USA v. Bruno Howard Bennett Testimony

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Bennett - Direct - Coombe
1 H O W A R D B E N N E T T,
2 having been duly sworn by the Clerk of the Court, was
3 examined and testified as follows:
4 DIRECT EXAMINATION
5 BY MS. COOMBE:
6 Q Good morning, Mr. Bennett.
7 A Good morning.
8 Q Could you please introduce yourself to the ladies
9 and gentlemen of the jury?
10 A Yes. I'm Howard Bennett and I'm a retired
11 official of Teamsters Local 294 in the Albany area and
12 International Union of the IBT.
13 Q When did you become a member of the IBT?
14 A Oh, that goes back to 1954.
15 Q And how long were you a member of the Teamsters?
16 A Forty-four, 43 years.
17 Q Can you describe generally for us what Local's 294
18 membership was comprised of?
19 A Well, when I came in the '60s and '70s, the
20 members of the Local extended itself to six or seven
21 thousand members employed in various crafts and industries
22 throughout the Capital Region and it stayed large like that
23 until, I would say, in the eighties, we started to lose a
24 little bit, but other than that, it was a very vibrant -- we
25 had a very vibrant membership.
THERESA J. CASAL, RPR, CRR

UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT - NDNY
41
1 Q Now, you mentioned you were an officer of
2 Local 294?
3 A Yeah. I was a business agent for some years and I
4 was getting elected periodically, every three years, to that
5 post. Then, back in the '80s, I ran for the post of
6 secretary/treasurer of the Local union and was successful in
7 that and maintained the secretary/treasurer's post for a
8 number of years. And the time came where the former
9 president retired and I ran unopposed to become the first
10 president and principal officer of the Local union.
11 Q Was Local 294 ever affiliated with any kind of
12 labor council?
13 A Yes. We had -- under the structure of the
14 International Union, we were part of what is called
15 Teamsters Joint Council 18. That consisted of the upstate
16 Locals, we had roughly eight Locals from Utica, Elmira,
17 Syracuse, Rochester, New York, and added recently the
18 Buffalo region. So we were about -- in those days, we had
19 eight, I think, six or eight legislators who gathered
20 together on a monthly basis and we talked about our issues
21 relating to the industries that we represented in the state
22 of -- upstate New York area and gathered together to solve
23 our problems where we could.
24 Q Now, during the 1990s, did you have any leadership
25 role with the Joint Council 18?

42
1 A Well, I was doing some legislative work for the
2 council, and among other local unions, we would gather
3 together on various local issues dealing with the health and
4 welfare of our organization and attempt to keep an eye and
5 watch dog on what labor legislation was coming forth here in
6 the State of New York and make sure that we would be heard
7 if such issues came up where we were concerned with it
8 affecting our organizations negatively.
9 Q Did you have any role with the New York State
10 AFL-CIO?
11 A Yes. I was -- became Vice President of the
12 AF of L-CIO in the '90s and maintained that role until I
13 retired from the Teamsters and a new Teamsters Vice -- new
14 Teamsters official became the AFL-CIO Vice President.
15 Q Did you ever have a role as special assistant to
16 the general president?
17 A Yes. When Carey (phonetic) became general
18 president, there came a time when he asked me to join the
19 International Union, actually to be a permanent basis, but I
20 elected not to give up my local affiliation. But in any
21 event, I did agree to become the special assistant to the
22 general president for labor activities in the State of New
23 York, legislative activities and other details and duties
24 that he would assign to me, such as becoming a trustee for
25 Locals that weren't doing well in the state or in the

43
1 country, I would go out there, among others perhaps, and
2 supervise them and put them back on track.
3 Q As a union official, did you ever interact with
4 any New York State officials?
5 A Yes. We had ongoing relationships with various
6 both Republican and Democratic State officials so we could
7 again keep an eye on the legislative activities which were
8 beneficial to us.
9 Q Mr. Bennett, can you give us any examples of any
10 legislative achievements that you obtained during the 1990s
11 toward the end of your time at the Teamsters?
12 A Yes. One of the key issues that came to us and
13 complaints we were getting from our members, particularly
14 those truck drivers in the general freight industry and
15 others, about the unfairness they felt at being given
16 tickets for what is called overweight violations. In other
17 words, drivers, even if they did not own the equipment, and
18 they would go out in their daily work, were not necessarily
19 know in that field what the weight of the trucks were, we
20 felt that would be the obligation of the owners of the
21 equipment to make sure that the law was being followed as
22 far as to the weight of these trucks going over the
23 highways. When lo and behold we were getting these
24 complaints from our people that, hey, I'm getting -- the
25 fine is being paid by the owners of the equipment, perhaps,

44
1 but we're getting written up on points against our driving.
2 So, I reviewed that and I was somewhat concerned,
3 so I went to -- the Chairman of the Transportation
4 Department of the Democrats at that time, was Mike Bragman,
5 he was the -- since retired. And also Norm Leavy
6 (phonetic), who then represented the Senate in the
7 transportation department. And I sat down and talked with
8 them directly about what we felt the unfairness of it and
9 could we -- would they consider working with us in those two
10 committees to perhaps get that law corrected.
11 So, we did and they agreed to me, after reviewing
12 the concerns with me about the concerns we had, that perhaps
13 we had merits to our claim about getting that part of the
14 DMV revised. And so we attempted the first year, we were
15 not successful. The second year I'm not sure now, it was
16 ready to go, then somebody dropped in a ticket not to put it
17 through and it didn't. But, finally on the third shot, we
18 did get the law changed, and at that time, with the law
19 being changed, I remember then-Governor Mario Cuomo had a
20 gathering in the blue room and we had a very nice ceremony,
21 as is the case with these kinds of bills that come up, and
22 he signed into law certain changes to give relief to our
23 drivers and to anybody else, obviously, in society who were
24 not even part of the drivers for equipment like that that I
25 talked about.

45
1 Q Can you give us any other examples of legislative
2 achievements from the 1990s?
3 A Well, we were involved with other unions and
4 legislative activities with the riding herd on the Workmen's
5 Compensation bills. We were always very concerned about
6 laws to at least soften up the protection of workers in
7 those fields and we stayed very close to those activities
8 and always watching the activities there. When time
9 permitted, I would go down to the State buildings when the
10 session was on and sit in on the labor, transportation or
11 the regular labor committee hearings for both sides, either
12 Democratic or Republican to make sure that our interests
13 were being, you know, being watched in those areas. There
14 was also in the health and welfare field, too. It goes back
15 so many years now that my memory has faded somewhat.
16 Obviously, other activities, but many varied. Helping other
17 unions, communication workers, joining with them with the
18 hotel and restaurant workers, related to their activities
19 and helping them protect their workers and labor legislation
20 in general. So, it was an overall package of things that we
21 would do.
22 Q And I take it these are just some examples, there
23 were other issues, legislative issues of interest to the
24 Teamsters that you were involved with in the 1990s?
25 A Pretty much in the general area I have given.

46
1 Regretfully, I can't, off the top of my head, remember back.
2 Some of the highlights I remember, but some of it is faded
3 into my memory at the time.
4 Q And just for the end of my question, the 1990s?
5 A Okay.
6 MS. COOMBE: May I have a moment, your Honor?
7 THE COURT: Please.
8 (Pause in proceedings.)
9 MS. COOMBE: Your Honor, the Government moves the
10 admission of the following exhibits: GD-8, GD-9, GD-5, and
11 GD-10.
12 MR. DREYER: No objection, your Honor.
13 THE COURT: Admitted.
14 (Government's Exhibits GD-5 and GD-8
15 through GD-10 received.)
16 MS. COOMBE: May I approach, your Honor?
18 BY MS. COOMBE:
19 Q Mr. Bennett, I'm showing you what's been marked as
20 Government Exhibits GD-8 --
21 A Yes.
22 Q -- and GD-9. Could we please look at GD-8? This
23 is a letter from yourself to Senator Bruno dated August 1st
24 of 1997. And the first sentence states, "The New York State
25 AFL-CIO has clearly stated our position in reference to

47
1 proposed workfare legislation as one of two Teamsters Vice
2 Presidents of that body. I have carefully reviewed this
3 legislation and would ask you to further review some five
4 areas of the Governor's proposal."
5 What was the issue regarding workfare legislation?
6 A Sorry, my hearing is not so --
7 Q Sorry. What was the issue regarding workfare
8 legislation?
9 A Well I'm tryin' to think back now what that issue
10 really was, it's so long ago, but it was -- certainly we
11 would rather have them get benefits and just the welfare
12 checks or the vouchers, as stated. In other words, it was
13 to give those less fortunate additional protection in that
14 area. We felt collectively that we joined the AFL-CIO in
15 supporting that program because it was a program for average
16 working people in the state. Those less fortunate, perhaps
17 you could use that term.
18 Q Could we please look at GD-9, the other document
19 that I gave you, Mr. Bennett? And this is a fax cover
20 sheet, it indicates that it was sent from Teamsters 294,
21 that was your Local?
22 A Yes.
23 Q From you to Miss Pat Stackrow in Senator Bruno's
24 office. Mr. Bennett, did you ever interact with Senator
25 Bruno regarding any legislative issues?

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1 A I think mostly we would be dealing with his
2 representatives, fella named Rick, and things, people of
3 that nature. Once or twice I may have had some discussion
4 on matters that you have mentioned now, but mainly it was
5 done through his representatives.
6 Q How would you describe your relationship with
7 Senator Bruno?
8 A Oh, I think it was, among other labor leaders, was
9 a fine relationship.
10 Q Under what circumstances did you normally see
11 Senator Bruno?
12 A Well, I would see him certainly as the legislation
13 was going on, and it would be up on one issue or another in
14 the lounge up there, seeing him from time to time in the
15 State Capital. Or we would certainly see him at an
16 occasional gathering once a year on a fund-raising type of
17 program that would be put on. And we would join other labor
18 representatives, those who were supporting the Senator in
19 his legislative elections and play our part in that.
20 Q Did your relationship with Senator Bruno make it
21 possible for you to schedule meetings with him and his staff
22 when necessary to discuss legislative issues?
23 A I feel it would be -- yeah, that we would be given
24 that courtesy to do that.
25 Q While you were president of Local 294, did Local

49
1 294 have a pension fund?
2 A Yes.
3 Q Were you a trustee for that fund?
4 A Yes.
5 Q And there were other trustees as well?
6 A Yes.
7 Q Did there come a point in time when your pension
8 fund decided to pool its fund with other Teamsters pension
9 funds?
10 A Yes.
11 Q What was the name of the new fund?
12 A The Upstate Teamsters Pension and Welfare Funds,
13 New York State. New York State Teamsters Health and Welfare
14 Funds.
15 Q Was it health and welfare or pension and
16 retirement?
17 A And pension as well.
18 Q Were you a trustee of the new funds?
19 A I became a trustee of the new funds, yes.
20 Q Did you ever talk to Senator Bruno about a company
21 called Wright Investors' Services?
22 A Yeah, there came a time when I was out of state,
23 either at meetings or down on a few days' vacation in
24 Florida, and I came back and my secretary always handed me
25 my telephone calls I needed to respond to, and one was from

50
1 Senator Bruno's office, could we meet. And so subsequently,
2 I returned a call and made arrangements to meet with the
3 Senator at Jack's restaurant for lunch.
4 Q What did you two talk about?
5 A Well, we sat and talked about general issues of
6 our interest at that time. I believe the International
7 Union was going for some activities on the national level
8 and we talked about the general welfare of the State and he
9 brought up about Wright Investors. So I mentioned -- the
10 conversation got around that, yes, we were considering
11 replacing one, two, perhaps three of our investment fund
12 people, 'cause the yields obviously we were not happy with,
13 and we're putting out bids for new people.
14 Q Now, let's back up a little bit. What did Senator
15 Bruno say to you about Wright?
16 A Well, that Wright Investors were interested, words
17 and substance to that effect, of becoming part of the funds
18 to invest for us.
19 Q And what did you say?
20 A I said, "Remember, that particular item, Joe, if
21 their track record and past experiences with the clients
22 that they have and that they stack up financially, they
23 stack up after review by our professionals and we get a good
24 report from 'em, why, yes, certainly they would be given
25 consideration to become part of the funds."

51
1 Q Did Senator Bruno tell you that he had a business
2 relationship with Wright?
3 A No. No. Never got into that kind of
4 conversation, no.
5 Q Now, if there were legislative issues of interest
6 to the Teamsters at the time of your lunch, would you have
7 raised them with Senator Bruno?
8 A Would I have -- I'm sorry.
9 Q Right. If there were legislative areas of
10 interest that were going on at the time you had this lunch
11 with Senator Bruno, would you have raised those legislative
12 issues with him?
13 A I might have raised 'em casually, but probably, in
14 all candor, no. I was there specifically on the
15 conversation that we had, were just that, there was no quid
16 pro quo there.
17 Q Right. Actually, Mr. Bennett, do you remember
18 testifying in the grand jury here?
19 A Yes.
20 MS. COOMBE: Page 33, lines 10 through 14. May I
21 approach, your Honor?
23 BY MS. COOMBE:
24 Q Mr. Bennett, I'm handing you your grand jury
25 transcript.

52
1 A Sure.
2 Q And I am going to refer you to page 33.
3 MR. DREYER: What was the line number you were
4 gonna start with?
5 MS. COOMBE: Line 10ten.
6 Q Did I ask you this question, Mr. Bennett, during
7 the grand jury, line ten:
8 Question, "Now if there had been issues of
9 interest at the time, legislative issues, then it would have
10 been natural to talk to him about them?"
11 Answer, "I would have made it a point to bring it
12 up, yes."
13 A Yes.
14 Q Did I ask you that question and did you give that
15 answer?
16 MR. DREYER: It's not inconsistent, your Honor.
17 THE COURT: That's a determination the jury will
18 make. I understand the nature of the objection. It's
19 overruled.
20 Q Mr. Bennett, did you tell anyone about your lunch
21 with Senator Bruno?
22 A I'm sorry, my hearing is not well.
23 Q I will try and enunciate more clearly. Did you
24 tell anyone about your lunch with Senator Bruno?
25 A After I got back into one of our monthly meetings

53
1 in the Syracuse office, I did discuss the meeting that I had
2 with Senator Bruno that had raised a question of any
3 interest in Wright Investors, and I said, "I told 'em just
4 as you people would expect from me, that if their records
5 were sound and you investigated 'em, checked back and their
6 track record was fine on the financial end, we should give
7 them consideration."
8 Q What was the reaction of your colleagues that you
9 told?
10 A They were really enthusiastic. The history of
11 Senator Bruno's record on labor issues, and issues in
12 general, were well known across the state, as I understood
13 from talking with my colleagues from Syracuse, Utica and so
14 on, that they were -- knew his record with labor was good.
15 That if the funds -- if his people met the standard, Wright
16 Investors, that they should be given equal opportunity as
17 anybody else might be for becoming part of the fund program.
20 BY MS. COOMBE:
21 Q Mr. Bennett, I'm showing you Government Exhibits
22 GD-4 and GD-5. I am going to start with GD-4. These are
23 minutes of the meeting of the pension fund of the Albany
24 area Trucking and Allied Industries Local 294 held on
25 June 28th of 1994. If we could look a little farther down,

54
1 please. Do you see the trustees present were, and the first
2 one listed is yourself, Mr. Bennett?
3 A Trustees, yes, those were trustees.
4 Q And if we could turn to page 2, do you see the
5 paragraph at the bottom that says Wright Investors'
6 Services, do you see where I am, Mr. Bennett?
7 A Yes.
8 Q And that indicates that Mr. Singer and Mr. Smith
9 of Wright Investors' Services made a proposal during the
10 meeting?
11 A Yes.
12 Q Okay. And if we could please turn to page 3,
13 do you see that part about the motion that's indented on
14 page 3, Mr. Bennett? It says, "Motion was made, seconded
15 and unanimously adopted to allocate 33 percent of the assets
16 of the pension fund to Wright Investors' Services"?
17 A Yes.
18 Q Could you please now look at GD-5, the other
19 document that I just brought up to you, Mr. Bennett?
20 A Yes.
21 Q And you see that this is -- do you have that in
22 front of you?
23 A Um-hum.
24 Q There's not much room up there, is there?
25 A Beg your pardon?

55
1 Q There's not much room up there, is there?
2 A No.
3 Q This is a letter of governing instructions for
4 Wright Investment Management, dated August 23 of 1994.
5 Could you turn to the last page, please, Mr. Bennett? It's
6 Exhibit Number GD-5. And could we turn to the page before
7 that, actually? Do you see that there's a signature there
8 and do you recognize that signature, Mr. Bennett?
9 A Yes. That's my signature and Mr. Clemente's
10 signature, the employer representative.
13 BY MS. COOMBE:
14 Q Mr. Bennett, I'm handing you Government's Exhibit
15 GD-10, okay?
16 A Okay.
17 Q Mr. Bennett, these are minutes of a New York State
18 Teamsters conference pension and retirement fund meeting
19 held on December 1st of 1997 in Syracuse, New York. In
20 attendance were trustees, Howard Bennett, and you're listed
21 there as the second trustee?
22 A Yes.
23 Q Could you turn to page 3, please and do you see
24 that there's a title report by Peter Carre. Who was
25 Mr. Carre, or is it Mr. Car (phonetic), how do you pronounce

56
1 it?
2 A Mr. Car (phonetic).
3 Q Who was Mr. Carre?
4 A Mr. Carre was a representative on the funds for
5 the unions and then a practicing attorney, I do believe,
6 too. Had his own company, as it states here, Independent
7 Fiduciary Services.
8 Q I would like to direct your attention to the
9 fourth sentence, where it says, Messrs. Carre and Lilly
10 reviewed the issues concerning the balanced managers
11 inherited from the 294 fund as part of the merger. It was
12 recommended that the fund no longer use balanced managers.
13 After a thorough discussion and review, upon motion duly
14 made and seconded, the trustees unanimously resolved to
15 terminate MD Sass as a manager immediately and have the
16 assets liquidated transferred to Wright Investors' Services
17 Finest 50 portfolio and to have Wright Investors convert
18 their portfolio to their Finest 50 portfolio promptly and
19 invest the proceeds from the same portfolio in the Finest 50
20 as well."
21 Mr. Bennett, did you know if Senator Bruno was
22 paid by Wright?
23 A No, I didn't know any of his personal
24 relationships with the company.
25 Q If Wright's performance numbers had not been

57
1 adequate, was it your understanding and did you believe you
2 could decide not to hire Wright even though Senator Bruno
3 approached you about Wright?
4 A Yes. I believe that would be the case. It would
5 be our fiduciary responsibility to see the funds were
6 managed correctly and properly and that we would certainly
7 have discussion with all the trustees and our professional
8 fiduciary money managers, 'cause we're not paid, trustees of
9 the fund. That was inappropriate under federal law. We
10 couldn't get paid for our services, trustees. So, we had
11 full-time money managers on staff for those particular
12 reviews. And yes, I would have. If we had to tell Wright
13 Investors, "sorry, we can't use you anymore," that would be
14 it and they would be replaced.
15 Q Now, all things being equal, to the extent
16 Wright's numbers were adequate, did you prefer to give the
17 business to Wright because of Senator Bruno's affiliation
18 with Wright?
19 MR. DREYER: Objection.
20 THE COURT: I need to hear the question again.
21 I'm sorry.
22 (Record read back.)
23 A Certainly would not --
24 THE COURT: Hang on, the objection is overruled.
25 Now you can answer.

58
1 A We would -- no, we would be pleased that he got
2 the work because we know his track record as a legislator.
3 Q Did you have any concern that if the numbers from
4 Wright's performance were good and you said no, that that
5 might have some affect on your relationship with Senator
6 Bruno?
7 A No. No. I think that would have no effect
8 whatsoever.
9 MS. COOMBE: Page 40, lines 16 to 23.
10 BY MS. COOMBE:
11 Q Mr. Bennett, do you still have your grand jury
12 transcript up there?
13 A I'm sorry?
14 Q Do you still have your grand jury transcript up
15 there?
16 A Yes.
17 Q Could you please turn to page 40?
18 A Right. Okay.
19 Q Line 16, did I ask you this question. My question
20 is, "Did you have any concern if the numbers were good and
21 you said no, that that might have some affect on your
22 relationship with Senator Bruno?" Answer, I would have had
23 to have said no to him and I would be concerned that the
24 accessibility may or may not have been there for us in the
25 future, correct."

59
1 Did I ask you that question and did you give that
2 answer?
3 A Apparently, I did, yes, at that time.
4 MS. COOMBE: Your Honor, the Government moves the
5 admission of this pursuant to the -- to the rules as
6 substantive evidence, both this and the other excerpt I've
7 read during this witness' testimony.
8 THE COURT: I reserve.
12 BY MS. COOMBE:
13 Q Mr. Bennett, I'm handing you Government Exhibit
14 GC-12 and I am gonna turn it to the last page for you. Do
15 you see that disclosure memoranda?
16 A Yes.
17 Q And do you see that it's on Wright letterhead
18 and -- do you see that it's also on Wright Investors'
19 Services letterhead?
20 A Yeah, I see it.
21 Q Do you see there's a space to fill in the name of
22 the client?
23 A Yes.
24 Q Do you see where it says, "Wright Investors'
25 Services, WIS, will pay a portion of its investment

60
1 management fees to Joseph Bruno for his efforts in
2 introducing you to WIS. Such fees amount to no more than
3 20 percent of WIS' investment management fee and does not
4 result in any additional charge to you." And do you see a
5 line at the bottom "received and acknowledged" and there's a
6 blank line there?
7 A Yes.
8 Q Did Senator Bruno, or anyone for that matter, ever
9 present you with a form disclosing that Wright would pay a
10 portion of its investment management fees to Senator Bruno
11 for his efforts in introducing your fund to Wright
12 Investors' Services?
13 A No. This is the first time I've seen this
14 document. Ever.
15 Q Did you have any reason, in August of 1994, or
16 during any of the time that your fund had investments with
17 Wright to not sign the form.
18 A No. I didn't get into that area at all, all that
19 type of thing would be left to our professionals to handle
20 and we -- I never signed any kind of, I don't believe the
21 trustees at all signed any kind of documents of this kind or
22 what you just mentioned to me.
23 MS. COOMBE: Your Honor, I have no additional
24 questions.
25 THE COURT: Cross-examination, please.

61
1 MR. DREYER: Thank you, your Honor.
2 MS. COOMBE: Your Honor, I do need -- sorry, I do
3 need to speak to Mr. Dreyer about something regarding the
4 cross-examination, will just take a moment. Could I take a
5 moment?
6 THE COURT: Certainly.
8 MS. COOMBE: Thank you, your Honor.
9 THE COURT: You're welcome.
10 CROSS-EXAMINATION
11 BY MR. DREYER:
12 Q Mr. Bennett, I'm one of Joe Bruno's attorneys. I
13 am gonna be asking you a few questions.
14 A Yes.
15 Q Thank you. And I am gonna start where Ms. Coombe
16 left off by asking you the following question: When you met
17 with Joe Bruno at a restaurant and discussed Wright
18 investment --
19 A Yes.
20 Q -- didn't he, in fact, say to you, in words or
21 substance, that he wanted you to tell him what the procedure
22 was to have Wright --
23 A Yes.
24 Q -- get a hearing from you?
25 A That is correct, yes.

62
Bennett - Cross - Dreyer
1 Q He didn't say to you, "I want Wright to be
2 your" --
3 A No, he did not.
4 Q He said, "What is the procedure for having Wright
5 become a fund -- become involved with your union," is that
6 correct?
7 A Yes, sir.
8 Q And you told him what the procedure was?
9 A Yes, sir.
10 Q What did you tell him?
11 A I told him, "Joe, people should submit their
12 inquiry and request in writing to the Board of Trustees at
13 their Syracuse office," and that at that time, professional
14 money managers would review their application, go into their
15 background as to their abilities and financial -- making
16 money for their clients satisfactorily and if they are --
17 again, if they're acceptable, that would be acceptable to
18 the funds, we would -- it's equal opportunity as anybody
19 else.
20 Q At that time, you were on a first name basis with
21 Mr. Bruno? He was "Joe"?
22 A Yes.
23 Q And you were "Whitey"?
24 A Yes, I was known as Whitey.
25 Q And at the time of the meeting with Bruno, didn't

63
1 he say, in words or substance, "If don't like 'em, Whitey,
2 you can walk away from 'em"?
3 A There was no question about that.
4 Q So when Ms. Coombe asked a moment ago did you have
5 any fear that if you turned Wright down that there would be
6 some reprisal in the future or some issue in the future,
7 isn't it true that had you no such fear at all based on your
8 relationship?
9 A No, I did not. At the time the discretion came up
10 and I was not worried about it because we had many other
11 things, professional lobbyists, to go before the Senate and
12 Assemblymen, this wouldn't have knocked us out, no, it
13 wouldn't.
14 Q Over the years, you had many legislative issues
15 taken up before the Senate and the Assembly and sometimes
16 you win and sometimes you lose?
17 A That is correct. You win a few, lose a few and
18 you go back and try to revise your positions and try again.
19 Q And when you lose a few, that does not affect the
20 relationships that you have with any members of the
21 Legislature, is that correct?
22 A I haven't had that experience, no.
23 Q And likewise, in this particular case, despite
24 your apparent statement in the grand jury, can you tell this
25 jury that you had any worries or fear at all that your

64
1 relationship with Joe Bruno would in any way change if you
2 walked away from Wright?
3 A No. I thought I had mentioned that in my
4 presentation, too. If I left the impression I was fearful,
5 I think I corrected that. No, it was every day business.
6 Q Let me then go to that issue and ask you, page
7 33 -- excuse me, page 39, question, at line 8. Were you
8 asked this question and did you make the following answer,
9 just a few pages before Ms. Coombe read the quote to you a
10 moment ago:
11 Question, "Now, let me ask you this: Did you feel
12 that you would be able to say 'no' to Wright Investors?"
13 Answer, "If they felt no, if, in fact, their track
14 record financially showed that they would be a poor
15 performer for us on that field, I had no hesitation to have
16 said, 'Joe, I'm sorry we didn't take them, we weren't happy
17 with their performance.' I didn't feel any fear of any
18 repetition of anything at all at that time, you know --
19 repetition meaning probably reprisal?
20 A That's correct.
21 Q Is that what you said in the grand jury?
22 A That's what I said, yes.
23 Q Just one page before --
24 A Yeah.
25 Q -- what you said to Ms. Coombe who asked you the

65
1 question a second and third time, didn't she?
2 A Yes.
3 Q When you met with Joe Bruno in 1994, for how many
4 years had you known him?
5 A Oh, going back to the days when he was with Perry
6 Duryea (phonetic) and his staff, and that's many, many years
7 that we had met, being in the labor field, of course, and we
8 knew Joe then, as other labor leaders did in the Capital
9 Region and statewide.
10 Q And you knew Joe Bruno even as of August 1994, as
11 you've so testified, you knew that based on your
12 understanding of his history in the Senate that he was a
13 person that was pro labor, pro working man, pro economic
14 development?
15 A Yes.
16 Q Correct?
17 A Correct.
18 Q And I believe that in all the years that you had
19 legislative issues before the Senate or the Assembly, and I
20 think you alluded to this a moment ago, your actual contact
21 with Joe Bruno on legislative issues would have been
22 limited, is that correct?
23 A That's a fair statement.
24 Q Yes. And why is that?
25 A 'Cause we deal with his representatives.

66
1 Q And his representatives being staff members?
2 A Names escape me now, but on his staff, we would
3 deal with them.
4 Q For example, isn't it true that in the Assembly
5 and Senate, Senators and Assemblymen have staff and labor
6 committees?
7 A That's correct.
8 Q There are transportation committees, you're the
9 Teamsters. So there are transportation committees, correct?
10 A Yes. Yes.
11 Q And there are other committees?
12 A Many of them.
13 Q And over the years, you did have a legislative
14 function in the Teamsters, did you not?
15 A Yes.
16 Q So over the years, can you count on one or two
17 hands, couple times you went to Joe Bruno's office to put
18 the arm on him to pass legislation for you?
19 A It would be less than five probably, maybe five
20 times.
21 Q All right. And have you told us --
22 A I am not excluding social gatherings, as I pointed
23 out, when election times came around and we sent our checks
24 out to our favorite legislators for their re-election.
25 Q Ms. Coombe showed you and I am gonna ask you to

67
1 turn to it -- if you could put up GD-8 on the screen,
2 Government Exhibit 8. And I think you have it before you,
3 Mr. Bennett. I'm starting with this 'cause it's an actual
4 document, then I am gonna get into the overweight ticket
5 issue and a few other issues. Do you see it?
6 A Exhibit 4 -- GE-8?
7 Q GD-8. It's the one concerning workfare
8 legislation.
9 A I have it.
10 Q You have that now?
11 A Yes.
12 Q I am gonna ask you a few questions about this and
13 then we'll get back to it. But you sent this letter to
14 Honorable Joseph Bruno at the Senate Majority Office at the
15 State Legislative Office Building, is that correct?
16 A Yes.
17 Q Do you ever recall talking to Joe Bruno about
18 workfare?
19 A Personally, I don't know that we -- that I did. I
20 don't recall.
21 Q Okay. So this letter that you sent him was a
22 protocol to address it to him at the Legislative Office
23 Building, is that correct?
24 A Yes. That is correct. Yes.
25 Q Do you know that you talked to his staff at The

68
1 Senate Building?
2 A It was so many years ago, either we did or jointly
3 through the AFL-CIO legislative person, Sue Valentine
4 (phonetic) at the time, through her, but I don't recall. We
5 were all asked, of course, to support the document and we
6 did. The legislation, I should say.
7 Q Now, the workfare legislation that you're
8 referring to in here is actually legislation concerning
9 persons who are removed from the welfare roles and put on
10 into jobs, available jobs, is that correct?
11 A Yes. That refreshes my memory when you say it
12 that way, correct.
13 Q All right. And the issue in this letter was a few
14 things. First of all, there was issues relating to the
15 actual replacement of existing employees, is that one issue?
17 Q There were issues relating to how, as you pointed
18 out, the persons moving off welfare into the jobs were being
19 treated, correct?
21 Q There were issues about how they were being paid,
22 correct?
23 A Correct.
24 Q And there were issues relating to whether they
25 should be exposed to any greater hours or greater hardships

69
1 than the union members or any other employees, is that
2 correct?
3 A That is correct.
4 Q And so, the AFL-CIO was taking the position, was
5 it not, that the legislature needs to look at this issue and
6 balance the rights of the people moving into the jobs,
7 correct?
8 A Yes.
9 Q And the rights of the existing union members?
10 A Correct.
11 Q All right. Now, with that in mind, what happened
12 to that legislation?
13 A It's so many years now, I don't have the answer.
14 Q Well, let me ask it this way. Do you know who
15 championed this particular legislation? Wasn't it the
16 Governor's office?
17 A I think it was, I recall vaguely.
18 Q All right. So this piece of business, as you sit
19 here today, this piece of business, in 1997, three years
20 after Wright Investors began working for the union, this
21 piece of business, as you know it, and as far as you could
22 recall, really had nothing directly to do with Joe Bruno,
23 did it?
24 A No, no, no.
25 Q I think you said there was another piece of

70
1 legislation that you're very proud of and that is the
2 legislation that relieved truck drivers from the obligation
3 of having to go to court, defend themselves on a ticket, get
4 points on their licenses, pay fines themselves, albeit fines
5 paid by companies, because they had been stopped on the
6 Thruway, let's say, and their trucks are overweight?
7 A Yes.
8 Q And you recall you tried three times to get the
9 legislation passed?
10 A I believe it was three. I said three.
11 Q Do you recall how that legislation began? In
12 other words, do you recall how it got initiated?
13 A Well, I had a meeting at the -- many years ago
14 with the Senate Transportation Committee with the then
15 transportation chairman who I mentioned his name.
16 Q Well, Bragman, I think, was in the Assembly, if
17 I'm not mistaken.
18 A Yeah. Bragman was there and also the Senate, his
19 counterpart in the Senate, just escapes -- can't think of
20 his name now. I had mentioned it earlier.
21 Q Norm Leavy?
22 A Yes, Norman Leavy, regretfully, he's passed on, of
23 course. He was the first I spoke with on this at a meeting
24 at the then World Trade Center in New York City. And he
25 took a keen interest. And then I lateraled over to his

71
1 counterpart in the Assembly and they both took a keen
2 interest in it from there and that's where it took off from
3 there.
4 Q Okay. And so there's an example when you went to
5 the right places in both the Assembly and the Senate; namely
6 the, committee level?
8 Q And you approached the chairman of the committee,
9 correct?
10 A Yes.
11 Q What eventually happened as a result of those
12 discussions?
13 A After two terms, I said, or three, back and forth,
14 back and forth with both, and I was riding herd on both
15 their offices, we were successful in getting some
16 legislation through that gave us relief we needed.
17 Q Who were some of your opponents in that
18 legislation, do you recall?
19 A Our friends at that time, and I thought the PBA
20 Troopers was somewhat chagrin, and I only got that in
21 talking with Senator Leavy and his staff and also Mike
22 Bragman's staff, that they seemed to be resisting because of
23 the additional workload that they felt they had in writing
24 these tickets up. And I do remember during the course of
25 that time, I -- a meeting was arranged for me with the

72
1 representatives, the legislative representatives of the
2 state -- of the PBA, or of the Trooper's union at that time,
3 over down at the Legislature.
4 Q So what you're telling this jury is that the State
5 Police themselves, as an interest group that has lobbyists
6 and lobbies against bills in the Legislature?
7 A No. In this particular interest, they didn't
8 appear to me too keen on getting the law changed to the way
9 we would like to have it, because as I understand it, it may
10 become an additional workload in writing these tickets up.
11 Q All right. Do you recall the approximate time
12 that the bill you're talking about eventually was passed?
13 A I'm guessing three sessions.
14 Q All right. And do you recall any direct
15 involvement that Joe Bruno or his staff had in connection --
16 A I don't recall that they had or they hadn't, to be
17 frank about it.
18 Q All right. And then the third issue that you
19 discussed was Workers' Comp issues relating to union
20 members, is that correct?
21 A Yes. Yes. Yes.
22 Q Do you offhand remember the issues in that?
23 A Well, they were looking to get some major
24 reductions for the workers in that field, reduce them. And
25 I remember at that time Pataki had formed a --

73
1 Q A task force?
2 A A task force.
3 Q A labor task force?
4 A A labor task force, and I happened to be asked to
5 serve on that task force along with several other people and
6 another labor leader from downstate, and there were some --
7 I know the bottom line was I did not vote in favor of the
8 particular changes that were made on behalf of the Teamsters
9 because I was asked by -- right across the state that we
10 were upset about the changes happening. But I think we fell
11 short and the law was changed and modified, whatever the
12 case was, but we didn't get what we wanted at that time.
13 Q All right. Now, do you recall whether Joe Bruno
14 had any involvement in that?
15 A No, not that I -- we never had any direct
16 discussions with Joe's office on it.
17 Q So the three instances you have given so far are
18 cases where you've dealt with committees, the Governor's
19 task force in the case of Workers' Comp?
21 Q Or in the case of the workfare, again not with Joe
22 Bruno's office?
23 A Yes. Now that you've refreshed my memory on it,
24 yes.
25 Q All right. Can you recount any time when you

74
1 actually -- specific time when you ever went to Joe Bruno
2 and asked him to do something for you and he said no?
3 A I can't recall --
4 Q Okay.
5 A -- no.
6 Q Wasn't it correct that Joe Bruno, nevertheless,
7 was somebody you could pick up the phone and call and he'd
8 return your call within moments?
9 A Oh, yes. Very accessible.
10 Q And he always listened to whatever legislative
11 proposals the AFL-CIO or Teamsters had?
12 A I would gather particularly with -- the State
13 AFL-CIO maintains a full-time office, legislative lobbying
14 staff up here, as you might know.
15 Q Now when he and you talked in August of 1994,
16 about Wright Investments --
17 A Yes.
18 Q -- and you told him what the procedure was --
19 A Yes.
20 Q -- do you know what happened next after that? Did
21 there come a time --
22 A There came a time when they were put on the funds.
23 Q Well, before that time, let's talk about the
24 process a little I bit. Miss Coombe showed you a document
25 that I'm gonna show you and we are gonna talk about it in a

75
1 little more detail.
2 MR. DREYER: If you could put GD-4 up on the
3 screen.
4 Q You see GD-4, it's the meeting of August -- excuse
5 me, June 28, 1994?
6 A Yes.
7 Q All right. Now, by looking at the date, June 28,
8 1994, would that refresh your recollection that the meeting
9 that you had with Joe Bruno must have occurred sometime
10 before that?
11 A If that's the case, yes. I really forgot, didn't
12 remember this, it was a total blank to me, this meeting, so
13 many years ago that I can't remember everything in detail on
14 'em.
15 Q Let's see first if we can put up first paragraph
16 who were present from the trustees' side of things. Do you
17 see that?
18 A Yes.
19 Q All right. You're present, Mr. Kearney is present
20 and Dave McComb (phonetic) is present. Those are union
21 trustees?
22 A Correct.
23 Q See the next line, Frank Clemente and Carlo
24 Rossetti?
25 A Yes.

76
1 Q And it says employer trustees?
2 A Yes.
3 Q What does that mean?
4 A Trustees of the employers.
5 Q In other words, this is a jointly administered
6 pension fund, is that correct?
7 A Jointly, yes.
8 Q And would you tell the members of the jury what it
9 means when it says "employer trustees?" Where do they come
10 from?
11 A Employer trustees are voted on between the
12 employers that we have collective bargaining agreements with
13 and who make contributions on behalf of their Teamsters
14 employees to the joint fund. And they'd, in turn, select
15 their trustees to become employer trustees of the fund.
16 Q So they are -- as trustees of the fund, they have
17 the same fiduciary duty as you do?
18 A Same fiduciary responsibilities as we have.
19 Q All right. And they don't defer to the union
20 trustees, do they?
21 A No, it's jointly administered.
22 Q All right. Turning to the next line, also present
23 were, do you see that, also presents were, it's on the
24 screen and right on your sheet?
25 A Yeah.

77
1 Q Starts with Bruce Bramley, Esquire. Did you know
2 Bruce Bramley then?
3 A Yeah. He was our attorney for the local funds.
4 Q And he knew how to ask a question or two, didn't
5 he?
6 A Yes, he did.
7 Q And William Pozefsky, another union attorney?
8 A Yep.
9 Q And he was a person who had many, many, many years
10 of experience in Labor Law, correct?
12 Q Fund council, he's described as fund council, is
13 that correct?
14 A Yes.
15 Q And did he take active parts in the discussions
16 that had anything to do with the funds that were being
17 discussed at union meetings?
18 A Oh, yes.
19 Q Take a look a little farther down and tell us if
20 you know Mr. Darren Owens (phonetic) of the Seigel Company,
21 fund actuaries and consultants?
22 A Yes.
23 Q All right. And what was his role?
24 A He would come up to the monthly meetings,
25 representing his firm at the meetings.

78
1 Q All right. And Mr. Stanley Eisenberg, CPA?
2 A He was our CPA for the Local Union and the Local
3 pension fund.
4 Q All right. Now, the next line says Martin D. Sass
5 and Harvey Rosen, of MD Sass Associates. Can you tell the
6 members of the jury what Sass Associates was?
7 A Martin Sass was an investment broker in this union
8 field and he was one of our money people at the time we
9 invested with.
10 Q Okay.
11 A Similar to Wright Investors.
12 Q He was a competitor of Wright, right?
13 A Exactly, a competitor.
14 Q And you see in the next line it refers to a
15 Mr. Dellocono of Seigal Advisors, is that correct?
16 A Yes.
17 Q And what was Mr. Dellocono's role?
18 A Well, the Seigal people were similar to the
19 professionals that we hired to oversee the funds and analyze
20 'em and give us reports and so on. Martin Seigal is well
21 known.
22 Q All right. And then you see finally names of
23 other people, including Brad Golden of Oppenheimer Capital
24 and Martin Singer, and above that, I missed one, Christopher
25 Keaton (phonetic) and Michael Catalfia (phonetic) it looks

79
1 like, of Manning and Napier Advisors?
2 A Yeah.
3 Q Is that correct?
4 A Correct.
5 Q So, at the very meeting where the union and
6 employer trustees were going to be talking about Wright,
7 there were other competitors actually present, correct?
8 A Yes.
9 Q And Oppenheimer was one of 'em, correct?
10 A Oppenheimer Capital, yes.
11 Q And you listened, as a group, to all of these
12 presentations made by Oppenheimer, by Wright, by any others
13 who were present, correct?
14 A Correct.
15 Q And then what happened after that?
16 A Well, ultimately, the trustees made their
17 selections of the people that were going to replace others
18 that were going off the fund. I think Marty Sass went off
19 the fund, and others at that time.
20 Q All right. And had Wright Investment, had Wright
21 actually followed the procedure that you outlined to Joe
22 Bruno? Had they submitted things in advance?
23 A Apparently they did, yes.
24 Q And your advisors made recommendations to the
25 trustees?

80
2 Q In your experience, did the trustees, from time to
3 time, question the advice of the advisors?
4 A Occasionally, yes. We could be concerned about
5 one item or another, yes, we would ask about that.
6 Q And among other things, you would look at such
7 things as the stability of the company, is that correct?
8 A That's correct, the viability of the company.
9 Q Right, to make sure that you weren't dealing with
10 another Bernie Madoff?
11 A That's exactly right.
12 Q And Bernie Madoff was not somebody you put money
13 into, correct?
14 A (Laughter.)
15 Q In this particular case, Wright Investment passed
16 the test very well, did they not?
17 A Yes, they did.
18 Q In fact, at the end of the meeting, you have
19 recommendations from all of the advisors to move one-third
20 of the money into Wright Investment?
21 A Apparently the record shows that.
22 Q Were there any dissents on the part of the
23 employer trustees?
24 A Not at all.
25 Q Was Mr. Bruno present at that meeting?

81
1 A No.
2 Q All right. When you spoke to the other trustees
3 about your conversation, I think you said you spoke to some
4 of the other trustees about Joe Bruno. Did you do that
5 privately or did you do that at the meeting?
6 A No. That was done at the -- privately with the
7 funds in general, the trustees of the funds.
8 Q Okay.
9 A He had a relationship with the employer, I think,
10 trustees as being a pretty fine legislator, too.
11 Q So they knew him?
12 A They knew him actually.
13 Q All right. Now, that's 1994. When, by the way,
14 did you retire from your position.
15 A I'm guessing it was '88, '89 -- rather ninety --
16 1998, I think it was.
17 Q And your role was taken over by Mr. Bulgaro?
18 A Yeah, he succeeded me. He came on right after I
19 retired, yes, as the president.
20 THE COURT: Good place for a break before you turn
21 to that?
22 MR. DREYER: Yes.
23 THE COURT: Okay. I'm gonna give ya 20 minutes
24 this morning. My sense is 15 is not enough for ya. Let's
25 take a break until five of.

82
1 (Short recess taken at 10:35 AM.)
2 (Court reconvened at 10:55 AM.)
3 (Jury present.)
4 THE COURT: Mr. Dreyer, please.
5 MR. DREYER: Thank you, your Honor.
6 BY MR. DREYER:
7 Q Mr. Bennett, before I go on to a new topic, I just
8 wanted to ask you to look one more time at GD-4 and ask it
9 be put on the screen, please, Government's 4, Exhibit 4.
10 A GD-4?
11 Q Yes.
12 MR. DREYER: And I am gonna ask that page 2,
13 paragraph C, be brought up on the screen.
14 A Paragraph B?
15 Q Paragraph C on page 2. If you look at the screen
16 you'll actually see it.
17 A Yes.
18 Q And this is the exact, if you recall on direct
19 examination, this is the exact part of the document that
20 Ms. Coombe showed you --
21 A Um-hum.
22 Q -- a few moments ago on direct? And do you see
23 what that pertains to? Is that, in fact, the minutes
24 showing the presentation of Wright Investors' Services?
25 A Yes.

83
1 Q All right. Now could you please look just one
2 paragraph above that, paragraph B -- I am gonna ask that
3 paragraph B be put up on the screen -- and does that show
4 another presentation?
5 A Yes.
6 Q And that's of Oppenheimer Capital?
8 Q And that's also reflected in the minutes, correct?
9 A Yes.
10 Q And one above that is Manning and Napier,
11 paragraph A?
12 A Yes.
13 Q And that's reflected in the minutes?
14 A Yes.
15 Q So all of those organizations had the opportunity
16 to make their presentations?
17 A That's right.
18 Q Thereafter -- you can take that down, thank you.
19 Thereafter, after this meeting, what other contacts did you
20 have with Joe Bruno about the Wright Investors' Services job
21 or contract?
22 A We had no further discussions, privately or
23 otherwise, about Wright Investors.
24 Q And that's true all the way up to 1997 --

84
1 Q -- is that correct?
2 A Yes.
3 Q Up until 1997, the next meeting we are gonna talk
4 about, Wright Investment was on the job, is that correct?
5 A That's correct.
6 Q And you continued to review at any meeting or
7 every month, you continued to watch their --
8 A Yes. We were getting reports from our
9 professional in that field, activities for that month, the
10 funds, whatever.
11 Q In fact, when the contracts were sent by Wright to
12 the union, Joe Bruno had nothing to do with that, did he?
13 A Not that I know of, no.
14 Q All right.
15 MR. DREYER: If we could put up on the screen
16 GD-10 --
17 Q -- which is in front of you, Mr. Bennett.
18 MR. DREYER: And if you could bring up the first
19 paragraph, in attendance of trustees.
20 Q Now, first of all, do you see at the top,
21 Mr. Bennett, New York State Teamsters Conference, Pension
22 and Retirement Fund?
23 A Yes.
24 Q Is that fund different from the one that we have
25 been talking about in recollection with the 1994 meeting,

85
1 the pension fund of the Albany area Trucking and Allied
2 Industries --
3 A Yes.
4 Q -- Local 294?
5 A In Albany, they were merged into the big funds.
6 Q And when did that merger take place?
7 A I would have to rely on documents. I can't recall
8 the date off the top of my head.
9 Q But it was after 1994?
10 A Oh, yes. Yes.
11 Q So in 1994 you had one meeting with Joe Bruno,
12 correct?
13 A That's all.
14 Q All right.
15 A We had the luncheon meeting.
16 Q But then there was this big merger, is that
17 correct?
19 Q And all of a sudden, much more money was
20 available?
21 A Substantially.
22 Q Did Joe Bruno ever come back and say to you,
23 "Invest this money in Wright, also"?
24 A No. No.
25 Q Take a look at the people present, at the New York

86
1 State Teamsters Conference Pension and Retirement Fund on
2 December 1, 1997. Who were in -- can you read that on
3 the -- it's up on the screen also, Mr. Bennett?
4 A People in attendance?
5 Q Yes.
6 A Yes, I can read it. A Robert Crosity (phonetic),
7 executive administrator. Donald Fisher, fund coordinator.
8 Paul Bush, fund director of operations. Peter P. Parvati
9 (phonetic), Thomas Wotring (phonetic).
10 Q Would you stop right there. Who is Thomas
11 Wotring?
12 A He was the employer trustees counsel.
13 Q And he was from the firm of Morgan, Bocius and
14 Lewis (phonetic)?
15 A That's correct, out of Philadelphia.
16 Q And that's one of the labor and pension fund
17 attorneys?
18 A Does substantial work in that field.
19 Q He was actually present there, wasn't he?
20 A Yes. He and many others.
21 Q Go ahead, continue please. Ira Mitzner
22 (phonetic). Who was he?
23 A I can't recall. Says Ken Friedman, Sedgewick
24 Noble (phonetic). Peter Carre, Peter Carre Associates was
25 there all the time at the fund meetings in those days. And

87
1 Ed Patchett, Independent Fiduciary Services, and Frank
2 Lilly, independent Fiduciary Services.
3 Q Let's talk about Frank Lilly. Can you tell the
4 members of the jury who Mr. Lilly is or was at that time?
5 A I would have to be refreshed.
6 Q All right. Do you know that Mr. Lilly comes from
7 a long background of financial -- had a long background as a
8 financial and investment advisor?
9 A I am assuming he may have, but I don't recall at
10 this time.
11 Q You don't? All right. All right. Going back one
12 paragraph above, do you see who the trustees in attendance
13 were?
14 A Yes.
15 Q It says Briggs, Bennett and Passato (phonetic.)?
16 A Briggs, Bennett and Passato for the union.
17 Anthony Timose (phonetic) and J. Dawson Cunningham for the
18 employers.
19 Q Off the top of your head, do you know how much
20 money was available for investment in the 1990s?
21 A Juggling those figures in my mind before I was in
22 the grand jury room, I thought it was a million and I was
23 refreshed that we had well over a billion dollars, so my
24 original statement was correct. It was well over a billion.
25 In fact, one of my colleagues, former trustees of the local

88
1 funds reminded me last week, I happened to -- jogged in my
2 mind the figures I was thinking were correct or not, he said
3 it's probably closer to a billion and a half. We were one
4 of the finest funds, we were considered to be within the
5 Teamsters movement, as far as handling 'em, investment
6 portfolio, and we weren't going through the difficulties
7 that many funds were going through, like we call the Central
8 States Teamsters Fund, which was highly publicized, the
9 difficulties they had back in the '80s and '90s. And our
10 fund was sought after and people with smaller Teamsters
11 funds were looking to merger with us. And since I've
12 retired, of course, I've noticed there's two or three that
13 have merged with us and enhanced their funds locally.
14 Q I notice, and you can tell the jury the trustees,
15 both union and management or employer trustees are different
16 from the trustees we were talking about with Local 294?
17 A They were totally different, yes. Former
18 trustees, employers, that was it, their responsibilities
19 were finished when we merged.
20 Q And I ask you, you had no reason to tell these
21 trustees about any conversations you had with Joe Bruno way
22 back in 1990?
23 A No. No. No.
24 Q This was a wholly different matter, was it not?
25 A Yes. Let me clarify that. I brought up -- when

89
1 we went to the meetings, you know, when they made their
2 recommendation to come in, I did talk about them then, you
3 know, talk about Senator Bruno. I did talk about him in a
4 positive manner.
5 Q Who got the job at this time, in '97? Did Wright
6 Investment --
7 A Yes, Wright Investment. And a couple others that
8 were there, Oppenheimer Capital, I believe.
9 Q So, in all cases, every time the union pension
10 funds or annuity funds or whatever they were that you were
11 investing, they were always more than just one firm which
12 your money --
13 A Yes, big firms. We needed people to challenge
14 each one of them to do their job for us.
15 Q Do you recall of your own memory how the
16 recommendation came about after this meeting? Did Mr. Lilly
17 make it, did Mr. Mitzner make it, do you know who made the
18 recommendation?
19 A No. I can't, just don't recall.
20 Q Okay.
21 A No.
22 Q Now, you said you retired the following year, is
23 that correct?
24 A Yes.
25 Q So you have no knowledge of what happened to the

90
1 relationship between --
2 A No. After I retired, that was it, I moved on and
3 let the new folks take over, the new generation, yes.
4 Q Okay. I just want to turn back for a moment and
5 ask you to revisit the lunch that you had with Mr. Bruno
6 where Wright Investment was discussed. Now you knew him to
7 be a businessman, correct?
8 A Oh, absolutely. There was no one within the
9 county or the state that didn't.
10 Q And you knew that legislators both in the Assembly
11 and the Senate were part-time legislators who had outside
12 businesses?
13 A Oh, absolutely.
14 Q That was no secret?
15 A That was no secret, public knowledge.
16 Q And when you met with Mr. Bruno, did he tell
17 you -- I realized you've testified on direct that he didn't
18 tell you the nature of his relationship with Wright
19 Investors. Did he tell you he had an interest in it?
20 A I answered that question. He was certainly
21 inquiring for them, on their behalf, and that my intuition
22 told me that there was some relationship. How deep it was,
23 I was totally unaware.
24 Q There was nothing that he said that prevented you
25 from asking?

91
1 A Oh, no.
2 Q And you had the type of relationship where you
3 could have inquired?
4 A I felt comfortable doing that if I needed to, yes.
5 Q All right.
6 MR. DREYER: May I have a moment, your Honor?
9 MR. DREYER: Mr. Bennett, thank you very much. I
10 have no further questions.
11 THE WITNESS: Thank you.
12 THE COURT: Further questions by the Government?
13 MS. COOMBE: Yes, your Honor.
14 REDIRECT-EXAMINATION
15 BY MS. COOMBE:
16 Q Mr. Bennett, you indicated that you told the union
17 trustees about your meeting with Senator Bruno in which he
18 talked to you about Wright. Did you tell the management
19 trustees about that meeting?
20 A Well, that would be a joint meeting of the union
21 trustees, and the employer trustees would know about it
22 because they were at the meeting.
23 Q Right. Did you testify earlier today that you
24 told the union trustees --
25 A Oh, yes, I beg your pardon. When I went to the

92
1 general meetings about other than talking about pension
2 funds, I did bring it up because I'm a legislative guy for
3 the state funds and I mentioned, at that time, that there
4 was an interest there from Wright Investors and that I had
5 lunch with Senator Bruno.
6 Q And that was a meeting of the Joint Council?
7 A I brought it up at the Joint Council in what we
8 call the annual reports, report of each division, yes. And
9 I would report on legislative matters and I brought this up
10 as well because the funds, of course, were of interest to
11 all the levels because of their memberships. So it's an
12 important item to be discussed and protected and see that
13 they were handled correctly.
14 Q So you told the union trustees at the Joint
15 Council meeting. Did you ever tell the employer trustees
16 about your lunch with Senator Bruno?
17 A I believe that came up in general conversation,
18 I'm sure, at the joint trustees meetings. And of course
19 that didn't go out directly for special meeting for it, but
20 I'm sure it came up, it was general conversation.
21 MS. COOMBE: May I have a moment, your Honor?
24 MS. COOMBE: I have nothing further, your Honor.
25 THE COURT: Anything further?


USA v. Bruno Howard Bennett Testimony

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USA v. Bruno Howard Bennett Testimony

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40

Bennett - Direct - Coombe

2 having been duly sworn by the Clerk of the Court, was

3 examined and testified as follows:

6 Q Good morning, Mr. Bennett.

8 Q Could you please introduce yourself to the ladies

9 and gentlemen of the jury?

10 A Yes. I'm Howard Bennett and I'm a retired

11 official of Teamsters Local 294 in the Albany area and

12 International Union of the IBT.

13 Q When did you become a member of the IBT?

14 A Oh, that goes back to 1954.

15 Q And how long were you a member of the Teamsters?

17 Q Can you describe generally for us what Local's 294

18 membership was comprised of?

19 A Well, when I came in the '60s and '70s, the

20 members of the Local extended itself to six or seven

21 thousand members employed in various crafts and industries

22 throughout the Capital Region and it stayed large like that

23 until, I would say, in the eighties, we started to lose a

24 little bit, but other than that, it was a very vibrant -- we

25 had a very vibrant membership.

THERESA J. CASAL, RPR, CRR

Bennett - Direct - Coombe

1 Q Now, you mentioned you were an officer of

3 A Yeah. I was a business agent for some years and I

4 was getting elected periodically, every three years, to that

5 post. Then, back in the '80s, I ran for the post of

6 secretary/treasurer of the Local union and was successful in

7 that and maintained the secretary/treasurer's post for a

8 number of years. And the time came where the former

9 president retired and I ran unopposed to become the first

10 president and principal officer of the Local union.

11 Q Was Local 294 ever affiliated with any kind of

13 A Yes. We had -- under the structure of the

14 International Union, we were part of what is called

15 Teamsters Joint Council 18. That consisted of the upstate

16 Locals, we had roughly eight Locals from Utica, Elmira,

17 Syracuse, Rochester, New York, and added recently the

18 Buffalo region. So we were about -- in those days, we had

19 eight, I think, six or eight legislators who gathered

20 together on a monthly basis and we talked about our issues

21 relating to the industries that we represented in the state

22 of -- upstate New York area and gathered together to solve

23 our problems where we could.

24 Q Now, during the 1990s, did you have any leadership

25 role with the Joint Council 18?

THERESA J. CASAL, RPR, CRR

Bennett - Direct - Coombe

1 A Well, I was doing some legislative work for the

2 council, and among other local unions, we would gather

3 together on various local issues dealing with the health and

4 welfare of our organization and attempt to keep an eye and

5 watch dog on what labor legislation was coming forth here in

7 if such issues came up where we were concerned with it

8 affecting our organizations negatively.

11 A Yes. I was -- became Vice President of the

12 AF of L-CIO in the '90s and maintained that role until I

13 retired from the Teamsters and a new Teamsters Vice -- new

14 Teamsters official became the AFL-CIO Vice President.

15 Q Did you ever have a role as special assistant to

16 the general president?

17 A Yes. When Carey (phonetic) became general

18 president, there came a time when he asked me to join the