Face the Nation transcripts June 9, 2013: Ayotte, Gillibrand,

Speier, Cummings, McCaul & Dingell

(CBS News) Below is a transcript of "Face the Nation" on June 9, 2013, hosted by CBS News' Bob
Schieffer. Guests include: Sens. Kelly Ayotte, R-N.H., and Kirsten Gillibrand, D-N.Y., Reps. Michael
McCaul, R-Texas, Elijah Cummings, D-Md., Jackie Speier, D-Calif., and John Dingell, D-Mich. Plus, a
panel with David Sanger, Rajiv Chandrasekaran, Joseph Nye and CBS News correspondent Margaret
Brennan. Finally, an update on Nelson Mandela from CBS News' Debora Patta.

SCHIEFFER: And good morning again. Former South African president Nelson Mandela, who is 94,
was hospitalized overnight for a recurrent lung infection. His condition continues to be serious but
stable. So we're going first to Pretoria and CBS News reporter Debora Patta.
DEBORA PATTA, CBS CORRESPONDENT: A presidential spokesman said he has heard no word
regarding Nelson Mandela's health from his doctors. This means the official statement still stands;
he is serious but stable and able to breathe on his own. CBS News has also been told that he had a
good night's rest. Family members have been to see him. His wife Graca Machel was with him when
he was rushed to hospital. She's been by his side ever since and we're told this is a source of great
comfort for him. The South African nation has been also been asked to pray for Nelson Mandela at
Sunday morning church services. Now, you have to understand that Nelson Mandela has been
hospitalized four times since Christmas. His health has deteriorated in recent months, and every
time it is the same problem, a recurring lung infection. And whilst he has around-the-clock medical
care at his Johannesburg home, he needs a special machine that is only available in hospital to treat
this condition. A presidential spokesman says that whilst there is still public anxiety around
Mandela's health, there is growing acceptance that he is an old man. And this was echoed by an old
friend, Andrew Mlangeni, who spent many years in prison with Mandela. He says "It is now time to
let Mandela go." And certainly there is a sense that the South African nation is hoping for the best
but preparing for the worst. Bob?
SCHIEFFER: Thank you so much, Debora. And now, back in Washington, we're joined by the
chairman of the House Homeland Security Committee, Congressman Mike McCaul, who's in Austin,
and the top Democrat on the House Oversight Committee, Elijah Cummings; he is in Baltimore. And,
gentlemen, we have plenty to talk about. Let's start with these leaks that are coming about. Has
NASA, in your view -- or, I should say, the NSA, in your view, Mr. Chairman, overreached with these
latest disclosures we're hearing about, about gathering all this data about people's telephones and
so on?
MCCAUL: Well, I think that is the issue that Congress will be looking at, providing our oversight
responsibilities. Let me say first, though, that this is a -- was a lawful program. It was approved and
reviewed by the FISA court. So you had that approval. It has -- the program itself has stopped

terrorist attacks in the past, including the 2009 New York subway bombing plot by Mr. Zazi. But, on
the other hand, it does raise concerns, I think, on several levels. One was, when I was a
counterterrorism federal prosecutor, we could take the number and run them through the phone
companies, through a national security letter or subpoena. Now what has happened is they have
literally taken all these phone records and maintained them, taken them out of the private sector
and maintained them in the public sector within the NSA. And I think that gives a lot of Americans
great pause and great concern. And lastly, if I could just say, the optics are terrible in this case when
you consider the latest scandals, whether it be the IRS targeting conservatives, whether it be the AP
being targeted by the Justice Department, and the Fox News reporters. It really makes you wonder -you have to ask yourself this question, is can you trust this administration with your phone records?
SCHIEFFER: Well, I guess I would ask you, then, do you believe that they ought to be curtailed, even
if it is legal now, as you say? Have they gone too far? Should new steps be taken to restrict the
government in being able to do this?

MCCAUL: Again, I think it's the warehousing of all the phone records from all the major carriers
within the federal government is what gives most people the great concern. I think it could be run
through the private sector as we used to do it, and that's something I think we'll be looking at in the
Congress. You know, I think there's a fix to this. On the other hand, you know, look, this program,
you're talking about national security; you're talking about protecting American lives, and that's our
number one mission.
SCHIEFFER: All right. Well, let me get to Mr. Cummings. What's your take on this, Congressman?
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