Lead pastor : Jerry Lawson & 24 to Double Coach : Richard Chancy

Index
Table of Contents

Introduction

Chapter 1 : Using Positive Reinforcement as a Guide

Chapter 2 : Reinventing the Wheel

Chapter 3 : Too Many People Doing Favors

Chapter 4 : No Quantifiable Goals

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Chapter 5 : Doubting What God Can Do Through You

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Chapter 6 : Doing It All

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Introduction

Thank you for downloading 6Things Pastors Doto Kill Church Growth .This book is composed
from an interview of Pastor Jerry Lawson, lead pastor of Daystar Church by church building
consultant, Richard Chancy. They had a very thorough discussion of all the mistakes that
eitherthey have made or they have seen other pastors make that seem to limit what they can
do in their church.
Richard : Jerry, why dont you give us a brief overview of who you are and Daystar Church.
Jerry : Sure. When I think of six mistakes that pastors do to kill a church, I think Ive probably
done them all and many more. We started our church out of a 65-year-old established church.
We rebirthed it as a new church, starting from scratch and built a whole new model. The
church has grown from under 100 people to over 2,000 in a really small town. We learned so
much.
When we started teaching that to other churches through a process called 24toDouble, we
literally, over the last five years, taught several hundred churches. Weve learned so much from
those pastors and picked up so much about how to better our process that I just love taking
opportunities like this to share with other pastors who might be dealing with some of the
same issues Ive been through or pastors have been through over the years.
Richard : Talk a little bit about the history of Daystar and what your experience with that
church is, where it was, and where it is now.
Jerry : We started Daystar, a church replant, when I was about 28 with about 60 people I had
some gifts. God gives us all gifts. I was very energetic and worked really hard, so the church
began to grow almost immediately. But we tapped out. We really maxed out at 400-500.
I met a church growth leader who was a great guy with a good heart. He opened my eyes to a
lot of things that we didnt know about: systems, structure, and building teams so that your
ministry is reproducible. The reason we were stuck was because things went pretty well as
long as my hand was in them, as long as I had enough energy to get to everything and be
involved in everything going on. They went pretty well because I had a high standard and a lot
of energy.

However, when I wasnt able to be there, I began to think, God forbid, if Im gone, if I die, if I
leave, what happens to this church? I just knew we werent structured for long-term growth.
When we started putting the 24toDouble structure in place, I found out that it wasnt just a
replacement for me being there, but there are actually people in our church who are more
gifted in certain areas and certainly more passionate about certain things than I was. So we
started really leaning on their gifts and talents, and thats when our church exploded in
growth and really took off.
Richard : Thank you, Jerry. Now that youve introduced yourself and your church, I should
introduce myself. Im Richard Chancy. After I graduated from college, I worked in financial
services for about eight or nine years. Then I woke up one morning and realized that I hated it.
Through Gods intervention, I met some people from John C. Maxwells organization about
that same time and had the opportunity to go to work for John Maxwell,consulting for
businesspeople as well as for churches.
Over the next few years, I really fell in love with building the church. When John sold the
organization, I started working with churches, doing consulting in preparation for church
construction and really got a heart for the how-to part of church, trying to go out and find
people who had good systems and good processes that we could put in place for church
growth.
As I was doing that, my good friend over at The Rocket Company, Casey Graham, introduced
me to Jerry Lawson and Lance Self from Daystar who wanted to take this 24toDouble
content that was primarily event-driven and put it online so that more pastors would have
access to it from a geographic standpoint as well as cost. Taking the resources online meant
pastors could learn at their own pace, without travel expenses, but most importantly, they
could involve their team.
That was my background. Now, were just trying to find ways that we can leverage technology
to add value to pastors and, hopefully, inspire you to move forward into what God has
planned for you.
With that in mind, were going to jump right into the 6Things Pastors Do To Kill Church
Growth. We want to try and add as much value as we can in this eBook. With that, Jerry, lets
consider the first mistake pastors make to kill church growth in chapter 1.

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Using Positive
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Richard : The first mistake is they are using positive reinforcement as

a guide. Right now, unfortunately, the church in America is losing
steam. We know that about 86% of churches are in decline. Another 6-7% are flat and only
6-7% are growing.
If youre in a church where the system is failing,but youre getting positive reinforcement from
people telling you how good a job you're doing, thats not good, because all that the positive
reinforcement is doing is reinforcing the idea that things are great. And right now, we need to
look at positive reinforcement and say thats not what we need right now. We need resistance.
Jerry, why dont you jump in right here and give some ideas on how positive reinforcement
might be holding us back and what it feels like to push against the plow on this.
Jerry : Everybody likes to be affirmed and likes to be told, That was a great sermon, pastor.
You did a good job. We eat that up. I do, and I know most pastors do. But I dont think we can
really trust that.
Heres why. I like to say it like this: The great sermon that I preached this weekend was Gods
gift to me, but the people who I brought into the church are my gift back to God.
What I mean by that is youre gifted. If youre able to get up in front of a lot of people and share
the Gospel, know theres some hard work, prayer and study, but most of that is Gods gift to
you. Americans number one fear is falling to their death. The second fear is public speaking.
The very fact that youre able to get up and youre not afraid, and youre able to confidently get
up and speak, means God gifted you with some abilities. Thats wonderful. Ive been amazed
through the years by how many small churches have great communicators really good
preachers. But Ive come to realize that youre not going to preach your church into changing
your community. Youre not going to preach your way into growing your church or ministry
effectiveness.
The truth is people dont want to disappoint you. By nature, most people are people-pleasers.
When they meet you at that back door, theyre going to say, Great job, pastor. And it may
have been a great job, but you cant rest on that. You cant say, Thats enough, because theres
so much more to do.
Jesus called us to make disciples. He called us to, I believe, build teams where disciples are
doing the work of ministry, and thats so much more than just a good presentation, good
singing, and good preaching.
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Richard : We know that for a church thats been around for a long
time, kind of like Daystar was before you started pastoring a
church that might be 60, 70, 80, or 100 years oldand you have members
who have been there for a halfacentury, when you begin to get momentum around this idea of
reaching new people for Christ, its going to cost you something. Theres going to be some pain
associated with it.
Talk a little bit about the pain that came when you decided, Im going to do something big here
and Im going to let God have His hands on it.
Jerry : There was a lot of pain involved in that. For a church thats been doing things a certain way
for such a long time, when you decide were going to be a more purpose-driven, more life-giving
kind of church, then theres change involved; you dont just keep doing the same old things over
and over again. You may not continue to have dinner on the grounds. You may not continue to
have Southern Gospel singing. There may be a lot of things that you change.
The way you present the message on the weekend is also different because the words you use
and the little catch phrases that people are used to that are kind of religious jargon go away
because you start thinking about the lost people that your church folks have been inviting.
Its painful to me. I catch myself. At least, when we started to make that change, I would catch
myself often saying what I could have said differently. So its painful to me. Its a little bit painful
for the people because we change things. Thats why you dont want to change it all at once but
gradually. You need to see your church not like a speedboat, but like a cruise ship. You can turn
that speedboat on a dime and everyone is okay, but if you try to turn a cruise ship really fast, it will
tip over and youd lose a lot of people. That kind of change is painful and it has to be taken slowly.
Richard : Did you have an experience where somebody you just absolutely knew was behind you
and then there was a point in time where they either werent behind you or they were gone?
Jerry : They were not only not behind me and not only gone, but they were in front of me. They
were against us. It was amazing when we changed. I learned from a great leader, Dr. Raymond
Culpepper. He told me once that the people who got you to where you are today will usually not
be the people to get you to where you want to go to tomorrow. It was so painful for me when I
heard him say that. It was more painful as Ive watched it unfold.
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Even former board members who left us were angry about the way
we changed and some of the things that happened. Listen, Im not one of those pastors who
just throw caution to the wind and say, This is the way its going to be. Leave if you dont like
it. There are some successful leaders who do it that way. I dont do it that way. Its painful when
someone leaves, but I cannot compromise the calling that we have, and the vision, the picture
of what we think ministry is supposed to look like. I cant compromise that for anyone. I have
to be willing to be a bold enough leader to lose people if absolutely necessary.
Richard : I think on the flip side of that, there are probably people who came out of the woodwork. You may not have even known them when you started this, but they came along beside
what you were doing. And had you not had the vision for growing this church and reaching
new people, those people would never have appeared.
Jerry : Theres no doubt that to say there are ten times more who come out of the woodwork
when those leave wouldnt even be accurate. I would probably have to say 50 to 100 times
more.
The benefits of following Gods calling and following the dream and vision that you have far
outweigh the liabilities of such. The only thing is sometimes, you will lose the ones youre
going to lose. And even if you dont lose them, theyre not as excited or as involved as they
used to be. That will happen on the front end.
You have to have faith to believe that the gains are going to come later. A lot of guys will not
sustain the energy that it takes to bring meaningful change, because you dont see the
change you want up front and its difficult to hang in there and wait for it.
Richard : Yes. Lets move on to the second mistake.
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Reinventing the Wheel

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Richard : There are far too many churches that are killing their growth
because theyre trying to reinvent the wheel. Theyre trying to come up
with a new way to do church, and I think thats especially a challenge for the church planter. I do
believe that God put something in every person whos going to plan a church that says, Youre
going to do this a brand new way. I think He puts it there to make you crazy enough to actually
plant a church.
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Talk about the peril of trying to reinvent the wheel.

Jerry : We did that. I think probably every pastor has tried to do that. Now there are so many
different resources out there. Theres all kinds of conferences you can go to. You can only get your
eyes on and your head around so many different models. Its a real dangerous trap.
Thats one of the things Dr. Owen Weston told us. Hes a consultant and one of my mentors and
one of the mentors for Daystar church. He said, Be very careful that you dont try to piecemeal
your model. You get a little something from Craig Groeschel, a little something from Andy
Stanley, a little something from Rick Warren, a little something from the Church of the Highlands.
Be careful not to do that.
Make sure you determine what youre trying to do. Whos doing something that is most like what
youre trying to do? Whos doing it in the same kind of environment with the same kind of
challenges that you face? And then learn from them.
Now, dont copy anyone. Dont just do what theyre doing.Your church is unique and there is no
other church like yours, but there are some churches out there that have a similar goal, similar
kind of idea of what they want to do, and some similar circumstances.
Honestly, Richard, thats why at Daystar we started training other churches. When Dr. Weston first
suggested to me that we do this 24toDouble and start training churches, I said, No one will
come and hear what we have to say.
But they did; they started asking, Youre in a small town and you dont have a very big budget.
Youre a lot like us. Were not in a mega city and we have to make a budget. How were you able to
take a church under 100 to over 500, then over 1,000, then over 1,500 and then over 2,000? There
were a lot of people who wanted that.
Thats why we decided to start doing the training that we do. There were people who liked the
model. Its a great model and they felt like it would applyin a lot of different circumstances.
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Thats what I would encourage pastors to do. Dont go away to

Catalyst and come home with five new things from Catalyst, and then go
to ARC Conference and come away with that, and then go to Exponential and come away with
that because,with piecemealing, you end up with a big mess. The leaders of those conferences
are all incredible leaders, and I go to those conferences and learn so much.
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However, in terms of the model for my church, I have to find that one model I can look to and
learn from. Its probably not someone whos church is 20,000 members stronger than mine. Its
someone whos right in front of me who I can learn from and whos been through some of the
same things that Ive been through, and who is accessible to share some of that knowledge.
Whatever that is for you, stay true to that. Learn from those people over and over and over again
as much as you can.
Richard : This reminds me of the quote, The confused mind says no. If you dont take some time
to really take a step back from your ministry and work on the ministry instead of working in the
ministry, I think what happens is you get blown by the wind. When you see somebody speak at
an event and they tell you about how much success they have with doing small groups this way
or leading their staff this way, if you dont have a comprehensive plan that you sat down and
thought through, then the next big idea is just around the corner. Its the next book you read, the
next video that you watch, or the next conference that you go to. That can be a dangerous cycle
to be in.
Jerry : A quick example of that is I went to Catalyst a few years ago, and a person I have the
utmost respect for, Francis Chan, was talking about the church they constructed in Southern
California. Its kind of like an old-time tabernacle. Theres not even walls. Its more like a stadium.
We had just built a big multi-million-dollar building. If I could say it, I felt like crap. Look at all that
money we wasted on brick-and-mortar. We should have sent that to the mission field like Francis
Chan and his church did.
I got home and we had some dreary, cold, rainy days. I thought, Ive never seen that in Southern
California. Then we had some blazing hot Alabama-like days like you really dont have in Southern California.
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I thought, I really have to look at me, my church, my community, and listen

to a couple of mentors who I can really learn from. Sure, I can be inspired by a lot of authors and
a lot of conferences, but, like you said, its really hard for my team back home my congregation,
my leaders to get on board when Im turning on a dime every six months because theres a new
conference out there.
Richard : That year, the last time Francis Chan was at Catalyst, I drove him to the airport when the
event was over with. We got to talking about my work doing church construction. We got about
halfway there, and he said, Man, you really enjoy what you do, dont you?
I said, Yeah. I feel like Im in the right place. I feel like Im where God wants me right now, doing
what He wants me to do. Then I asked, How about you?
I was just kidding, thinking he was going to say, Oh, I couldnt imagine my life being any better.
I could tell from the comments that he made that he was overwhelmed by his schedule. I finally
just told him, Francis, I go to just about every church conference there is because of my work,
and youre at all of them. Its okay to say no to some things.
I think thats important thing to realize right now while were talking about not reinventing the
wheel. What you say no to is going to be more important than what you say yes to. You have to
get that filter on that says, Not in my church, for most things. That clarity only comes when you
have a really well-defined vision of where youre going and a mapped-out strategy for how youre
going to get there.

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Too Many People Doing Favors

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Jerry : One of the phrases I tell people at Daystar all the time when we recruit people to serve,is,
Do me a favor and dont do me any favors. In most pastors churches all around America, the
people who are serving on ministry teams feel like theyre doing the pastor a favor.
It starts all the way from that moment when they come right up from the altar call experience.
They come to the front,they gave their life to Christ, and we immediately strap them with nursery
duty. Just in that very moment, theyre serving.
Most of the time, they stink at it. They still have tears in their eyes when you ask them, Will you be
willing to do this? Theyre going to do it because their heartsare open and they received something.
The truth of the matter is theyre neither passionate about that nor are they gifted at doing that.
So they end up doing something that theyre awful at, and you wish theyd stop doing it, but
youre embarrassed to get them to stop, and they want to stop doing it, but theyre guilty and
dont want to stop.
So what happens is they dont just stop doing that ministry; they just quit your church altogether
because theyre embarrassed about it.I call it the desperate volunteer model. We teach about that
in 24 to Double in one of the sessions.
We want to have people on a destiny-driven model. We have this simple little equation. We say
that your passion plus your spiritual gift equals your destiny. We have created a profile thats a gift
and passion profile where we help people answer a few questions, and that helps them determine what their spiritual gift mix is. Its not just any gift, but a gift mix. Also, they determine what
their area of passion is.
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serve in their calling. And when you get people serving in their calling,
then theyre doing it for God and not for you. As a pastor, Ive had people doing me favors serving
in different areas, and now I have people serving in areas because they feel called to do it. I cannot
tell you how big a difference that is, how wonderful it feels to know that these are folks getting up
every morningand theyre getting up particularly on the weekendand they say, Today is my
day to serve and Im going to do what God has called me to do as opposed to, Oh, my goodness,
should I call the pastor and tell him I cant be there again? Thats just so painful.
When you get to the place where people arent doing you a favor but theyve found their gift, and
you helped them find their gift and calling, thats like the difference between pushing a
wheel-barrel with a flat tire up hill and riding a go-cart downhill. Thats where you want to be:
helping people find their destiny.
Richard : This one hits the nail on the head for me. Ive been at my church here in Atlanta now for
about 15 years, and, for much of that time, we led small groups. I did a lot of time on the parking
team. I even led a parking team. I enjoyed that, but I think there was always this sense of what
your talking about. That I was doing the church a favor. About two-and-a-half years ago, I started
leading a high school small group, and the thought that Im doing my church a favor has not
crossed my mind since then.
I feel like not only am I getting an education on what its like to be a teenagers these years, which
is incredibly important for me, bringing up an 11-year-old daughter, but I like the idea of purpose
and belonging. I have these great friends now who are high school kids. I look back, and, as Im
looking at this gift, testing what were doing to get people in the right seat on teams, Im thinking
I couldve been doing this for 15 years, but, instead, I hopped around until I found the right spot
for me. This is a critical part of a ministry.
Find our Free Gift Test at VolunteerTest.com
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Richard : Another mistake that pastors are making that kill church
growth is they dont have quantifiable goals. They dont have

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No Quantifiable Goals

something theyre shooting for. Talk a little bit about that and the areas where thats important,
Jerry.
Jerry : That all begins with vision. Thats why we start Module 1 of 24toDoublewith vision. We say
that before you can do anything else, you have to find out what youre great at, what youre called
to do.
We use something called the Hedgehog Principle, which helps you find out where your vision
should be. Its a great little process to take your team through.
When you start with vision and then continue to recast vision, and that vision gets more and
more detailed and more and more specific, then people will know what it looks like when we win.
Andy Stanley said vision leaks. I think thats so true. Also,Rick Warren said that you have to restate
your vision every 30 days to your people. I believe thats so important because I think people will
live and die for vision, but, if it lacks clarity, they wont do anything. Theyll climb a mountain for
vision. They wont cross the road for lack of clarity. So we need to know what it is were after.
Habakkuk 2 tells us to put it on a billboard and make it very plain. Habakkuk 1 tells us that that
vision is based on your burden. You have a burden in your heart and that burden births a vision.
People need to know. They need to feel that.
Then make it quantifiable. On our teams, the worship team has goals they need to meet. The altar
team has a goal of a certain number of people who will raise their hand that they want to receive
Christ, and then we encourage them to come forward. We count the hands raised. We count how
many people came forward. We count how many people who made a commitment and get
baptized. We count how many people went from that commitment into our growth track, how
many went from 101 to 201 . We count it all. We measure it all.
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We even keep metrics on each individual staff member so that

the reason they get a pay raise is not because cost of living went up
3%, but because they met their benchmarks and they met their goals.
And if they dont meet their goals, the whole church doesnt mean its goals. I can be blowing it up
in youth ministry, but if the church didnt grow and the budget didnt grow, then I cant get a pay
raise in youth ministry. So everybody is tied into the whole team. It basically says if we all dont
win, I cant win. Thats a big part of how you get that camaraderie and that teamwork and everybody on board at the same time.
Richard : A big part of the way that you run Daystar and the way that 24toDouble runs is that
many of those staff members are responsible for one of these seven teams that we help build.
Theyre driven to get people in the right seat on those teams.
Jerry : Yes, and its very clear. When we started out, almost every team leader was a volunteer. I
think, to date, we have one of the seven teams that is led by a volunteer still. But, as Doc O
explained it to us,when the church grows, youll have people on staff in those positions. Early on,
almost every position was occupied by a volunteer, and they worked their way into that ministry.
The beautiful thing about the matrixand we wont get into that yet because its deep into the
process of 24 to Doublebut theres a matrix that really weaves all the team together. Its
impossible to have an independent team.
I was a youth pastor and I led a renegade team. I thought my youth group was better than the
whole rest of the church; I couldnt stand the childrens department, and they couldnt stand
me.But this matrix doesnt make that possible. It really causes everyone to come together, and its
a beautiful thing where we all share in the goals.
I have some specific goals for my department if Im a youth or childrens pastor, but there are
shared goals that we have to all meet together. Thats really the backbone of unity.
Richard : You touched on something a little bit there that I want to explore a little more. In my
years doing church construction and getting churches ready for that, I was always amazed to see
that facilities were not the largest expense for most churches. It was actually staff.
Talk about what the 24toDouble model has done to your staff costs.
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Jerry : The best way I can tell it is to quote the accountant who
does our church books. He is the second largest accountant for
churches in America, and he told me that he has never done church
books for a church that has less staff cost than Daystar. Hes done huge churches. He does T.D.
Jakess church. Hes done small churches and rural churches. He said theres never been a church
with a smaller percentage of staff.
Thats because we empower people, we build teams, and people have a path. They dont just go
straight from the altar to being over something. They find their gift and talent, and they grow and
mature, and there are places for them to expand. Its a process that helps people have a safe place
to serve and grow into a bigger area of responsibility.
Someone on our staff,Dave, was talking to a volunteerwho wanted to be in ministry. He told me
what he told the volunteer. He said, Basically, if you want to be on staff at Daystar, you just do so
much until they cant make it without you. Then you get a job. Incidentally, thats exactly what
Dave had done. Thats exactly how he got in the ministry: he did so much, we couldnt make it
without him. There are constantly people growing, because we make it so clear and so plain what
we want them to do, they will grow in their area of ministry and they love it, until eventually, as
the church is growing and we need a new position, theyre clearly the person we need.
Thats so huge. Thats so much better than going out and hiring some big gun from some other
church, because I dont know what he believes in, I dont know what his ethics are, and I dont
know what he thinks about me and my leadership or my church. I dont know if he likes our town.
There are so many variables that we get to bypass when we have great teams that are growing
our staff from within. There are still a few, but most of those variables are solved as theyve grown
up through our church.
Richard : The lead pastor of a church over in Athens that I built for told me a funny story. He told
me that one time that he interviewed five or six people for their small groups pastor and none of
them had ever led a small group.
To make a serious point, if youve ever had to fire somebody who looked good on paper but
couldnt get the job done, this will eliminate that. If you have people who work their way into a
positionso that when you start paying them, you know they can do what they say they can do, I
think thats grand.
This next point is a big one.
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One of the mistakes that will kill church growth is not having the
belief in yourself; doubting what God can do through you.

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Through You

Jerry: Yes, thats a problem when we think too small. I think theres a big problem, and then theres
a bigger problem. The big problem is when you take yourself too seriously. The bigger problem is
when you dont take yourself seriously enough. This may sound like a contradiction, but let me
explain it.
I think there are a lot of religious people who take themselves way too seriously. They cant be
called by their first name; they have to be called Bishop or pastor. They cant wear whatever they
feel comfortable wearing. They cant just talk in these terms; they have to have on their preacher
voice on Sunday and say big words that are learned in seminary. I think thats taking yourself too
serious.
But on the other hand, there are times that you need to take yourself more seriously. Im talking
to pastors. I want you to hear me when I say this: you are called by Heaven. We believe that the
church is the hope for all humanity and there is no plan B. You are it. The church is it, and youre
the leader. You need to take that calling seriously and you need to know that the vision that God
birthed inside of you, he is well capable of doing that thing.
You need to take it seriously that youre the temple of the Holy Spirit. He flows inside of you and
what He can do for you is beyond your ability.
When we started Daystar,my little church, we were in a town of 491 people. Before we left that
town, we had 800 in attendance. So, the town almost doubled on Sunday because we opened up
shop. Thats amazing!
I want to tell you that God is the same God for you. He can do huge things for you. It doesnt
matter. You dont have to keep looking at the Andy Stanleys and Craig Groeschels of the world
who are in bigger cities with different scenarios. Theres something big where you live. Theres
something huge in the heart of God where you live, and Hes chosen to speak to you about it.
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God, and the God who created them put gifts inside of them. Im passion about this, making
pastors know that they ought to be serious about their gift and calling, because God is very
serious. When He said, I formed you in your mothers womb and put gifts inside of you before you
were even born, I take that very seriously, and I think every pastor readingthis should as well.
Richard : A few weeks ago, I was in Texarkana, Texas,finishing a construction job of a $5 million
building that was a new sanctuary out there, and I got to be really good friends with the pastor,
Tim Montgomery, over that time. .
We built this incredible new worship facility for this church and a new childrens ministry building,
and a hallway or mezzanine that ran between the old building and the new one.We were standing in the mezzanine area of this church,and I thought, This hallway is going to change this
church, the way these people do church and the way they do community before and after
services. Tim and I were standing there talking, and I asked him, Did you ever think it would be
like this?
He said, In my wildest imagination, ten years ago when we were meeting in a boot store in Texarkana, Texas, I would never have imagined this.
Heres the point Im trying to make. You really cant think as big as where God is taking you, so
thinking small is dangerous, because even when you do think really big, God is going far above
and beyond that. We have to develop that muscle inside of usthat faith musclethat says, I
can. And even if I cant, He can. And were making ourselves available.
In my mind, the commitment to doing what God is calling you to do is more important than
being able to see clearly where Hes taking you, because Hes going to take you farther beyond
that.
Jerry : Thats a good one. Lets talk about the last one, number six.
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Jerry : Pastors kill their church by doing it all. Listen, Im a good

person to talk about this problem because Ive had this problem many
times. Im a Type A personality, a very detail-oriented person, and Im a controller.

Ive had to confess that and give that to the Lord, and Hes redeemed it and helped me be a good
leader, but, by nature, Im a controller, so its hard for me to let things go. I want to run everything.
I remember reading a book by John Maxwell in which he said, Great leaders walk slowly through
the crowd. Boy, that was like hitting me with a boat paddle in the face, because I didnt do that. I
wanted to be a great leader, and I thought I was a fairly good leader, but I clearly didnt do that
because I was doing too many things, especially on Sunday. Id be zipping through that sanctuary,
making sure this was right and that was right. If youre doing that, pastor, thats a clear sign that
youre doing too many things.
Heres what we tell our staff now that Ive learned that lesson over many years. I tell my team, We
dont hire doers. You cannot maintain your job by doing enough things. We hire leaders. I tell
them, If somehow you slip through the cracks and you got hired and youre a doer, then you
dont get to stay in this job until you learn how to be a leader.
I do a small group on leadership. I teach leadership principles, too. I tell my staff, If you think
maybe you slipped through the cracks and I havent found out yet that youre just a doer, then the
best thing to do is join my small group and let me teach you how to be a better leader because if
youre not empowering others, youre not doing the great commission. He didnt say 'Go and
make a big crowd. He said,'Go make disciples.
And when you think about what Jesus did, how did he do discipleship? He didnt say, Go to
Sunday school. Weve always said Sunday school is discipleship. He said, Come and follow me.
And so, first Jesus did and they watched him do it. And then they did it with Jesus. And then,
thirdly, they did it and Jesus watched.
Thats what great leadership is. If you could just boil it down to three things, you model it, you
partner in it, and then you watch as they do it.
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Thats a big part of what we teach in 24toDouble is empowering

leaders, showing people how to build teams so that constantly new
leaders are emerging. I love it because, every month,it seems like theres
some new leader emerging. Somebody will come up to me. In fact, the way Lance ended up
getting on our team as Executive Pastor was when he was on a youth ministry leadership team
and the youth pastor came up to me and said, Pastor, youve got to meet Lance. Hes an incredible leader.
We would have never known it if we were just doing all the stuff, but were constantly empowering people to do things, and then occasionally someone just blows the roof off the place and you
say, Wow, I had no idea there was someone with that much potential in the room. Again, that will
never happen until you start building teams and empower leaders to do things on their own.
Richard : One thing that comes to my mind is a book I read a while back called The 4-Hour Workweek. One of the questions that the author asks partway through that book is: if your doctor told
you that youre going to die unless you stop working except for two hours a day, what would you
do with those two hours a day? You work through that exercise of saying, Okay, if I were only
going to work two hours a day, I would do this, this, this, and this and hand everything else off.
The next thing the author asks is: what if you go back and your doctor says, Its not getting any
better. Now you can only work two hours a week. What would you do?
What reading that did for me was put me in the frame of mind of asking, What are the things that
only I can do, and how do I get to the point where I can hand off some of this other stuff?
Sometimes for you, pastor, that means you have to hand things off to people who are volunteers.
You have to seek them out, find out what theyre good at, and hand stuff off to them so that youre
not doing everything. This is what I do know: one man cannot grow a church. Its impossible. The
formula for keeping your church small is to do everything.
Jerry : I think its very irresponsible, too. Some people do have great capacity in doing things. That
was one of my challenges. Im a really good doer. Our church did grow when it was all leaning on
me. However, through prayer, God just convicted me and said, Jerry, this thing is not about you,
and if you went awayif something happened to you and you went awaythis whole thing
would come crashing down.
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churches built on one man, and the whole thing comes crashing
down. I just dont think thats Gods model for us. I dont think its his call at all. Thats why we are
so passionate about helping build teams. We built a whole church around seven teams that are a
logical step from the first time you will hear about our church all the way until youre fully
integrated. You go teams one through seven, and its like you have seven labs of team building
and seven labs of leadership building.
I just love knowing that I have all these teams and all these potential leaders growing up on a
daily basis. Its so exciting to be a pastor and know thats coming your way.
Richard:Thank you, Jerry! I'd like to summarize what we've examined by listing the 6 mistakes and
what our readers can do to avoid them.
1.

First, don't use positive reinforcement as a guide. That's like a politician only looking at

polls taken of party loyalists. While it's nice to receive compliments on a good sermon, don't let
that lull you into a false sense of complacency. Don't be afraid to initiate positive, gradual changes that will grow your church in the long run just because you might receive criticism and lose
some members in the short run.
2.

Don't try to reinvent the wheel by taking bits and pieces of systems to come up with a

new way to do church. Such a piecemeal approach wouldn't work for a school and it certainly
won't work for a church. To avoid this, first determine what youre trying to do. Then find out
whos doing something that is most like what youre trying to do in the same kind of environment
with the same kind of challenges. And then learn from them.
3.

Don't have too many people doing favors. When volunteers do something they don't

like and/or they're not good at out of a sense of obligation, it's a lose/lose situation. You wish they
would stop and they feel guilty and eventually stop or may even leave the church because of it.
But if you have volunteers doing what they're gifted at and have a passion for, then it's a win/win
situation that can only lead to growth.
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goals. That's like a coach telling his team that they're going to go out
there to play fair and have fun. That's not going to inspire them to do their best. He has to have a
vision: "We're going to go out there and win!" And it has to be a quantifiable goal to shoot for (e.g.,
14 wins and no losses). When you have teams working toward measurable goals they can
envision, you get a lot more done with fewer people. And as your church grows, people grow.
Volunteers become permanent staff and they know what they're doing.
5.

Don't doubt what God can do through you, but be careful to walk the fine line. On the

one hand, don't take yourself too seriously and become holier than thou. On the other hand,
don't diminish your importance as an instrument of God's will. Have the understanding that God
can work through you to accomplish greater things for your church than you can ever imagine.
6.

Finally, don't do it all yourself. Be a leader, not a doer. Let go of micromanaging every-

thing, and delegate. Ask yourself what you would do if you could only work a few hours a week,
then do those things and delegate the rest. Empower people to do things and some of them may
grow into leaders themselves.

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