its natural course. I promise. ---------Compound interest lending would ANTHONY MIGCHELS : immediately restart and in no time messing up the whole thing again. Here, I'd really like you to read this, because this is a short article about it and my 'definitive' answer to it. If you still are not convinced it is pleasant to the Money Power, than I'll give you a fair hearing, ok?

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Forget about Full Reserve Banking

by Anthony Migchels
A large number of monetary reform proposals include Full Reserve Banking. However, the Money Power will continue to control the money supply in this scheme. The problem is not credit creation, but whos in control and what is he doing with that control. Getting rid of Usury is the main issue. The Greenback, Social Credit, Positive Money, Austrian Economics, the Chicago Plan and undoubtedly many more propose full reserve banking. There is a general dislike of Fractional Reserve Banking. The idea is, that money through bookkeeping is unfair. We have always believed that we borrow from savers. Because of this programming, we instinctively want to repair the situation by making it what we always thought it was. And this is a grave misunderstanding: the problem is not credit creation, its interest. When we calculate that a mortgage at 5% over thirty years costs 150% of the principal in interest, we can easily see that this has nothing to do with costs for the bank. Managing such a risk free loan over thirty years should never cost more than 10% of the principal. Interest on mortgages which are created by bookkeeping are wholesale plunder. The bank doesnt risk anything anyway, since there is the house as collateral. To say housing is under water today is not a valid argument: the banks create the boombust cycle themselves. Rational monetary management would not know sudden changes in prices, save for massive disaster. Only a few hundred years ago, when Usury prohibition was already on the wane, a combination of collateral and interest was unheard of. It was either the one, or the other. But to say then, that we will solve it by ending double entry bookkeeping? Shouldn t we just end the usury on the bookkeeping and let the credit facility take a small one off percentage as a handling fee to cover its costs? Double entry bookkeeping knows credit and debit by nature. The key issue to understand is that it is not the banks credit, its ours. We give each other credit. The credit is mutual. We allow each other to buy now and pay later. The bank only does the bookkeeping. In the current paradigm the bank has usurped this credit and is extorting us through interest on it. Consider it for yourself: would you prefer to continue to pay $300k interest over a $200k mortgage to savers and a bank, or would you prefer to pay 0% interest to a credit facility?
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Case closed. The Money Power is comfortable with Full Reserve Banking Of course the right to create credit must be taken away from the Money Power and its banks. We cannot allow them continued control, even without Usury. Theyd continue to boom/bust the hell out of us. Thats another problem with Full Reserve Banking: its still, well, banking. We need to get rid of banking altogether. This in itself is an important point. No real monetary reform is thinkable while leaving the Banks alive: a vampire will not lose its tricks. It was bred to suck blood. It will always look to reassert domination. This problem shows also with Full Reserve Banking: the banks would regain full
control over the entire money supply in a short while.

Should we replace our current money by spending into circulation a batch of debt free money, the Money Power would quickly get a hold of a sizable chunk of that batch. Both through its own wealth and income of its Transnationals. It would then start lending this money out at interest in her banks that have switched to Full Reserve Banking. It would then continue to not spend, but lend their profit through interest back into circulation. Thus, through compound interest, the entire money supply would end up again with the Plutocracy within a few years. The Money Power cares not whether it gets its interest through Fractional Reserve Banking or Full Reserve Banking. It cares not whether it is paid in paper or in coin. The Money Power cares about the Trillions in interest it rakes in yearly. Conclusion The IMF is discussing it openly and positively. Gold based full reserve banking is the classical Austrian approach. Why? Because it is does not touch Usury. Thats why the talking heads of the Mainstream are always talking about debt, debt, debt. They even talk about burning creditors. But never about stopping interest payments. While even Greece could pay off its entire national debt in 20 years just with what it loses to debt-service now. Usury is the heart of the matter. Full Reserve Banking does not end it. Interest-Free Credit by bookkeeping does.

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CHRISTOPHER HAYDEN with the big big big money.... CHRISTOPHER HAYDEN : Well I did read that just now and I have read it before as well. I agree with the basic ideas you present and it is for the very reasons enumerated there that I believe whole-heartedly that no amount of 'adjustment' will solve the core problems that lie in the heart of the beast we can certainly agree to call Economic Injustice; in other words, trying to solve these problems in strictly economic terms via strictly economic measures is futile. I know it is probably hard to believe or even imagine given my gentle nature and sweet disposition but I once spent a series of months in the prison system here in Vermont, USA. In that closed and controlled environment I learned two things in copious amounts - the law as it applies to inmate issues and economics as it exists in the jungle. Cash was not allowed inside the jail and any money you had was 'on your books' to be spent on commissary items; you could still buy tobacco back then and thus the ubiquitous cigarette became the basic unit of currency. Commissary was passed out once a week and even prisoners who did not smoke would buy cigarettes for the express purpose of loaning them out at various rates of exchange. 2 for 1 was the usual rate - you give me a cigarette now and I give you back 2 on commissary day. But once in a while commissary did not come through on schedule and the rate would skyrocket. 3 for 1. 5 for 1. When the D.O.C. switched commissary vendors the delay lasted over three
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weeks and even a small scrap of tobacco might trade on the blackmarket exchange for a promise of a whole pack. With cigarettes you could buy anything else - food, clothes and yes, my services as a ad hoc para-legal. (I had the best hustle in the house and would often give away more cigarettes than I could smoke in any given week.) I am telling you all this to explain to you that 'economics' is not a science or even a philosophy. It is the manifestation of the intrinsically human impulse to turn a profit. The microcosm of that jail and the macro of today's global marketplace run by the same scalable rules. Supply and demand. And while inmate X may have a box full of cigarettes and thus be able to corner the market on Ramen soups or running shoes, he is always and at all times at the mercy of non-commercial factors; brute force, cunning, thievery. Any of these might come into play and reduce Mr. Rockefeller X to a broke ass bitch with a black eye. You might think that usury is not commerce (as Mohammed (PBUH) stated explicitly) and you would be correct to assert it. But neither finance nor commerce are the capstone of human social intercourse. At all times much more crude and atavistic forces are at play. The law of the jungle. Ban usury and the loan sharks will pop up everywhere just as surely as banning alcohol will bring the bootleggers. Regulate and govern it as I suggested and you will deny the savages their monopoly just as surely as legalizing drugs would put the cartels out of business in a day. The only other option is to create a government of such absolute force and violence that not even the Gotti's and the Capone's would dare cross the street against the light much less get caught up in graft and vice. Can't you see that? The World may indeed be a laboratory but the laboratory is not the World. The jungle is. The most we can hope to do is temper it. The jungle isn't evil. Men are. The jungle doesn't care; it just is - just because. "My Kingdom is not of this World." - JESUS CHRIST
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ANTHONY MIGCHELS : Well, we can most assuredly agree that only Christ can save. That much is clear and we must first find the Kingdom
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of Heaven before we can hope to begin to manifest it in the World and thus end Babylon. But ending Usury WILL solve exactly the problems that you describe, also that of force, etc. Because Usury in itself is the ultimate Weapon of Mass Destruction. Nothing adds more to their might, nothing gnaws away at our life force at such scale. Usury is the main cause of Money Scarcity and all artificial scarcity, because all scarcity is artificial because money is scarce: money is the gateway to resources. A usury free economy will see abundant money and therefore labor will become the scarce factor in production, instead of money. ---------ANTHONY MIGCHELS :A Usury Free economy is the basis of Christian economics. Of the manifestation of his Kingdom. It is the way to tap into God's abundance. ---------CHRISTOPHER HAYDEN : Formally legislating against ANYTHING rarely if ever results in its obliteration. And you know this. ---------ANTHONY MIGCHELS : Yes, that is an important point! We don't get rid of Usury by outlawing it. We get rid of it by making it superfluous. If we offer 0% credit for most credit requirements, than nobody will be any longer dependent on the rich and their banks. ---------CHRISTOPHER HAYDEN : It is a wonderful privilege to pick your mind on these matters, Anthony. And in that spirit I want to ask you this - how could currency have any value if everyone could borrow as much
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of it as they want whenever they want for whatever they want? I know you never said that. And so the problem remains - people in the system you seem to be promoting would have to be limited by their 'credit rating' or 'anticipated income based on recent earnings' as to how much of this magical interest-free currency they could drop by the bookkeeper's storefront and borrow for no more than the price of their signatures on the Promise to Pay; and that is to say nothing of the availability of said funds. It seems to me that the REAL value of said currency would evaporate if it was not strictly tied to and thus limited in its quantities to the TANGIBLE and REAL (such as production indexes.) Thus usury will never really be 'superfluous' because there will always be people and companies that want or even need to borrow more money into circulation than your system could provide without defeating itself in suicidal inflationary issuance. And so we arrive back at the place we have never really left - a world where the government forbids usury and hunts and imprisons the 'predatory lenders' who will sprout up by the natural laws of man and the jungle to feed the demand for more money than an interest-free economy can permit itself to issue and still remain vital. It is clear to me that if there were a truly interest-free currency system it would as a practical matter really be manifested by the absence of money; in other words a barter system with all the insufferable encrumbrages that entails. And as I have already demonstrated with my prison economy analogy, when you take away paper or coin currency (or tally sticks even) you instantly create a vacuum that will just as instantly be filled by some tradable, tangible ad hoc unit of currency (such as a cigarette.) Sure the Department of Corrections forbids all this illicit trade but the bitter reality is this - when you borrow a cigarette in the Big House you pay back two - on time - or you go live in protective custody. C'est ne pas? (Don't drop the soap.)

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DAVID MITCHELL as MARK CORRIGAN in the BBC television comedy PEEP SHOW

"...and listen, while we're at it, there are systems for a reason in this world. Economic stability. Interest rates. Growth. It's not all a conspiracy to keep you little boxes, all right? It's only the miracle of consumer capitalism that means your not lying in your own shit, dying at 43 with rotten teeth and a little pill with a chicken on it is not going to change that. Now come on, fuck off!" - MARK CORRIGAN

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