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(OP)
7 Feb 02 02:04
Greetings
How accurate is Staad finite element analysis.In case of water
tank resting on soil, can we give springs only KFY value, not
releasing MX, MZ.e.g.
supports
1 to 200 KFY 24000
We get very less moments in bottom slab.
Please respond.
Regards.
arniec (Structural)7 Feb 02 10:15
goto Thread507-7222 - Staad vs competitors for some honest views about STAAD
a
JAE (Structural)7 Feb 02 12:56
Everybody...do you notice that on Eng-Tips we get a lot of STAAD questions? But very few
of other software vendors...is this because there are many more STAAD users or is it the
program?
Ron (Structural)7 Feb 02 13:09
JAE...I think it is both. STAAD has been popular despite its numerous shortcomings. I think
a lot of people have made the investment and don't want to throw that away, so they stick
with a program that they at least feel comfortable that they know many of its problems. Kind
of "the devil you know" syndrome.
Having said that, we can see from the numerous posts that many are just finding out how
error prone this software can be. You would think that Research Engineers would take to
heart some of the feedback they have gotten over the years. In my experience, they view the
problems to be mostly with the user, not the software.
Qshake (Structural)7 Feb 02 13:59
JAE, after reading your inquiry I was going to respond until I found RON had taken the
words right out of my mouth!
So this will be short...I second what RON has noted and urge the original poster to check out
the other staad post for some real feedback.
1161 (Materials)
(OP)
8 Feb 02 02:15
Thanks for replies.Please be more spscific that is can I give spring
support on soil as FIXED BUT KFY 12000(variable)
Regards.
nades (Structural)8 Feb 02 07:52
It has to be
FIXED BUT MX MY KFZ 12000.
because if you do not allow rotation about X and Y axis then
you should have all nodes prevented from rotaions and you may have
only one level of displaced nodes.
1161 (Materials)
(OP)
8 Feb 02 11:51
Thanks for response.
Tank is modelled as 3D resting on ground by Staad.
Can spring support be FIXED BUT KFY 12000.
Regards.
bylar (Structural)8 Feb 02 14:31
I know this does not answer your question but i see from the other responses that they have
had similar experiences with Staad that i have had. They blame all error or
inconsistencies on the user. This is the case even after i have shown them programming bugs
that arise.
I've invested the money and don't care to spend more for another engineering design system.
nades (Structural)8 Feb 02 15:53
Dear 1161,
Staad will not prevent you from defining springs as
FIXED BUT KFY 12000
..BUT, it is not realistic and does not represent reality.
in my view, this is wrong. it has to be
FIXED BUT MX MY KFZ 12000
in order to represent plate supported on springs.
kareemyas (Structural)9 Feb 02 10:48
Dear nades, I think what 1161 says about the soil spring to be KFY is correct, as staad
considers y direction as the normal gravity direction,the direction in which all soils support
the structures resting on them.
danmccarthy (Civil/Environmental)12 Feb 02 09:14
STAAD is the most popular structural analysis program because it is much cheaper than the
more comprehensive (and more accurate) programs such as STRUDL or ANSYS.
If you are performing an analysis which requires the accuracy of finite elements, it would be
best to use a package better than STAAD. STAAD has a very limited library of elements and
provides very poor description of its available elements and their strength and limitations. I
have known several engineers who have used STAAD for finite element analysis and had
disasterous results. Also, the user support services for STAAD is very poor compared to other
products if you run into problems
.
For basic structural analysis STAAD is probably all you need. It is easy to use and relatively
accurate. However, you would be fooling yourself to think it does advanced analysis properly.
It will give you an answer but the answer may be wrong.
wmccain (Structural)12 Feb 02 09:38
Gents:
I am a registered user of STAAD. It does have several shortcomings,
however, if you stick to "standard" problems with finite elements, you
can get good results. I have, for instance checked the plates against
an analytical solution for vertical walls with varous loadings and found
STAAD to be accurate.
1161 (Materials)
(OP)
12 Feb 02 22:25
Thanks for responses.How is it if the tank supports are given PINNED as done in Staad
manual example no.10.Please comment.
Qshake (Structural)12 Feb 02 22:53
Gee, if I had a verification problem and I posted/published the results I guess I would make
sure the problem was such that any comparison looked favorably on me too.
However, Gentlemen, we are asking you to step out into the unknown, to really apply the
product to engineering problems and not textbook examples. In this area, I ask you, are you
completely satisfied with the STAAD product?
I have used STAAD for a number of years and have always felt that the problems I analyzed
were appropriate for the software. In that respect, I got exactly what I needed from
STAAD. But I will not perform complex dynamic analysis or FEA with the program. Which
that program is marketed to do but doesn't live up to those expectations.
wmccain (Structural)12 Feb 02 23:27
I feel compelled to respond to the
irresponsible remarkes by QSHAKE. The
"baseline" used to measure the accuracy
of the STAAD solution is stated in my
original post. The type of element used
is explained in the STAAD manuals. ERRORS
in a numerical analysis are dependent upon
boundary conditions and assumptions in
the analysis itself, as well as on
the numerical method. I see in this forum
numerous examples of faulty boundary conditions
associated with the use of the STAAD elements
in foundation mats or tank bottoms. The post
I responded to as well as previous and following posts
are prime examples of this.
For 1161(visitor)
For example: A moment's thought will enlighten one
to the fact that to make joints in a soil supported
tank bottom pinned in X and Z would be an error. Also,
as suggested in another post, to fix moments in Z, X,
and Y, would be in error.
These conditions would produce nonsensical results.
To evaluate a structural force associated with a
degree of freedom, one must release that degree
of freedom.
The Example 10, which is in the STAADPro 2001 Online
Documentation, is, as far as I am concerned, in error.
I will not work a problem such as this in the manner
suggested by STAAD. I refer you to the post I placed