CHICK COREA & STANLEY CLARKE MASTERCLASS

[Chick and Stanley playing piano and bass]

[Audience claps]
Stanley Clarke: Yes. Yes.
Chick Corea: Okay! Welcome my friend. I would like to thank you all for coming tonight,
by the way, and nice to see you in our, Mad Hatter East.
SC: Thats right.
CC: Mad Hatter East.
SC: Nice to see Mad Hatter East. I remember Mad Hatter West, so, well, you know, so
now youre over here and we got Mad Hatter East over here. Its beautiful.
CC: Thank you for helping me christen it.
SC: Absolutely. Absolutely.
CC: Yea. My buddy. We took a photo back there....
SC: Yea.
CC: Thats the original Romantic Warrior painting.
SC: Yea, yea.
CC: And you cant - you might not be able to see it from here, but that little snapshot on
the left, thats Miles Davis.
SC: Yea. Our buddy.
CC: Laney and I were talking last night and he was using the term heritage.
SC: Heritage. Yea.

CC: Its our heritage.

SC: Yea.
CC: Anyway, I, I would like to, I would like to you mind if I introduce you?
SC: Please!
CC: Because were you know, we have a nice studio audience here, but we also were filming this...
SC: Thats right.
CC: And this is going to go out and I theres a camera there and a camera there.
Cameras all around. And so I, Ive never really, properly, introduced you before.
SC: Can I read the script first?
[Chick does funny gesture with script and audience laughs]
SC: Lets see.
CC: Well, well you know, heres, this is, this is all, this introduction is my opinion. Its my
personal opinion.
SC: There you go.
CC: Id like to introduce a genius.
SC: Hey! Okay
CC: Cool be cool.
SC: Okay, okay.
CC: Watch out now!
SC: Alright, watch out!
CC: Okay. Be cool. Id like to introduce a genius. First, of the bass. Now lets just take
the bass as an instrument. We have the acoustic bass, this is the traditional guy, you

know, coming from the violin family, which Stanley has geniusly not only mastered in
many different ways, but has innovated all kinds of music and techniques and way of
playing the instrument, way of getting the sound out of the instrument as well. Not just
acoustically, but in combination with amplification. Theres no one else who makes an
acoustic bass sound like Stanley Clarke. Total innovation.
[audience begins to clap]
CC: No, wait, wait, wait. Thats only the beginning of the
SC: Thats just a sliver of what I do please! [laughs]
CC: Weve only just begun because tonight, tonight you wont see the electric bass. We
didnt bring the electric bass. But just as much of an innovator on the acoustic bass,
Stanley is on the electric bass. When, in fact, in fact, well you were playing electric bass
well before we met, but..
SC: Exactly. You know, I didnt play it that much I think prior to us meeting, you know,
I was playing with Joe Henderson, I was playing with Art Blakey, but I played electric
bass with Horace Silver.
CC: Yea.
SC: You know, so I was playing a bit It was pretty, pretty...
CC: A little bit.
SC: Yea
CC: But when we put Return to Forever together you basically played the acoustic bass
until a certain point we started to use it and then in the second version of Return to
Forever you brought out the electric bass.
SC: The electric bass.
CC: Electric bass. So on the electric bass the genius of Stanley is, again, in the area of
total innovation. Is what he does musically with the electric bass is unprecedented. I
mean he, Im sure you can talk about your influences and so forth but, but as far as
setting a standard for the playing of the electric bass and musically, not just technically,
but musically as well, and what he gets out of that instrument so thats genius. Bass
genius. Thats number one.

SC: Im embarrassed.
CC: Number two, is, composer genius. Lets go to composer genius. So, as a
composer, totally an innovator again, starting from the songs that he began to write with
Return to Forever and then going on to a long lifetime of repertoire that hes made. Not
only in the composition of songs, but the arrangement of them for, for various small
groups, jazz and fusion or whatever you want to call the various forms, up until the point
where Stanley Clarke became a genius of movie score writing.
SC: Wow
CC: So this compositional thing turned into this
SC: Im tired Im tired.
CC: other, this other Stanley Clarke universe. Ive never introduced you before
properly.
SC: Yea this is
CC: Is this all right?
SC: This is a heck of an intro.
CC: Yea. Yea, Im going to continue a bit
SC: Please.
CC: Cause a, yea, so, so thats the composer. So now we go to the genius of Stanley
Clarke as a bandleader. Because thats a very particular kind of a thing that a musician
does when he gathers other musicians around him and how he treats that situation and
how he makes it into a team and how he communicates his own music as a composer
and as a player with these other musicians and the resultant music that comes out of
that takes, well, it takes whatever it takes and in my opinion theres a genius there in
Stanley with his various bands throughout the years. In fact, one of your recent bands
and recordings, won a Grammy, last year?
SC: Yea, yea. The band that we had with lets see with Hiromi, piano, Ruslan Sirota
played the keyboards and young Ronald Bruner played drums, Charles Altura, who
plays with you and I was in there and a few others and yea we won I think it was 2011
Contemporary Jazz Artist or Group Album something of the year.

CC: Yea, much deserved. So, thats a snippet of the genius the band leader and
basically my opinion is that Stanley is a, an innovator in every sense of the word
musically, so hes rightly looked up to by young musicians and by older musicians, like
me, and we still have that ten year gap.
[audience laughter]
SC: That ten-year gap! [laughs] Yea, I can always tell my birthday by how old he is, you
know?
[laughter]
CC: Okay. Just a few quick credits and then Ill finish with my intro.
SC: Okay.
CC: Which is a, you know, Stanley and I come up in the music that was being innovated
and created in the late 50s, actually I was in the late 50s you came round in the 60s
and 70s and you had ten years with Pharoah Sanders, with Sun Ra.
SC: Well, I played with Pharoah Sanders, I played with Sun Ra...
CC: Horace Silver.
SC: Horace Silver.
CC: This is my intro, man. [audience laughs]
SC: Its cool, man, please.
CC: Pharoah Sanders, Sun Ra, Horace Silver, one of my favorite musicians of all time.
The great Joe Henderson. Art Blakey and the Jazz Messengers. We both played in that
band.
SC: Yea and theres only a few of us in The Messengers thats a big deal, Chick. The
Jazz Messengers.
CC: Thats right. Yea. Art Blakey and the Jazz Messengers. Now, that, that was in the
jazz field but Stanley has also collaborated and played with many, many musicians
outside of the jazz field. Two of which I know about, and Im sure there are many more,
is Paul McCartney and The Rolling Stones.

SC: Absolutely.
CC: I mean, not Paul McCartney and The Rolling Stones I mean, Paul McCartney and
The Rolling Stones. Two separate things.
SC: It wasnt yea [laughs].
CC: And, so, there it is. All the greats in and out of jazz, Stanleys played with. Ladies
and gentlemen, Stanley Clarke.
[Audience claps]
SC: Thank you so much. Thank you. Well, Im very happy to be here and Im really
happy this thing that Chick is doing, I thought Id come and lend a hand here, cause its
really important. Chick is a, you know, one of the greatest composers, American
composers of all time and pianist and hes influenced so many people and you know its
nice sometimes when you see a great musician who really could sort of hide and be
back in his room and kind of, you know, windows shut, shades down, and thats kind of
cool you know, thats okay, but its nice to see a guy who is comfortable with coming out
and spreading the love and spreading the education because you know its a really
good thing to educate people and pass things down.
Its funny I always feel kind of funny saying that, passing something down I gotta come
up with a better wording but its just nice, your young musicians need that. I wish when I
was younger that Miles Davis came on TV and did a master class or something
wouldnt that have been nice?
[Audience agreement]
[Everyone starts laughing]
SC: Come on guys! That was a joke! (mumbled) So serious! Oh yea [acts out Miles
Davis doing it]
CC: I cannot picture Miles Davis doing a master class, but I know what you mean.
SC: It was a cool picture, it was a cool thing to think up there but you know, he didnt do
that. But anyway, Chick feels comfortable doing this and its great he wants to do it and
you know I love that thing and were doing it and I really hope you enjoy this time that
were going to have with you today. Yea.

CC: Thanks, Stanley. Thank you very, very much. Well, you know, lets, this is, what
were doing here is sometimes I think about it as a, I call it a workshop. This is Chick
Coreas music workshop but, and the basic intention that weve always had actually,
from way back, is to help each other, help musicians and whats the best way we can
help? How to know some times is the best way we can help.
What Ive been finding recently is if I just make myself available to hang and be with
musicians and see what comes up and see which ways I can help then some cool
things result. So, the way, what do you think about, we played a little bit... by the way,
that little theme that we were playing before, that was from the first recording that we did
together with Return To Forever called
SC: Some Time Ago.
CC: Some Time Ago. Yea. And we should play some more but lets, what do you say we
check a question now.
SC: Yea!
CC: Now, Bill Rooney is our host. Bills the kinda like a moderator. Hes our
Bill Rooney: Ed McMahon.
CC: Ed, hes our Ed McMahon.
[laughter]
SC: Yea, he is. Hes got a smile on.
CC: So, in the past week or so weve been promoting to our mailing list, asking them if
they have a question that theyd like to ask Stanley or me or both.
BR: Yea, well
CC: Do you have one for us?
BR: Ive got several that I thought were great, but actually its only been the last couple
days. This came together quick, you know. We sent out for questions and we got just a
huge inflow of tons of questions, amazing admiration for you guys. Of course a lot of
comments and questions about Return to Forever because as these are musicians its
obviously a huge influence on many many people. But well save some of those for
later.

I picked one because I found it interesting and I know you guys deal with this. This is
from Greg. Hes from the US and he plays guitar.
But since the range of the piano goes down into the bass register and the bass
goes way up into the pretty high notes, how do these two instruments play
intricate improvisation lines and stay out of each others way? And do you two in
particular have any strategies or agreements when playing together, about this?
SC: Well, you know, theres actually a couple answers to that question. Start spitting
them out there you know, for me, when I play with musicians that have tremendous
virtuosity on their instrument first of all, you know which means they can pretty much
play pretty much whatever theyre thinking and have the technical ability, the dexterity
on their instrument to play.
But, thats fine, but what makes it really special, if that person is a composer and has a
mind for orchestration and has the ability to have that come through his instrument, you
know, its only natural. Like, if youre a orchestrator in your orchestra or composing
something for an orchestra, youre not gonna have like the cellos playing a low c, the
basses, the trombones, you know, everyone down here [simulates low sounding
instruments] you know, youre going to have somebody up here, its kind of a, its just a
natural, its almost natural.
You know, I would tell this guy to just kind of go with the flow, dont think about it too
much. Its the worst thing to do in music I think is to think too much about anything
cause, you know, what youre hearing is, you know, is what you wanna do, what you
mock up is beautiful. And just do it, get it out the best way you can, itll sound fine.
BR: Nice.
SC: Yea.
CC: How about we demonstrate that part?
SC: Yea, lets do it.
CC: Lets, you know, you know, weve never really talked about how the sounds
arranges the piano and the bass. I mean, have we? I dont remember us ever talking
about that.
SC: No, no, weve never in all the years.

CC: So, could you hear the both instruments pretty clearly, I thought. Its kind of dipping
up and down, and around. Sometime what I did, you know, in order to clarify the
orchestration was to stop playing a couple bars. Sometimes I notice that when an
accompanist is accompanying a soloist he just plays all the time and it doesnt have to
be that way. If youre making an orchestration as a soloist, just let him play alone for a
little while.
SC: Patience is my word. Have a little patience, you know? Like, you know, one of the
things I really like when youre playing along a chorus and you take the blues and youre
playing a chorus or something and then you know, conventional wisdom might tell you
right at the last notes of those blues. But some players if you listen to early Miles
Davis records and Coltrane they all play right into the next chorus that theyre going to
end in. And so, if youre a soloist standing there, you dont want to start baa! right at
the top, you want to wait. So it really requires listening, and having patience. Its a
wonderful thing.
CC: Yea, yea, yea. That was fun man.
SC: Yea man, I liked that.
CC: That was a song we played on our tour.
SC: Yea.
CC: Lets take another one!
BR: Okay cool, well this is from Albert and hes from Vienna, Austria.
CC: From Vienna?
BR: He plays the piano.
CC: Okay.
BR: And hes a beginner, which I love when beginners write in.
For a beginner in jazz improvisation, would you recommend to learn improvised
solos from records, note by note, if yes, what is the best method for doing this?
CC: Oh! Thats a real good question.

SC: Really good question.

CC: Thats a very, very astute question. Whats his name?
BR: Albert.
CC: Albert? Good question, man. And very briefly, my two cents, is that transcribe, I
mean playing an improvised solo from a record is a good idea. The best way to do it is
to transcribe it yourself.
In other words, you might be able to go out and buy a book of Charlie Parker solos, or
Bill Evans solos or someone had already transcribed it to solo and you could do that
and I guess that what youre doing is youre getting the original solo which is then
interpreted by someone who edited it down and now youre reading the edit so its not
direct.
So the best thing to do is get the recording that you like, the solo that you like, and
painstakingly transcribe the notes. Slow it down if you have to, take it a like bar at a
time, or something, you know. Learning to transcribe by ear and writing down the result
is a great exercise in and of itself and then, you know, you can learn to play it or
whatever so, thats my, gee I dont know how to demonstrate that, it would take too
long.
SC: Its a good thing, just to add to what Chicks sayin. Sometime if youre going to
transcribe solos, like jazz solos, its usually going to be on top of chord changes and at
some point, personally I dont like to think about it too much but it is a good exercise to
understand chord to scale relationship, you know, like these jazz players are playing
and theyre playing a lot of blues and theres a scale and theres an F7 chord well
theres probably two, three, scales you can use on top of an F7.
So say you transcribe this, this solo, this 32 bar solo and then you go somewhere and
get the changes and you can like, you know, put the change up on that bar and look at
the notes the guy is playing. And youll see that if you really get into it youll find some
semblance of what scale hes looking at or not looking at.
Its funny, I was playing with Joe Henderson, and I think Chicks like this too, and Herbie
Hancock. I said, man, you know, you play on changes? No. Hes just not thinking of
changes cause once you get beyond changes, most jazz standards have melodies, you
know youre playing off of standard tunes and sometimes a great way of improvising is
you have actually, some idea of the scales but follow the melody.

Like the, you know, like Coltrane is so fun when you listen to Coltrane and he played so
many notes you might think he was sitting there, and of course he did, he looked at
books and he looked at scales but he was a tremendous melodic player. I mean youd
hear him turn the page on this chord and go onto this chord and you know if you listen
to the melody and especially when hes doing standards you hear it in the melody. Its a
very, theres a lot of levels to get into but when Chick says you start there, but then
youll find youll just keep going to other echelons of understanding in soloing.
CC: Thats cool. I was just trying to think of one thing we could do to maybe
demonstrate a little bit of what you were saying was if we took a chord progression and
kinda broke it apart a little bit, like a, you know play a line on it and then play another
line on it. Not a hard chord progression.
SC: All Blues?
CC: All Blues is a good idea. So, lets do that for a minute. Now this is a song that
Miles Davis - that actually the melody to this song is very, very, very simple. And the
chord changes are very, very simple too. So, lets just - the basic sound of the song is
this [demonstrates on piano] and then the second change stays on the same base note
in G but it changes to this sound [demonstrates on piano] from a G with a
[demonstrates] I hate to use terms but its a G7. And then the second chord is a G minor
chord. So the scale for the first one is [demonstrates on piano].
[Stanley on bass]
CC: Yea so we just played some phrases just with that scale, so now the second scale
is this. [both demonstrate]
SC: So as a bass player, one of the things I do, which I learned from Ron Carter, is to
master this, say that second change is a G, play the but because of the way the
melody goes, Ron would put a C [demonstrates] so play the A 2nd. [playing together]
So you hear that G feeling? Now Ill change [demonstrates] you hear it? And as a
bass player, speaking of chords, if you understand chords, youll know what note to
change that will alter his chord dramatically. Put in another thing and then hes hip and
Im hip and were just hip.
CC: So thats the second chord. Theres the G chord then the G minor chord. Then it
goes to these kind of these theyre kind of funny chord because of the way theyre
voiced... voicing is the way you put notes together but it follows the melody
[demonstrates] its a D7th, but its voiced like this [demonstrates]. And then to an E flat

[continues playing] and then back to the G. Right? So lets, lets trade choruses.
[demonstrates] Im playing the melody.
[both playing]
CC: Heres the vamp again.
SC: Huh?
CC: The vamp.
[Continue playing]
CC: Okay now heres some different notes. Its a different scale. [demonstrates]
So thats staying inside the chord, right? And this is outside the chord. Basically, you
can choose any note you want.
[Audience laughs and claps]
SC: Theres a lot of truth in what Chick says here. You can be amazed with what you
can do with music, bend it, the conviction and the mock up is there, you really want to
do that and you believe in it, you know? The chord will bend.
CC: But I think its a nice gradient between... [laughter from audience] What? Im sorry.
SC: Im saying the chord will bend.
CC: It will bend. But its a nice gradient between what you said, having to do with
learning what notes with what scales, that we agree on. You know, like the sound that
we agree on this sound here [demonstrates] the notes that fit quote unquote are these
[demonstrates] right?
But if I played [demonstrates] that doesnt, its not part of the original agreement, but
you could make anything work. [demonstrates] Or even stranger [demonstrates]. So,
but its a good, so you learn the notes in the scale and then you just, you have to play
what you hear anyway. Where did we start with that question? I think we took it out into
the ozone.
SC: Is that Albert?
[Audience laughter]

BR: It was Albert and it was about, you know, learning solos for records.
CC: This is young Albert, right? Oh Albert wanted to learn solos
SC: Albert!
CC: Albert! Albert! Albert!
BR: Did you guys do that? Did you guys take records and learn solos, note for note?
CC: I did.
SC: I did a little bit of that, I did a little bit of that yea, I did that. I mean I had this
record player that I could turn down, you know, turn the [mumbled] you know, you know
I actually became a better transcriber later. When I started out it was pretty lame, when i
was 15, 16, but when I got up in my teens, it got better.
CC: Do you know the, have you come across that little computer thing called the
Amazing Slow Downloader?
SC: Yea, yea, yea.
CC: See, uh, whats his name? Albert! Albert! Albert! See, if you use a computer, which
you probably do, if you get the MP3 of the file, the digital file of the song you want to
transcribe and you put it in this little application called the Amazing Slow Downloader
you can change the speed of it without changing the pitch and you can slow things
down and hear it, that kind of could be a help. But yea, go ahead and transcribe.
SC: Yea, transcribe is great.
CC: Yea. Alright. So, what should we do? What would you like to do, Stanley?
SC: You know, lets round off with one more question. Do you have like a really good
one there, Bill?
BR: Well, theres a lot of really good ones.
SC: And then well, you know, play something.
BR: You know, theres one here that, like
CC: We could play something now and then

SC: We could play now

CC: Lets playing something now or do you have a question?
BR: Well it might lead to something. Might lead to something. So this is Allen from the
US.
CC: Allen! Allen! Allen!
BR: A-L-L-O-N so it might be our friend from Tampa.
CC: Its a cute little thing, some comedy thing, its this chipmunk that says Allon! Allon!
Allon! Im sorry man
SC: Its cool.
BR: I missed that one.
CC: Is everything all right?
SC: Did you see that, Bill? That show?
BR: No.
SC: Ill show you that
BR: Okay, hes a piano player, also plays trumpet and sings. Is that him? So our guy
from Tampa, Allon. This is a fingering question for both of you.
When a melody unison line is written on the piano and a bass player has to play it
with you, does the bass player come up with the unique fingering to
accommodate the line, and vice versa?
CC: I would think there would be no other way to do it. Theres some lines that Stanley
writes that sound and look real natural when he plays them and when I try to play them I
have to really work out something special.
SC: Same way with me. I think, yea. One of the things I love about what we did as
composers, and relationship to us players, is we wrote a lot of music and we composed
music. And we maybe, maybe, I dont know in Chicks case, but I didnt think a lot, so
much pianistically, you know what I mean? I wrote and I had an idea and I can hear a

guy playing that, but some of the things are a little finger twisters, you know, and like
many of Chicks tunes one of the things I loved about playing with Chicks music is
that it was very friendly for the bass.
CC: Really?
SC: Yea, because its hard. We should play No Mystery next. Thats a tune that you
cant just walk up on it, you know, you just play the song by the Temptations and then
you just go now Im gonna play No Mystery.
Im just gonna be honest. Straight out, gonna be real, as Doug. E Fresh would say. You
know you just cant walk up on that song. You have to sit down. You have to look at the
fingering, you have to look at the bass and figure out, now, you have to look at the
fingering but theres also sound on the bass.
One of the things I like to do on the bass is, many ways you can play things on the bass
but to get something to sound good, it has to be on the proper string. And it, you know, I
can play an F here, I could go [demonstrates] you know? I could even go here.
[demonstrates] That doesnt sound too good, right? But what if I had to play something
after that, you know like [demonstrates] I have to keep going, am I gonna have to
[demonstrates] Im going to have to come up with a fingering that makes sense with the
physics of the phrase, you know?
CC: You know what would be a cool thing to demonstrate? The first couple phrases of
No Mystery how you worked out the fingering. Let me play it on the piano, slower, and
then so you can see the fingering on the piano is pretty simple. [demonstrates] Right?
SC: Right, so Im going to go [demonstrates] you know, so thats the best way.
CC: That looks real simple though.
SC: Yea I think thats the simplest fingering to play the thing. But if I go [demonstrates].
CC: Ahhh!
[Audience laughs]
CC: Oh right. Take the first three notes. Play the first three notes like in their original
position. Alright, now play those three notes in the position you played them in. There.
So you have to work out that kind of thing.

SC: Yea, so, yea you have to just you know, I love doing that. I love like, I take like cello
pieces, violin pieces, you know, music written for those instruments and just for the heck
of it Ill sit down and try and play them and some of the stuff I can play and lot of it I
physically cant play.
It might be too high or just the the jump, but what it does is, I like to sit down and look at
a piece and just get into the fingering. I could spend a whole day doing that. You know,
its a beautiful, case theres a bit of mathematics, theres a bit of a, theres a couple
abilities in there to pull that off. Its very nice, its very cool, I love that.
CC: Wanna play the first part of the song for them?
SC: Definitely. Yea, lets do it.
CC: Okay, so
SC: Thats the way young guys play, yea? Lets do it.
CC: Ready?
[Both start playing No Mystery]
CC: Lets try it now.
[Keep playing]
[Audience claps]
SC: Thats some fingering there, right? Yea! Thank you, thank you. Thats a wonderful
piece. Thats actually, could possibly be my favorite piece of yours. I love that piece,
perfectly written for the bass. Its a real, its a great piece for a bass, for a bass player
to play.
CC: You have some great renditions with your band. So, what was the question? I think
that was Allons question.
BR: Yea. About fingering.
[Audience laughs]
SC: Well, that was it. Thats it, that did it. I mean, that fingering is important I think going
from one instrument even going to piano.

CC: I mean you wrote some stuff in After the Cosmic Rain, I dont know if you wrote it
on the piano.
SC: I did.
CC: You wrote it on the piano?
SC: Slow though. Very slowly.
CC: Because the song is impossible to play on the piano.
SC: If you play it very slow though
CC: We dont play it very slow though. And then, so, we could show those phrases.
SC: Yea, lets do that.
CC: One more little demonstration of that which in the part Im thinking of is this part.
[demonstrates on piano] How does it go? Oh there it is. [demonstrates] Let me hear
how you play that on the bass?
SC: I only play [demonstrates]
CC: Oh but you wrote these notes.
SC: You must be crazy. No man. Its Chick Corea, man!
CC: [demonstrates] first lets play the phrase. Oh wait what is it? One more time. Sorry.
[demonstrates] Oh theres an E in that part there. One more time for me. [demonstrates]
Whats that first note? B flat?
SC: Yea its a B Flat chord with a G flat and A flat and a D flat. There it is. Then its a G
A C F sharp.
CC: Okay, one more time. [demonstrates] Ah, Im sorry. Anyway, let me slow that down.
[demonstrates] See, now, you wrote [demonstrates] and it has to be played
[demonstrates] yea with two hands I got it! [keeps playing] Thats what I had to do. Is
that cool with the composer?
SC: Im cool with anything.

CC: Lets play the theme. I hate to cut it up like that.

[Both play]
CC: Want to try the ending?
SC: Yeah, thats nice. Nice piece. That was like- I think you wrote Hymn of the Seventh

Galaxy. I think you played it for me. I wrote that. That was the- your Hymn was the first
piece and that was the second piece.
CC: Thats right. The second piece on that record.
SC: That was really, wow. We were really young back then. Wed just play. Many years.
CC: Many years. Thats beautiful. After the Cosmic Rain, Stanley Clarke. What do you
think? What would you like to do? Should we do another question?
SC: Lets do another question. Is there another one there?
CC: Do one more question.
BR: I think an appropriate one too. This is simple then I have one Id like to ask. When
you played No Mystery, for those that dont know, youre the composer on that, you
talked about it, but you never mentioned thats a Chick tune and the last one you played
is your tune. Cosmic Rain.
CC: After the Cosmic Rain, Stanley Clarke. After the Cosmic Rain is from our
secondSC: That was our first electric album.
CC: It was our third record. Hymn of the Seventh Galaxy.
BR: I have a question from Gony, from Israel. Hes a drummer.
CC: From who?
BR: From Gony.
CC: G-O
BR: G-O-N-Y.

CC: N-Y. Thank you.

BR: Hes actually asking about this record. This is your second electric record. Where
Have I Known You Before? And he wanted to know:
How much did RTF rehearse prior to, maybe not this particular recording, before
any recording and also before a tour?
SC: We had some healthy rehearsals. One of the things that was nice about that band
was that we rehearsed not just for the notes. Each guy in the band could read music to
various degrees. Various amounts. But we got the notes pretty quick. Its just because
our music had transitions to it. Especially bigger pieces.
Like the pieces Chick wrote. Then eventually when we got into the Romantic Warrior
album, we wrote- all of us wrote pieces that had little suites, that had different sections.
It was difficult at first but we smoothed it out to make it sound like all one piece. Then
we also had the element, which comes from our jazz heritage, which is our
improvisation part.
So you have these songs that the lines have to be played pristine but then we also have
to have solos and make them feel like what we do. I remember having lots of
rehearsals.
Ill tell you a funny story. We actually were- I dont know if this is a real English word but
my mother used to say this a lot. Stanley youre so bodacious. Is that a word? We
were so bodacious one time that we actually went and charged people to come watch
us rehearse. Yes we did. In Denver Colorado at Ebbets Field.
Remember that place that all the rugs? Wed play- wed take a tune like one of the
Hymns. I think by that point we had, this is one of my favorite tunes, it was called
Beyond the Seventh Galaxy. Started with this F. F pedal. Had all these things. Maybe it
could have been Hymn.
CC: It was Beyond.
SC: Wed play it and get maybe 15 bars. But those 15 bars were so fresh and new
cause no one sounded like us. It was so new and wed just stop and go, Hold on! And
the audience would go- youd hear them go huh! Like that, cause it was really
something. We were playing extremely loud but extremely precise. I mean the bass
cabinets were blasted. Chick had this horn that was just - I could be deaf now.

CC: Excuse me. Excuse me. Excuse me. Excuse me. Allen. Allen.
SC: Anyway, we were young lions and you really heard that music. The only word that I
can describe it is being unleashed within a form. We played the notes but there was this
sense of being unleashed as musicians.
CC: Everyone liked to rehearse.
SC: Yeah, yeah, yeah. We loved it. We loved to rehearse.
CC: We enjoyed it.
SC: It was pumped. I remember we played a whole gig like that. We rehearsed. They
were there like this. It paid money to come see us rehearse. If any of you are out there.
Hey!
CC: I actually announce to my audiences, even to this day, welcome to my rehearsal.
And sometimes Im playing with the band, and if something should be a little tighter or if
were doing a new piece, I just stop the band, have a joke and say, Can we take it from
this part? Its real. Doug E. Fresh says, Keep it real.
SC: Keep it real. So its a cool thing. Rehearsals are cool.
BR: Did you go out and tour first and then record? Or the other way?
SC: We always rehearse before we went out I think.
CC: Before recording.
BR: Did you tour before recording?
CC: Yeah we did. We did it the- its that sequence. I kind of like that sequence. We
rehearsed a lot. Then we toured a lot. Then we went into the recording studio and then
it just went down.
The first Return to Forever record. Do you have it there? This record here, Ill never
forget, the first tune we played was some time ago. We rehearsed. This music wasnt
difficult but we played it a lot on tour. We played a lot of concerts. We had this set really
down and we went into the recording studio with Tony May with Airto, Flora, Joe Farrell,

you and me. I had just the Fender Rhodes. You had just the acoustic bass. Joe Farrell
had flute, saxophone. Flora singing, Airto on drums.
We were all in the same room and we played- we turned on the tape recording we
played the set down. We didnt stop, we just went from one song to another. We played
the set down. Then he ran out of tape after- he would signal when there was not enough
tape.
SC: We couldnt afford some more tape.
CC: He changed the tape and then we played the rest of the set. But basically we
played our live set down straight. There was no editing.
SC: Yeah it was great. A similar - not quite that extreme, but in Light as a Feather.
That was pretty quick. We only did a couple takes. Those records were done fast. I love
that. One of the things I loved about doing a lot of jazz records back in those days, it
was just swish. No fixing solos, no fixing notes.
I still get amazed at Light as a Feather - well these two records. I think this one, Light
as a Feather and that one are my favorite of all the Return to Forever records. The
Light as a Feather record actually really sticks out in my mind because theres some
remarkable playing on that record. We didnt go and fix anything. That was it. Its cool.
Sometimes when I record with young guys right now, (and not to diminish this particular
process here,) its interesting, Let me fix that note. Let me do this and do that. And Im
all, No man! Leave it! Leave it. I go, Man do you know, on Light as a Feather man?
The guy goes, Get out of here, Light as a Feather. Get out of here. 100 years ago. I go
Okay. But hey man, that was what was happening. It was great.
CC: Another question.
BR: This is Mark from the US, and hes a guitar player. I hope this question gets across,
cause I really know what hes asking and I really want to know.
I notice with many improvisers that the phrases go across the bar line at the
same time the bass and drums are improvising to the extent that its difficult to
hear the changes in the song from. When I improvise I find it difficult to do this
unless I hear a distinct downbeat in the form of the song. Is this in the matter of
everyone keeping the form in their head and not relying on hearing the form from
the rhythm section?

CC: Let me take that.

SC: Im looking at you, babe.
CC: Let me take that.
SC: Im looking at you.
CC: I understand, whats his name?
BR: Hes Mark.
CC: Mark. Okay, Mark! Mark! Mark! Mark! Check it out. The thing is, is that any time,
heres a little suggestion, anytime you feel a little confusion going on, not able to follow
something, something is like- you could think of it like too much information coming that
you cant process. In order to understand it you have to cut it back.
So lets cut it back to form. The musicians are improvising on a form, then you find what
the form is. Lets demonstrate a couple of different forms. The form that we were playing
on our After the Cosmic Rain, was very simple it was two changes. It was this. [Plays
piano.] Thats the beginning of the form. [Continues.] Second part.
So thats it. Thats the form. So lets fool around with the form a little bit. [Continues.]
Then we hit the top of the form together. We went around like that. The idea is if you
know the form first, it kind of just goes in. Thats a real simple form cause its one chord,
then its another chord, then its a little block. Lets try the form on Light as a Feather in
theSC: The solo part?
CC: Yeah, in the solo part. Its a long reform but let me show you what it is. [Plays
piano.] Okay heres the beginning of the form. [Continues.] Now were coming to the
end of the form. Heres the top of the form again. [Continues.] Okay the end of this tune
again. Play something at the top. [Continues.]
SC: This is swing.
CC: Theres the top you see. Thats a longer form and it has a bunch of different chord
changes in it. But once you get the form in mind, then you can do whatever you want
with it. There was the form then going over the form, soon as you get that together then
you can...

When its too confusing that means you dont have the form solid enough understood.
And when you have the form understood- So you take it on a lower gradient and start
some place where you get the form real solid then start to experiment with putting stuff
on top of the form then it comes a counter- becomes like a counter thing. Cause if you
just play like this it can get boring. [Plays piano.]
SC: Youll hear it better like that.
CC: Im bored as hell right now.
SC: Now wait a minute. I have at least three more bars then I get bored. I have another
three more bars. Hes a little - there was a tune when I was really young. I forget what
album. Miles Davis album a tune called ESP. I could never understand that thing,
when I was a kid, when he got up so far.
What I used to do was basically do - I used to sit down at the piano and I could bang out
the chords and I would just break it down. Then I started listening to their version of it.
And basically thats how I learned that tune. Id just hold notes in my head. [Hums
notes.] And then everything made sense. Miles solo made sense. Especially Wayne
Shorters solo made sense.
CC: Thats one of the thing that I think confuses someone trying to listen to a jazz solo,
when they dont understand the form of the song. Then the soloist sounds like randomly
all these notes. And its not. Its usually not. Its usually constructed over a form. Mark?
BR: Yeah Mark.
CC: Mark! Mark! Mark! Learn the form! The form! The form!
SC: Thats it. Get with the form.
Gayle Moran: Excuse me. Could we just hear the story about Light as a Feather? Isnt
there a story?
SC: Light as a Feather. Oh thats a beautiful story.
CC: Question from my lovely wife. Gail. Whats the question?
SC: The story about Light as a Feather. Its a story about generosity. Please dont
start crying. But anyway, I may start. But anyway, I was young, in New York, playing. I

wrote music but I wasnt- I didnt have a serious composer-like, Im a composer. I did
not have that thing.
I remember me and Chick were playing, it was right before Light as a Feather, and he
says, You know man, I dont know why. Thats interesting, I never figured out why, he
said Man, you need to write something for the record. I said, Get out of here, man.
You know I dont compose. Thats you. I dont do that. I play the bass. He says, No
man, just do it. He kept at it, in a nice way. He made a deal with me, he said If you
write a tune for the album, I will name the album after your tune. I said, Get out of
here, are you crazy? He said Nah, serious. And Chick looked really genuine in what
he was saying and so wrote this tune.
It was the tune Light as a Feather. I wrote the tune, the album was called Light as a
Feather. The reason I say its a cool thing, a generous thing. I think you were 29 and I
was 19. You were late 20s. This is kind of a word for bandleaders. When you have
young people in your band, encourage the guys to do all the things that will eventually
turn them into good leaders because, in my opinion, what makes a really good band is
not just- there are bands where youre not aware of the leaders but theres always some
guy there.
Theres always a person there thats like, Okay, lets get this together. He may be
behind the scenes or not. But it was a very cool thing. Very generous thing. He couldve
said, Get out of here. Like some other guys. But hes a very generous guy. Thats a
great story. I love telling the story. Now why did you- did you hear something I
composed?
CC: No it was because- as we were playing- we had a lot of concerts on that first
album. We played that first repertoire quite a bit. We traveled around Europe, we went
to Japan, we were all over the United States. We played that music a lot.
You were laying bass solos on a lot of the songs. I just noticed you constructed your
bass solos very melodic, especially at the beginning of the bass solos. You had a sense
of organization about how you made your solo. To me, that was already composing. So
if you werent writing it down, it was obvious the next step to write it down.
Plus the fact, I wanted to kind of expand the directional viewpoint of the band by having
input from the players. You were my major partner in Return to Forever. We were the
first- you were the first one I found to play my music. Cause Stanley wanted to play my
music. Then we found Airto, then we found Flora. So my intention was to expand the
music. But also, I knew you would be able to come up with something.

SC: Thats cool.

CC: That was a pretty cool first tune. Light as a Feather. Lets play the theme.
SC: Yeah.
[Plays song.]
CC: Beautiful.
SC: Light as a Feather.
CC: Stanley Clarke. Light as a Feather.
Audience: Who wrote the lyrics?
SC: Flora.
CC: Flora Purim wrote the lyrics.
SC: I said, Light as a Feather. She was a great musician. Flora. Very creative. What
do you say we end off on inviting Gayle up to sing with us?
GM: Are you kidding me? How? Is there a mic?
BR: Yes theres a mic. Its on its way.
SC: 500 Miles High.
CC: Yeah its kind of like a little bit of a theme song. Want to do 500 Miles High?
GM: 500 Miles Low. Well see.
CC: Gayle Moran Corea.
GM: Were going to talk. This one had no warning. Absolutely no warning.
CC: I knew you were coming down to theGM: I didnt bake a cake. No. Stanley that song. Really.

SC: Its cool. Great story behind that.

CC: See if you have sound on that.
GM: Hoo!
CC: Is it coming out?
GM: I just have to say this is a moment, to me of - theres two trees, two tall, giant, oak
trees here. And theyre eternally - these guys are kind of bonded and brothers. Its such
a thrill. I hope you dont give up duet performances.
SC: No were just beginning.
CC: Weve been playing duet all night.
SC: Watch him Gayle.
GM: Leprechaun. [Plays 500 Miles High.]
CC: Thanks for coming down and hanging there with us. Before we end off, real brief, I
got this. Alright, I just want to acknowledge Bill Rooney, as our producer, Julie Rooney
as our marketing director. Shes around here somewhere. Aaron is our cameraman.
Theres Aaron over there. Ingrid is our camera director. Shes back in the room. Nikki is
our switcher, shes back in the room. Joel, theres Joel, our camera man. Ric is our
senior production consultant. Theres Ric! Hey Ric. This is Rics set. Thanks for the
bricks. The fake bricks. Looks good. Mark is our studio manager. Heres Mark. Bob Cetti
hes our tech. Bobs back in the room, Im sure. Bernie Kirsh. Our old friend Bernie, our
audio engineer. Thanks Bernie. Cynthia is our stenographer. Really? Hi! I didnt even
know we had a stenographer. Nick is our assistant. Thanks Nick. And Josh, Josh
Greenberg. Josh is my assistant. Hey Josh. So anyway, thanks yall. Stanley, pleasure.
Lets do it again.
SC: Yes, lets do it again. Thank you guys for coming out. All you guys in the planet.
Thank you. Wonderful music. Create, create, create.
CC: Create, create, create, create. Okay thats it.