INDEPENDENT PUBLIC INQUIRY INTO GULF WAR ILLNESSES

MINUTES OF PROCEEDINGS

held at

1 The Abbey Garden, London, SW1P 3SE

on

Monday 19 July 2004

DAY TWO

Lord Lloyd of Berwick, in the Chair

Dr Norman Jones
Sir Michael Davies

(From the Shorthand Notes of:

W B GURNEY & SONS LLP
Hope House
45 Great Peter Street
LONDON SW1P 3LT)

THE CHAIRMAN: One always knows, ladies and gentlemen, when it is time to start; one
can hear the clock of Big Ben. Can I just start by saying that I wrote, if you will remember, to
the Ministry of Defence with a copy to the Department of Health on 29 June inviting them to
take part in the Inquiry. I have now had a letter back from the Ministry of Defence signed by
Mr Ivor Caplin, and he says that in his view, or in the Governments view, it is not
appropriate for ministers or officers or serving members of the Forces to take part in the
Inquiry. But he does go on to say, happily, that the Ministry of Defence will make all relevant
documents available to the Inquiry and they will do that by the end of this month. I assume
that what goes for the Ministry of Defence goes also for any relevant documents in the
possession of the Department of Health.
I have replied to Mr Caplins letter as follows: I am grateful for your letter of 12 July and
for your offer to make all relevant documents available. We look forward to receiving them
by the end of the month. I agree with you that they will provide the necessary background for
the Inquiry. If, having read the documents and heard more of the evidence from veterans and
experts, we find that there are specific questions to which we need to know the answer,
perhaps I could come back to you. That is where the matter remains at the moment.
We are expecting to get all relevant documents by the end of the month. It may take us some
time actually to read those documents but at least that is the next step forward. I do not
suppose there are any questions about that. If not, could we start this mornings proceedings?
Our first veteran this morning is Mr Richard Turnbull.
MR RICHARD TURNBULL, Called
1. THE CHAIRMAN: Good morning, Mr Turnbull. First, can I say thank you very much
for coming this morning. I hope everything has been made comfortable for you.
A. Yes,
thank you very much. Thank you for giving me the opportunity to address this Inquiry.
2. THE CHAIRMAN: Could you start by giving your name and address for the purpose of
the shorthand note and then tell us what you would like, and take your time.
A. My name
is Richard Turnbull. My address is 32 Claremont Avenue, Garden City, Deeside, Flintshire,
CH5 2SN. I am 52 years old. I served in the Royal Air Force for 18 years. On 26 November
1990 I was flown out to the Gulf where I served at RSAF Dharan in the job of NBC
COLPRO, collective protection shelter erection. On 4 January 1991 everyone in the camp at
Dharan was ordered to attend for inoculations with the stipulation that non-attendance would
be met with disciplinary action.
When we attended the next morning for these inoculations we were given no information at
all about what we were receiving. We were given no chance to ask about possible side effects
to the massive number of injections they were planning to give us. On the morning of 4
January over a ten minute period I received, to my knowkledge, anthrax, Bubonic Plague,
Cholera, Typhoid, Yellow Fever, Hepatitis A, Hepatitis B, meningitis and a couple of others I
am not too sure about. These were not given as single injections but as inoculations
containing two or three vaccinations at a time.
3. THE CHAIRMAN: Can you just remind me, where did you receive those?
A. 4626
Field Hospital, Dharan. After I had the inoculations I personally had problems with
respiratory difficulties and chest pains and two of my electricians collapsed with high fever
and severe respiratory distress. They were taken back to the accommodation and left for three
2

days with no medical treatment because the Americans were not to be told what inoculations
we had had. After three days of severe distress these men were moved to a hospital where the
Americans went. We were very angry about the state they had been left in.
Before the Gulf War I was a sub-aqua diver and, as such, I was subject to annual medicals on
my lungs, heart, etcetera. I did the lung function exercise every year and ECG and other
exercise. I have never doubted the Gulf War ---4. THE CHAIRMAN: What was the state of your health before the inoculations, did you
say?
A. My health was A1 fit. In November 1990 I had had my sub-aqua diving medical
and I was declared A1 fit. My coronary and respiratory system and general fitness was A1. I
have never dived since the Gulf War due to chronic asthma and chest pains on attempting to
dive. On 19 and 20 January 1991 I was in charge of an NBC team that was monitoring the
collective protective shelters overnight when a Scud missile was intercepted overhead of
Dharan by a Patriot missile. The warhead landed about 400 yards from our position and 27
NIADs, none of them connected to any of the others, all sounded the alarm for chemical
weapons detection. We kitted up into full NBC kit and we went forward and carried out a
detection check with the chemical agent monitor, which again confirmed the presence of a
nerve agent. We informed the NBC patrol cell who put the station into NBC Black, which is
the highest alert state of chemical weapons detected, for 20 minutes. They then put us back
into NBC White for 20 minutes, which is the all clear situation, before putting us back into
NBC Black for eight hours with no further attack.
When asked about these NIADs going off and the CAMs positive reaction, I was informed
that it was due to unburned fuel on aircraft take-off, which was very strange as during the
incoming attack we had no aircraft taking off at the time. These instruments were
permanently manned and permanently on watch and never once before or after gave any
indication of chemical weapons. I took one of the affected NIADs into a sterile area, the
COLPRO, where I introduced it to normal aviation fuel and other substances that were
supposed to have an effect on them and not once did this NIAD react as being in the presence
of chemical weapons.
Since the return from the Gulf War my health has gradually deteriorated to where I am now
disabled. I rely completely on my wife for everything. I have severe cardiac problems,
severe respiratory difficulties, mobility difficulties. I have postural hypotension where when I
stand up my blood pressure collapses and I collapse if I stand up too quickly. I suffer from
syncopathy where if I cough too hard I literally just pass out. My life is destroyed by the Gulf
War. I believe the information that this Inquiry really needs to see is to speak to Group
Captain Will Coker, a man of honesty and integrity who was removed from post because he
would not lie and bend to the official policy on Gulf War Illness. The mans words were, to
me, not hearsay. The man is a gentleman, he is very honest and sincere. I believe that his
evidence is of vital importance to this Inquiry.
5. THE CHAIRMAN: We are very grateful. Is there anything else you would like to say
now?
A. No, thank you.
6. THE CHAIRMAN: What is the position about your pension? When did you first apply
for a War Pension?
A. When I first applied for a War Pension I applied for Gulf War
Syndrome and my form was returned to me stating that there was no such illness, I could
claim for individual illnesses one by one. I was awarded a ten per cent War Pension. With
the help of the Royal British Legion I fought this.
3

7. THE CHAIRMAN: When was that?

A. That was in September 1995. With the help
of the British Legion I appealed against this and my pension was increased to 20 per cent, at a
following appeal to 30 per cent, at a following appeal to 50 per cent, at a following appeal to
70 per cent and finally 90 per cent now.
8. THE CHAIRMAN: Just give us the dates roughly. How long did it take you to get to 90
per cent?
A. From 1995 to 2003. I have no claim for compensation recorded against the
Government because I believe a War Pension is my compensation. I have no financial
interest in the outcome of this Inquiry as I joined the Forces knowing about the risks I had to
take and the resulting inoculations, it was in an attempt to save my life.
THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you very much, Mr Turnbull.
colleagues would like to ask you anything.

I do not know whether my

9. DR JONES: Thank you very much. Can I clarify one thing first. You kindly submitted
a statement here and a good deal of it is in the third person, there are direct quotes from you,
the rest is written by someone else. Who is that?
A. That must be the one from the
Defence Select Committee which I never submitted, no. If it is the one I am thinking of, that
would be the one I submitted to the Defence Select Committee in 1994.
10. DR JONES: So this is an extract from that?

A. That is an extract from that, yes.

11. DR JONES: Although it does refer to a 90 per cent full War Pension and that did not
come about until 2003.
A. No, that did not come until 2003. I am sorry, I have not
submitted that document myself.
12. DR JONES: It is totally compatible with what you have been saying.
submit that document.

A. I did not

13. DR JONES: You can remember all of those vaccinations. In fact, you stated
somewhere you had 14 in about ten minutes, which is one every 43 seconds.
A. That is
correct. They were given not as individual inoculations, there were sometimes two, three or
four in one inoculation.
14. DR JONES: In one fell swoop as it were?

A. Yes.

15. DR JONES: Anyway, in a very short period of time?

A. You were stood there
with one person that side injecting you and one person that side injecting you.
16. DR JONES: You could do nothing about it.
A. The only reason I am so sure of the
inoculations I had is I was working at 4626 at the time building the COLPRO so I was treated
as staff and I was discussing these and concerns about them.
17. DR JONES: You really became unwell pretty well immediately.
A. Within two
hours I started suffering a fever and respiratory difficulties which were put down to Saudi Flu,
which was the answer to all illnesses out there.
18. DR JONES: Which obviously you had never suffered from before as a diver?

A. No.

19. DR JONES: I just want to clarify a statement here. I will read it out to you as there is
some doubt as to this document. The stumbling block to his claim, that is your claim, was
that the WPA refused, and continue to refuse, to recognise the existence of Gulf War
4

Syndrome. Was that the reason that was stated?

A. That is correct, although I should
point out that the DSS accepted Gulf War Syndrome on my sick notes quite happily.
20. DR JONES: You are obviously quite disabled now. You refer to cardiac problems,
heart problems, do you know what those are?
A. I have suffered five heart attacks and I
am also suffering unstable angina.
21. DR JONES: Unstable angina.
A. Yes, which the War Pensions Appeal Tribunal
have accepted as attributable to my service in the Gulf.
22. DR JONES: They have accepted that?

A. Yes.

23. DR JONES: There is that and the obvious problem in moving about and walking,
which have been the main things which have disabled you and stopped you from working?
A. The cardiac, the respiratory and the ---- There is no real distinction, they are all there as
part and parcel.
DR JONES: Thank you.
24. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: Could I ask one question. Some of the veterans who spoke
to us last week told us that they had injections both before they went to the Gulf and again in
the Gulf. You only had the one series in the Gulf.
A. I was informed in August 1990
that I was going to the Gulf at Christmas. I had no injections prior to those received on 4
January 1991.
25. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: In the Gulf?

A. In the Gulf.

26. THE CHAIRMAN: You referred to the vaccinations you received and the injections.
Did you have any tablets or were you asked to take any tablets?
A. Yes, at the time we
were taking anti-malarial tablets, novocaine, Linocaine and we also took the nerve agent Pre
treatment.
27. THE CHAIRMAN: Perhaps you have mentioned those but could you tell us a bit more
about your experience of those?
A. I and a lot of other people found that taking these
tablets gave us severe gastric problems, intestinal problems, diarrhoea. Also peoples moods
changed. You found people becoming very aggressive to one another, which had not been
there before. There were quite a few instances of people lashing out at one another. Whether
that was just stress from the war situation or the tablets, they had not been seen before these
tablets were issued to us.
28. THE CHAIRMAN: What was the dosage of the tablets, can you remember?
A. I
think it was 60mg three times a day. We were taking them from about 4 January to 28
February.
29. THE CHAIRMAN: We are very grateful to you for coming this morning, Mr Turnbull.
Please do stay and listen to what the others have to say.
A. I am afraid I will have to get
back because the travelling is a long distance for me, so I will not be staying but I will be
getting a transcript if I can. Thank you very much and good luck with your Inquiry.
The Witness Withdrew
THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you very much. I think the next witness is Ms Humphreys.
5

MS ANWEN HUMPHREYS, Called

30. THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you very much for coming this morning. We have had a
statement now which I think was produced this morning, for which we are grateful. Before
we come to that, could we ask you to give your name and address for the purpose of the
record? A. My name is Anwen Humphreys. I live at 32 Pitmedden Close, St Mellons in
Cardiff.
31. THE CHAIRMAN: What would you like to tell us about your experience? Am I right
in thinking that you never actually went to the Gulf yourself?
A. That is correct, I never
left the UK.
32. THE CHAIRMAN: Perhaps you could start at the beginning and just tell us. A. Shall
I just read through the statement?
33. THE CHAIRMAN: That would be perfectly convenient if that is what you would like
to do or if you would like to shorten it you can.
A. I think it might be easier because I
tend to go off track and I will end up talking about my holidays or something like that instead!
I firmly believe that I am suffering from what is commonly known as Gulf War Syndrome.
Furthermore, I strongly suspect the reason for my ill health is due to the inoculations I
received in preparation for the 1990/91 Gulf War. I say this because prior to receiving the
vaccines I was an extremely fit and energetic person who lived life to the full. During my
service I represented command and the Royal Air Force at hockey and netball and also took
part in numerous sporting activities at station level. My standard of life, the ability to keep fit
and play sport changed very soon after the inoculations.
I was stationed at RAF Linton on Ouse when my draft notice for the Gulf came through. My
state of readiness kept on changing throughout the conflict, but I never actually left the UK.
In October 1990 I went to the medical centre, had a full medical and was passed fit for
deployment. I was then given my first lot of inoculations. In November, I was given a sugar
lump and two more inoculations. On both occasions I asked what I was being given, I was
told its what everybody whos going to the Gulf is having. I handed over my B Med27,
which is a personnel inoculation card, to get the inoculations recorded on it and was told there
was no need. I questioned this, and the reason I did question it was because if you did not
have that up to date it was a chargeable offence. When I questioned it they turned round and
told me that the information was being held elsewhere, so I left it at that.
Within hours of receiving the first set of inoculations my left arm started to swell up and I had
quite a bad sore throat. I was working nights and at about ten oclock I was feeling really ill
so I rang the duty medic. He sent over two Paracetamols and told me not to worry, that it was
probably just a reaction from the inoculations I had had earlier in the day. By midnight the
swelling in my arm had become so severe that my fingers were the size of sausage. I was
feverish, my head was pounding, my eyes were sensitive to light, my throat was sore, I could
not move my neck because my glands were swollen, I was being physically sick and I was
shaking like a leaf. I phoned the duty medic again and insisted on a doctor coming to see me.
The doctor took one look at me and sent me off straight away. I was off for about a week
with these symptoms. Within weeks of receiving the inoculations I knew there was
something wrong physically but I did not know what. I just was not myself. I constantly felt
like I was coming down with flu, my joints were sore and my muscles ached with a sort of
burning sensation. I had a recurring sore throat, bad stomach cramps, headaches, night sweats
6

that had a strange sort of smell, and a numb tingling pins and needles sensation in my arms,
legs and the back of my head. I constantly felt tired. I could not eat properly. If I put food in
my mouth I began to heave or threw up. I did not have the strength, energy or stamina that I
used to have. At the end of a day shift I would go to bed for a few hours because I was
exhausted. I began falling asleep on nights. I would go out for a short run and by the time I
came back it felt like I had run a marathon. Circuit training and playing sport became
impossible because my muscles would just seize up.
34. THE CHAIRMAN: Just before we go on, can you remember how many inoculations
you received and over what period, or what they were for?
A. From what I can
remember, I received three in October, the ones that made me really ill, and there was a sugar
lump and two more which were late November, early December.
35. THE CHAIRMAN: Five in all?

A. I think. I cannot be 100 per cent sure of that.

36. THE CHAIRMAN: Can you remember at all what they were for?
A. I have not
got a clue what they were. Like I said, I asked but I was not told. In 2001 I wrote to find out
what I actually had and the only thing they would admit to was Cholera but I know I had more
than one.
37. THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you.
A. I kept on going to see the camp doctors but
they could find nothing wrong with me and put my illnesses down either to a mild virus, the
headaches were put down to migraine and the stomach cramps were put down to IBS. It was
just left at that. I left the Air Force in 1992 and since then I have been sacked from eight
different jobs. This is all because of my ill health. I have not been able to work for about five
years now. Those are the same symptoms recurring as soon as I go to work. I feel fine and
then I will be quite ill again. Between 1993 and 2001 my life was a complete mess, I did not
know if I was coming or going. There would be times when I was really well and could do
nearly anything I wanted to; there were times when I was so ill I could not get out of bed.
There were also the in-between times when I would sort of drift between being well and being
ill.
During this period between 1993 and 2001 my physical symptoms started to affect me
mentally. I just could not cope. I was not actually suicidal but I was quite happy to go to bed
at night and not wake up in the morning. I would actually put myself in dangerous situations
where I could be harmed. I began doubting myself: why did anybody not find out what was
wrong with me? Were these pains for real or was I making it all up? Was I going mad? I
tried to ignore these problems and carry on regardless because it was all in my mind, that was
what I was always being told. The problems did not go away, instead they got much worse.
In 1996 I met Dr D A Jones, who is the psychiatrist for traumatised ex-servicemen. I met him
by accident after collapsing one day in work. We started chatting and at the end of the
conversation he asked me if I had ever served in the Gulf because from what I had been
saying to him he thought I could be suffering from Gulf War Syndrome. Although at the time
I had noticed from TV and newspaper articles that my symptoms were very similar to those of
Gulf veterans, I did not believe that I could be suffering from Gulf War Syndrome because,
from what I understood at the time, the reason for their ill health was due to the oil fires, the
pesticides and the fallout that took place over in the Gulf. As I never went to the Gulf, how
could I be suffering from Gulf War Syndrome? I had to wait nearly six years before I got a
satisfactory answer to this and it came through in 2001. I was asked by Y Byd ar Bedwar,
which is a Welsh language programme, to take part in a documentary on Gulf War Syndrome.
7

As part of this programme I went to the United States and had my blood tested for squalene
antibodies. I was the first British non-deployed person to have this test done. To everybodys
surprise it came back positive +1 for squalene antibodies.
38. THE CHAIRMAN: I am sure we will have expert evidence on this, but what do you
understand by squalene antibodies?
A. From what I understand about it, first of all it
must be injected, squalene that has been injected to make the vaccine work better. It causes
autoimmune disease. That is basically all I understand about it. How it actually works and
everything, I am not sure.
39. THE CHAIRMAN: That was the result of an investigation carried out in the United
States, as I understand it?
A. Yes, that is right. It was Pam Asa.
40. THE CHAIRMAN: Do you know of any other veterans who have had the same
experience?
A. No. I think she has seen other people but who had been deployed. I
think there might have been four or five who had been deployed. As a non-deployed person I
did not know very much about Gulf War Syndrome until this stage. I had met about two Gulf
War veterans between 1990 and 2001. Dr Moonie, who was the Minister for Veterans at the
time, also took part in the programme and categorically denied the use of squalene as an
adjuvant. This was confirmed in a letter dated 31 August which was written by Mr Stephen
Trout on Mr Moonies behalf. In March 2003, less than 18 months after their categorical
denials, vials of British anthrax were washed up on the South Coast. These vials were tested
and found to contain squalene, thus repudiating the MoDs claim that squalene was not used
as an adjuvant.
In the same letter, Mr Trout appears to try and deflect the issue away from my concern about
squalene antibodies causing ill health by stating: Squalene is a naturally occurring substance
in all our bodies, and is sold as a nutritional supplement. Although squalene is a substance
that occurs naturally in our bodies, the blood taken in the USA proved positive to squalene
antibodies, which is something totally different. As I said, it is my understanding that it must
be injected to induce these antibodies and these antibodies are the things that cause the health
problems, such as Lupus, MS and autoimmune disease, which are often found in Gulf War
veterans.
41. THE CHAIRMAN: Mr Trout, as I understand it, is a civil servant. He is not medically
qualified in any way, or is he?
A. I have no idea. I was writing to Mr Moonie and he
could not be bothered to write back, he got somebody else to write back in his place. I do not
know who Mr Trout is. He is just the person who signed the letters on Mr Moonies behalf.
42. THE CHAIRMAN: Yes.
A. As a lay person, I do not understand the relationship
between the squalene antibodies and the ill health of veterans, or any ill health. I do not know
what the relationship is and in my best opinion the person to ask for this would be Pam Asa
who got the test up and running and is an expert in the field. The MoD rejects the research
done by Mrs Asa and her team. In their defence, they cite Colonel Alving, who is the
adjuvant guru for the Department of Defence in the USA, and constantly refer to a letter
published in 2000 condemning the Asa teams research, stating that it had numerous
shortcomings, some of them serious, thus invalidating the authors conclusions. Yet the
MoD failed to mention that Colonel Alving repeated Pam Asas work and got the same results
but refused to publish his paper. He is also the same person who found out that squalene had
to be injected to induce antibodies, or that blood samples of British veterans waiting to be
8

analysed have been put on hold because he is now in a battle with the Asa team over the
patent rights.
Even though other research, including their own, points towards a possible link between
vaccines and ill health, the Government appear to want to sweep this under the carpet and
prefer to cloud the issue by trying to convince everybody, especially the medical professions,
that the main cause of Gulf War Syndrome is psychological. I believe these tactics have
prevented me from getting the proper medical referrals, tests and treatments I need to control
my illness. Although I still have major physical problems, since visiting the States in 2001
my quality of life has improved. I may never be cured but having a better understanding of
my illness has enabled me to take some control. Had I continued to put my trust and faith in
the British Government, the Ministry of Defence and the medical establishment, I do not think
I would be here today. The Government and the MoD may not wish to publicly announce
their failings but the least they can do is take responsibility for their actions.
43. THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you very much indeed for that. Could you just tell us what
the position about your pension is?
A. I have a 60 per cent War Pension. I started off in
1992 with a 20 per cent War Pension for injuries to my knees and to my thumb.
44. THE CHAIRMAN: You got your 60 per cent pension in 1992?
had a 20 per cent War Pension.

A. No. In 1992 I

45. THE CHAIRMAN: Yes.

A. In 1995 or 1996 I asked for it to be reviewed and I
had the 60 per cent. That was when they took the IBS and chronic fatigue and fibromyalgia.
46. THE CHAIRMAN: Not Gulf War Syndrome but ----A. No. Actually when I
filled out the medical form I put Chronic fatigue/Gulf War Syndrome/fibromyalgia and they
came back and said that I could have the fibromyalgia and the chronic fatigue but not a word
about Gulf War Syndrome. They did not say no and they did not say yes, it was just sort of
ignored.
47. THE CHAIRMAN: That is a very full statement you have given us. What would you
want the Government to do for you now, as it were?
A. As I tried to explain in my
statement, I think the biggest problem that we have is that the Government are trying to
persuade the medical people that we are all mad, we all have depression, we all have PTSD
and we all have psychological problems. The biggest reason for my ill health before 2001
was not having an understanding of it and I was going mad because I was being told, This is
all in your mind, dont worry about it. Once we get you on to the anti-depressants, which I
was on for over seven years at a very high daily rate, you will be okay taking those antidepressants. I was not okay. They say I have got chronic fatigue syndrome and the best
thing for chronic fatigue syndrome and fibromyalgia is exercise, but the worst thing you can
do if you have got an autoimmune disease, which I probably do have but cannot get checked
out, is exercise and overdoing things. The reason that I am now in the position that I am, that
I can do things and everything, is because autoimmune disease has been explained to me, I
understand how far I can go and what I should do and what I should not do to help that
disease process. I tried to be referred to somebody in the UK who will give me tests for
Lupus and such like but nobody wanted to know, they said Ah, you are seeing the
psychiatrist, you are okay, you are being treated for Gulf War Syndrome.
48. THE CHAIRMAN: The one thing I think we do know is that you must have been
extremely fit and well before you received the inoculations.
A. Oh, I was very, very fit.
9

THE CHAIRMAN: I think that is obvious.

49. DR JONES: Thank you very much for a very clear statement, it helps us a lot. I have
one or two points of detail. Can I just clarify, although it is pretty clear, that when you had
those inoculations you handed over your personnel inoculation document.
A. That is
right, yes.
50. DR JONES: You were told that was not necessary because they were being recorded
elsewhere.
A. Exactly.
51. DR JONES: Do you have any idea whether they were recorded elsewhere in any form?
A. I have no idea. I did write to PMA at RAF Innsworth where they keep all our files and
requested my medical file and my personnel file. In my personnel file, every movement that I
made, even a days detachment to another unit, is recorded on that. There is nothing at all
whatsoever, not even a little snippet, of anything to do with my deployment to the Gulf.
There were a lot of Gen Acs put on it. In my medical file there are three words that are
partially obscured by another entry and you can only just make out that it says Fit Operation
Granby. When I wrote and questioned this I had a reply from RAF Innsworth saying they do
not understand why my recollection appears to be so different from what is actually recorded.
It is as if I never went, never had anything to do with it.
52. DR JONES: Thank you very much. This is not an easy question to answer but perhaps
you might be able to help us. You say you have lost up to eight jobs.
A. That is right,
yes.
53. DR JONES: Of the various medical problems that you have listed, can you put your
finger on any one major factor that has led to the loss of those jobs?
A. Yes, my bad
temper. Irritability more than anything. The reason for that is because of the muscular pains
and cramps and everything. That used to get me down. I would be in so much pain I would
get tetchy with people and instead of speaking nicely to them I would snap at them and that
causes all sorts of problems with the people you work with. Some of the jobs I was sacked
from I was sent a letter Dont come back, others I sat down with the personnel officer and
we agreed that my being there was not beneficial to the other people I was working with.
That was how I managed to get eight jobs in a short time, because I was not getting sacked all
the time.
54. DR JONES: Have you ever been seen in the Medical Assessment Programme?
A. I
was not going to go into that part of it because that just makes me so angry. Yes, I was seen
by the Medical Assessment Programme, firstly in 1996 when they told me the reason for my
problems was because I drank too much when I was in the RAF. They turned round and said
that I had passed all the tests and everything but you know that strip of tube you have to
breathe into and that thing goes out, they made me do that test about eight times before they
would tick the box and say Yes, it is fine. They took my blood pressure about 12 times
until they got a blood pressure that was suitable for what they wanted. The way the bloke
spoke to me, I was just totally discontented. When I came back from the USA, because of all
the tests and everything that Pam Asa had for me to get done, my doctor thought the best
place I could get these done was in the Medical Assessment Programme. He wrote to them
asking for them to see me again and get these tests done and the reply he got back was that I
was seen before, there was no point in me being seen there again because they had done all
the tests.
10

55. DR JONES: They did not mention squalene?

A. Who did not?

56. DR JONES: The Medical Assessment Programme in their response?

57. DR JONES: Presumably your doctor when he wrote to them had?
was in 2001. I can read you the letter that he was sent back.

A. No.
A. Yes. This

58. DR JONES: I think you have made the point.

A. He says he does not agree with
Dr Asas work or anything and basically there is no point in being seen by him again.
59. DR JONES: You had the tests for the antibodies done in the States?
correct, yes.
60. DR JONES: Do you know which laboratory?
laboratory.

A. That is

A. It is on the DVD, the name of the

61. DR JONES: It is?

A. It was in Tulane. The Baptist Church(?), Memphis, Tulane.
It was in Memphis that I had the blood test and then it went to Tulane to be done afterwards.
62. DR JONES: One more question, if I may. These vials of anthrax vaccine that were
washed up on the South Coast and found positive for squalene, do you know if those tests
were done by Pam Asa, or who?
A. No, they were done in Manchester I believe. It was
the Trevor McDonald programme people who found them and they went to Manchester. I
think if you refer to Shauns evidence he has got more information about that. I would not
want to go into detail because ----DR JONES: It is now ringing a bell. Thank you very much.
63. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: How old were you when you had your first injection?
A. Thirty. I was not even 30. I was 29 or 30. I was born in 1962.
64. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: Obviously to be unemployable from the age of 40 is
depressing.
A. It is very difficult. When I am having a period of being well and
everything, you get so frustrated being in the house all day doing nothing and you think, This
is the way it was, I will go out to work. I will get some temporary work but you go and do
the temporary work and you are back to square one. It is a sort of catch-22 position where
you sit down twiddling your thumbs, but I have got myself a hobby now so it takes my time
away.
65. THE CHAIRMAN: Are you saying that really you ought to have more than a 60 per
cent War Pension or are you satisfied with that?
A. I am quite satisfied with what I have
got now. Had you asked me a few years ago I would have said no but because I am able to
control my illness now to a better degree and I do not have the depressive part of the illness
any more, that has 90 per cent gone although occasionally when I get bad pains and
everything I do get depressed again, yes, now I am quite satisfied with what I have got.
66. THE CHAIRMAN: So what is your object really in taking part in this Inquiry and
giving the evidence you have given this morning?
A. For the truth to come out and for
you to be able to see that there is a correlation between people who went out to the Gulf and
people like myself who never left the UK to show that our symptoms, if they do not mirror
each other, are very, very similar. As I never went out to the Gulf and they did, there has got
to be something in there, there has got to be a straight line that forks off. The fact that the
11

Ministry of Defence do not really take any notice of people like myself who were vaccinated
but who were not deployed. They put us with the category non-deployed, there is not a
category in between of people who were inoculated but did not go.
67. DR JONES: One last question. I think I know the answer to this but if you could
clarify it. You never received NAPS tablets?
A. No, definitely not.
68. THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you very much indeed for coming. We are very glad that
you are slowly getting better.
A. Thank you.
The Witness Withdrew
MR KEITH PAUL, Called
69. THE CHAIRMAN: I think the next witness is Keith Paul. Again, we have had from
you a statement which we have not yet had a chance to read, I am afraid to say. Before we
come to that, could you give your name and address for the purposes of the shorthand note?
A. Yes. My name is Keith Andrew Paul. My address is 67 Warren House Walk, Sutton
Coldfield, B76 1TS.
70. THE CHAIRMAN: Can I say on behalf of the Tribunal as a whole that we are very
grateful to you for coming.
A. I am grateful for the chance because I have been waiting
14 years for this.
71. THE CHAIRMAN: Here at last we are. Would you like to summarise your statement
or would you like to take us through the statement?
A. I would like to take you through
the statement, if I may.
72. THE CHAIRMAN: Of course. Which service were you in?
Royal Air Force.

A. I was with the

73. THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you.

A. You can see the list of the symptoms that
have been diagnosed for me, including Desert Storm Syndrome, which is what Gulf War
Syndrome was called in the early days, in 1994. That was diagnosed by my GP, Dr John
Gilbert. In 1990 my unit was vaccinated at short notice to deploy to the Gulf to replace units
from my base during August 1990. They left in August 1990. My unit, as well as being a
fighter bomber squadron, were also tactical reconnaissance. We carried out this role in
theatre as well as our normal fighter bomber role. We deployed in November to Saudi
Arabia. Whilst in theatre I was given anthrax, Plague and Pertussis vaccinations. To add to
this, we were given NAPS, BAPS and anti-malaria tablets. On approximately 18 January
local commanders gave the order to start taking NAPS tablets at eight hourly intervals.
74. THE CHAIRMAN: You have not said what was the state of your health before you
received the vaccinations?
A. That is further down in the statement. Prior to
deployment to the Gulf my medical categorisation was A4, G1, Z1, A4 being for my eyesight
but G1, Z1 means there were no problems otherwise apart from that. I deployed out to the
Gulf on a further two occasions in November 1991 to February 1992 and again in May 1992
until July 1992 as part of Operation Malden which was a Kurdish humanitarian relief effort
carrying out tactical reconnaissance roles as I was specialised in the various cameras and
reconnaissance cockpits including the long range oblique photography, LOROP, which is a 36
inch laser fitted camera. Whilst in theatre there were various activations of NIADs, chemical
12

aid monitors, which detect nerve and chemical agents. Various reasons were given to us for
these activations but all of these seem somewhat questionable now in retrospect. Four of the
seven Tornados lost came from where I was based during the Gulf War and we could clearly
see inbound Scuds being engaged by the Patriots. We witnessed the Patriot that engaged the
Scud and split the missile in half causing the deaths of 28 US troops at Dharan. We actually
had a Scud drop 500 yards short of our base. When you get the NIADs going off you have
got the panic of masking up in time, you wonder whether you are going to mask up in time,
and it is a psychological thing that you do.
75. THE CHAIRMAN: I am not sure I know what the NIAD is, it is an alarm is it?
A. Nerve agent indicating equipment. On two occasions I assaulted two members of my unit.
That was totally out of character for me. This was the first instance of my behavioural
changes. As I say, a further two deployments to the region were carried out and on my return
I began developing bowel problems, fatigue problems, concentration and memory problems,
which stopped me going forward for promotion. I was then posted to RAF Cottesmore as part
of the Tri-national Tornado Training Establishment. I was working in the bay. I was given a
formal warning for not socialising with my colleagues and not going to any beer calls.
Basically all I did was go to work, finish work, go and have tea, back to the block, shower,
back to my room, lock the door and I used to sit in the pitch dark, the only light that was in
there was the standby light from my hi-fi unit. I was basically withdrawing myself from
everybody. Relationship problems started to arise, binge drinking, and I was sent home on a
weeks sick leave and given Prothiadine anti-depressants. I then absented myself without
leave for 77 days. I surrendered myself to the authorities and was sent back to Cottesmore
where I was sent for a psychiatric evaluation at the Princess Alexandras Hospital RAF
Wroughton. Several psychiatrists were seen, in excess of eight or nine, and I spent two and a
half months approximately in the psychiatric unit as an inpatient. I was put up for a board by
Wing Commander Aaron Sharma and sent on sick leave pending medical discharge. My
discharge took place on 19 January 1994. My fitness was never in question prior to Gulf
service. I was outgoing, sociable and had a very good sense of humour. Where is it now? It
is not there. My medical category pre-Gulf was A4, G1, Z1 and at my board it was reduced to
A4, G5, P8P, S8P, and the diagnosis was borderline personality disorder with psychopathic
traits.
I have had two relationships prior to the one I am in now and have two sons. The eldest I
have not seen since he was three and a half and that diagnosis was used at the Family Court to
stop me seeing my son. My second one, which I married, I walked out after six months on
Remembrance Day and I have never seen my youngest son. She was seven months pregnant
at the time.
I have tried to return to work but was medically retired for being a year long-term sick. I now
have a police record for grievous bodily harm under somewhat dubious circumstances. My
discharge was under Q.R.607 Section 22dII. Mr Mehan has copies explaining what that is.
Basically it is a medical downgrading saying I am not fit to do the job I was employed to do.
I feel it should be under Section 15a which would qualify me for a service invalidity pension
because I have been told by doctors that I will never work again. My MP has been in touch
with PMAR at Innsworth regarding PMA casework.
76. THE CHAIRMAN: Who is your Member of Parliament?
A. Andrew Mitchell,
MP. I also saw Sir Norman Fowler when he was my MP. Prior to him I saw Betty
Boothroyd, Clare Short, Peter Snape, Jeff Rooker. There have been several. If I can get this
mode of discharge overturned then I would like it to be backdated to January 1994. The
13

relationship that I am now in has had its ups and downs and I have spent 16 months in a
treatment unit for ex-traumatised servicemen in Llandudno called Ty-Gwyn. The unit is run
by Major General Robin Short, who is a former Director General Army Medical Services
from 1996-99. In July last year my partner had to have an induced termination of pregnancy
as it was found that the baby at a routine dating scan had the lethal form of brittle bone
syndrome. The loss of the baby caused my fifth attempt at suicide. Quite frankly, I would
have preferred to have come home in a body bag. My quality of life is governed by the
following daily medication ----77. THE CHAIRMAN: I do not think you need set it out. I can see the list there of what
you are having to take.
A. I have lost count of the amount of times that medication has
been changed for various reasons. The changes I would like to see implemented after the
inquiry are a full clinical administration for treatment and contracts put in place and funded by
the Veterans Agency rather than fighting for their private care trust or NHS funding; the
Ministry of Defence to admit their failings in duty of care when warned about the
vaccinations in the memo sent by Dr Metters; the Surgeon General at the time to be made
accountable for ordering the vaccinations and release all the information regarding adjuvants,
ie squalene etcetera; modes of discharge to be reviewed, amended and backdated accordingly
for veterans; and all veterans to be given full War Disablement Pensions and make sure that
the state benefits they are entitled to are in place and the same benefits to be awarded to
civilian support staff for life without question instead of being reviewed every three years.
In summary, I hope that the panel will address all the issues raised by the evidence that they
have heard and that truth and justice will prevail. It has taken 14 years to get this far,
unfortunately some veterans are no longer here to witness this. All veterans are sceptical as to
what may happen when the Inquiry is completed. I hope the panel can show some empathy
taking into account our treatment in the past, or lack of it. Having seen what we have seen,
been where we have been and done what we have done, as well as the vaccinations,
pesticides, NAPS and Depleted Uranium, I would like to know if the panel can put their hands
on their hearts and say they would not be affected in any way. Is our demise all down to the
price of a barrel of oil? Perhaps the funds raised from phenomenal fuel taxes can be used to
bring about the funds to address our problems, taking into consideration that at the time of the
refinery blockade these taxes accrued 7 billion. If you look into our illnesses you will find
correlations of the symptomatologies and, irrespective of what the Veterans Agency put down
as the labels, those problems slot in and these are people who have not known each other
previously.
Also, if Gulf War Syndrome does not exist, why does it appear in the Oxford Medical
Dictionary, Blacks Medical Dictionary and the Merck Dictionary for Diagnostics? I hope that
the failings of the Labour Government and their Conservative predecessors will be
highlighted as they have put up barriers, dragged their heels and ignored our pleas to sort this
problem out. We have spent too long living, in fact existing, on false hopes and empty
promises. I have lobbied several MPs, the Prime Minister, Lord Ashdown and Her Majesty
The Queen, only to be passed back to the Gulf Illnesses Unit who are in my mind economic
with the truth. In the last Gulf War changes were made in administering vaccinations,
working with depleted uranium munitions as well as environments where they were used by
the use of cards carried by the troops. Does this not prove the failings of the Ministry of
Defence and the Government in the 1990-91 Gulf War? Does this mean they realise their
lack of duty of care is the root cause of our health problems? I would ask the Panel to take
into account that it is Britain that stands alone in not giving Gulf War Syndrome recognition
despite overwhelming scientific evidence. Something I feel is paramount is our answering to
14

our Sovereign and countrys call to arms, many of us having served considerable time in the
service of our Queen and country. Do we not deserve recognition? Is it too much to ask the
MoD to take responsibility for their actions? I think the argument of battlefield immunity is
questionable as we did not volunteer to be used as Porton Down guinea pigs with unlicensed
vaccines and NAPs tablets whilst in theatre. We all await the outcome of the inquiry to obtain
truth, justice and the recognition we justly deserve as I will never suffer in silence whilst I
have a breath in my body. I understand that the Ministry of Defence have declined the offer
to submit evidence to the inquiry. Can this be perceived as a possible admission of guilt on
their part?
THE CHAIRMAN: Mr Paul, thank you very much indeed for that very full statement. Just
on that last point, now they have, happily, agreed that all the relevant documents can come
before us and we will see what they disclose.
A. Does that include the evidence that was
given about the vaccines that were administered?
78. THE CHAIRMAN: Until we see the documents I cannot answer that question, but we
will certainly have a good look through the documents when they come.
A. Can anything
that comes out of this inquiry be legally binding?
79. THE CHAIRMAN: Not anything that I can myself decide, I am afraid. Obviously, we
hope that the inquiry will have been of use; otherwise we would not be doing it. Just tell me
two or three things. Have you given evidence in a previous inquiry or not? A. No.
80. THE CHAIRMAN: I thought I saw something that suggested that you might have. As
far as you are concerned this is the first time you have given evidence of this kind, is it? A.
Yes, sir.
81. THE CHAIRMAN: Forgive me asking this: you referred to the fact that the fifth
occasion on which you attempted suicide was I cannot remember exactly? Was it quite
recently? A. August of last year, sir.
82. THE CHAIRMAN: Please do not answer it if you do not wish to, but when was your
first attempt? If it is embarrassing do not say.
A. I cannot remember. There have been
several. Three of them took place while I was in Ty-Gwyn.
83. THE CHAIRMAN: Can I ask you something slightly different? You referred to the
occasion when you assaulted two members of your unit. Had you ever been in trouble of any
kind before that occasion? A. Assault?
84. THE CHAIRMAN: You told us that you had your conviction for GBH. I am just
wondering whether, before the occasion when you assaulted ----- A. No.
85. THE CHAIRMAN: That was the first time anything of that kind had happened?
Yes, sir.

A.

86. THE CHAIRMAN: Do you see any connection at all between that occasion and the
subsequent GBH?
A. The GBH conviction took place --- basically, I witnessed somebody
who I knew he has got a brown belt in karate who decided to assault his girlfriend. I
stepped in and basically the outcome was rather dubious, but at the time Tracey was having
problems with the pregnancy, so I plea-bargained down to a section 20 from a section 18,
malicious wounding with intent.
15

THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you, Mr Paul.

87. DR JONES: You have given it but I am afraid I missed it your pension status? A.
My pension status is currently 50 per cent, sir. I put in for my pension in January 1994. I
received an award in July 2000 of 40 per cent.
88. But nothing in between?
A. No. In July 2000 the accepted conditions were chronic
fatigue syndrome/fibro-myalgia; neutropaenia, which is low white cell count, which I get
nothing for; depressive disorder. I am still waiting to go yet again to a pension appeal tribunal
for assessment. It went up at the review in July 2003 to 50 per cent. It was increased by ten
per cent, but I have had three consultants who have diagnosed Gulf War Syndrome and posttraumatic stress disorder. One of them is a senior lecturer at Birmingham University Hospital,
Dr Helen Smith, and she is also forensically qualified; Dr Dafyd Alun Jones, and also Dr
James Briscow who is with my community mental health team. He is the psychiatrist on the
team and he wrote to Dr Jones asking how he deals with some of the Gulf War
Syndrome/post-traumatic stress disorder within the community.
89. DR JONES: Thank you very much. You have told us about the unfortunate
termination of that pregnancy. To the best of your knowledge have you been involved in any
other pregnancies since the Gulf War? A. Yes.
90. DR JONES: And the outcome?

A. I do not have any contact, sir. At one stage -----

91. DR JONES: That was your younger son?

A. I have got two sons. Nathan had
learning difficulties but as regards Michael, I have no contact with him, and I have had no
contact with Nathan since he was three and a half.
92. DR JONES: Michael being the younger?
93. DR JONES: And apart from that, no other?

A. Yes, sir.
A. No.

94. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: You specify that your medical category pre-Gulf was
A4,G1,Z1 and then it was reduced to these further categories. A. A4,G5,P8P,S8P.
95. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: Do you have that specified in writing somewhere? Are your
medical records available to you to illustrate the fact that you were --- I certainly do not know
what these actually stand for.
A. A4 is my eyesight. G5 is medically permanently
downgraded. P8P is a permanent downgrading.
96. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: Are those recorded somewhere?
recorded at RAF Innsworth.

A. Yes. They will be

97. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: Do you have access to those records? You could get them
and give us a copy, could you? A. Yes.
SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: Thank you.
98. THE CHAIRMAN: What are your plans now, Mr Paul?
A. Plans now? There are
no plans. I take each day as it comes because you never know what the day is going to bring.
I would like to be able to get my self-esteem and personal pride back, something which is not
going to happen.
16

99. THE CHAIRMAN: It may.

A. I am not going to get up too much hope, sir.

THE CHAIRMAN: Can I thank you again for coming today.

The witness withdrew

MR MICHAEL CAPPS, called

100. THE CHAIRMAN: First of all, thank you very much for coming. Could you start by
giving your name and address for the shorthand note? A. Michael Capps, 4 Weaver Grove,
Leigh, Lancashire.
101. THE CHAIRMAN: You have just provided us with a statement and, of course, we
will look at that. Would you like to take us through the statement now? A. I will just read
through it.
102. THE CHAIRMAN: Very well.
A. At the age of ten years I had already made up
my mind that when I left school I was going to join the Army. I enjoyed playing sport,
including rugby, football, judo, badminton and cricket. It took a lot for me to lose my temper
and react with violence. I would also mix with anyone. I joined the Army on 5/3/85 as a
junior leader in the Royal Corps of Transport. I continued to play football, rugby, judo and
badminton. In December 1986 I got married and started a family. By the time I was
deployed to the Gulf I had three girls, the youngest at the time being six weeks old. At the
end of November 1990 my unit was told to prepare to go to the Gulf. We had several
injections in that month but I was never told what they were for. I was deployed out to the
Gulf on 2/1/91 as part of the Fuel Section of One Squadron Road Corps Transport. There we
were told we were joining up with the Fuel Section of 15 Squadron Road Corps Transport.
103. THE CHAIRMAN: Just tell me, what is the Fuel Section?
Section is to re-fuel the squadron vehicles. Our sole job was fuel.
104. THE CHAIRMAN: What fuel?

A. The job of the Fuel

A. Diesel.

105. THE CHAIRMAN: Vehicles, tanks, everything?

A. Anything that needed fuelling
basically. While waiting for our trucks and equipment to be offloaded we were put into Tent
City like everybody else. During that time the tents were sprayed but we were not told with
what or why the reason was. I was ordered to take NAP tablets from 17 January onwards. I
had to take one every eight hours. Our job was to set up refuelling points along the MSR.
During that time we were under the command of several units and we were ordered to parade
at field hospitals for more jabs. Again, we were not told what they were and what they were
for. After one injection for 48 hours I suffered symptoms of food poisoning which I put down
to the fresh rations which we were cooking ourselves. On travel from location to location to
refuel our tankers we would travel through the smoke of the burning oilfields. It was so
weird, the way it turned from day into what you would have thought was night. I can still
remember both the smell and the feeling of smoke as it irritated the throat. The only
disturbing thing that I saw was grown men crying with relief that their war was over after
surrendering to any allied forces they came across and seeing the camel carcasses that were
very close to an empty Iraqi trench.

17

In the last location after the war was over, awaiting orders to pick up and move back to pack
up and move back to port, boredom set in. I got permission from my section commander to
use a motorcycle to go and have a look at the damage we had done to the Iraqi tanks and
artillery pieces, of which I took quite a few photos. I made several trips to different positions.
Once back at the port waiting to come home, the squadron arranged trips for anyone
interested to a tank graveyard. Like little kids we were, climbing all over these vehicles, in
and out, none the wiser about any of the danger of the DU.
106. THE CHAIRMAN: DU stands for?
A. Depleted uranium. At no stage were we
told to put protective clothing on while we were around vehicles. On returning to the UK I
was told that everyone that had known me beforehand had noticed a big change in me. I had
become very sulky, moody, did not want to socialise with friends, even in my own home. My
fitness started to suffer. I was finding it harder to participate in sports. I was even doing extra
PT to try and get my fitness level back. Even that did not work. Within two weeks of
arriving home my fourth child was conceived. It was to be my first son. At no stage were we
told to wait before trying for children after returning home. My son was born six weeks
premature on 29/12/91. My second son again was born six weeks premature. Both my sons
suffer from severe mood swings and violent outbursts. To this day we have no answer to this
problem. As I said earlier, my troubles started almost straightaway but over the years they
have got worse, so bad that I had to give up work in 1998. The following is a list of some of
my problems: arthritis, chronic fatigue, IBS, major depressive disorder, general anxiety
disorder, including paranoia, PTSD, skin rashes, flashbacks, low-flying helicopters and
shooting stars remind me of Scuds and Patriots; night sweats, loss of libido, burning semen,
mild incontinence. Just to remind you, I am only 36 years old. I feel that my family is
suffering because I followed a dream.
107. THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you very much for that statement, Mr Capps. Have you
ever given evidence like this to an inquiry before? A. No, sir.
108. THE CHAIRMAN: This is the first time?

A. Yes, sir.

109. THE CHAIRMAN: How did this statement come? Did you prepare this yourself or
did you get help with it?
A. When I was told that I would be supplying evidence I just sat
down and did it myself. I have not really spoken to my family about what went on proper, so
nobody knows how I feel or how I felt except myself.
110. THE CHAIRMAN: The list of symptoms you have given at the end, I imagine you
had help with those, did you not?
A. Yes, because one of the other symptoms is memory
loss, so my wife helped me put the list together.
111. THE CHAIRMAN: Where did she get this list of symptoms from? Have you seen a
doctor? A. Yes. These have been diagnosed by the doctors, my doctor.
112. THE CHAIRMAN: Your GP?
pensions.

A. By my GP. Also, I have been accepted by war

113. THE CHAIRMAN: Tell us about your war pension position.

a 40 per cent war pension.
114. THE CHAIRMAN: When did you first apply?
was still working.
18

A. In 1998 I received

A. 1998 because up until that time I

115. THE CHAIRMAN: Had you left the Army?

redundancy.

A. I left the Army in 1994 on

116. THE CHAIRMAN: What did you do from 1994 until 1998? What job did you have?
A. From December 1994 to July 1995 I was an HGV Class 1 driver. I had to give up work
then to look after my handicapped daughter pre-Gulf War, until 1997, and then I went back to
work, again as a Class 1 driver. I then had to give up work totally in October 1998 because I
was just not fit to drive trucks any more.
117. THE CHAIRMAN: Between 1994 and 1998 were you able to drive safely despite
these symptoms?
A. Driving was beginning to deteriorate, loss of concentration, vacant
spells. I felt personally that I was becoming a danger on the road.
118. THE CHAIRMAN: You simply left the job, did you, or did they suggest you leave
the job? A. I had to leave the job because I was no longer able to do the job they employed
me for.
119. THE CHAIRMAN: And then you applied for a pension as soon as you left that job?
That was in 1998, and you said you got a 40 per cent pension? A. A 40 per cent pension.
120. THE CHAIRMAN: What is the position now?
2001.
121. THE CHAIRMAN: Any job at the moment?

A. It is 70 per cent. I got that in

A. No. I cannot work.

122. THE CHAIRMAN: Your marriage is still sound, is it, or happy?

did go through a stage of 12 months where we actually did split.

A. It is now but I

THE CHAIRMAN: We are very grateful for the statement. I do not know whether Dr Jones
has any questions.
123. DR JONES: Not an easy question to answer, but perhaps you can. There is a long list
of symptoms. Can you put your finger on the major factor that led you to be out of work and
unable to find work?
A. The arthritis. I have got it in all joints knees, lower spine,
shoulders, ankles, wrists, elbows. As a driver ----124. DR JONES: Has a name been given to that arthritis?
125. DR JONES: Are you having any treatment for it?
126. DR JONES: Where is that?

A. Osteoarthritis.

A. I am under a rheumatologist.

A. In Wigan.

127. DR JONES: Any medication?

general painkillers.

A. No arthritis medication at the moment, just

128. DR JONES: You refer on page 3 of your statement to the severe mood swings and
violent outbursts of your two sons. The implication is that that is not true of your daughters,
although I think I heard you say that one is handicapped.
A. I have got one handicapped
daughter from pre-Gulf War. She is severely physically and mentally handicapped.
129. DR JONES: But the other two?
those two at all.

A. They are fine. There is nothing wrong with

19

130. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: Have you got a family history of arthritis?
131. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: Your parents do not suffer with it at all?

A. No, sir.
A. No.

132. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: And this came on after your return from the Gulf?
A.
Yes. The aches and pains started virtually straightaway and I just put that down to hard work
basically. I could not understand why I was getting tired so quick. I still cannot understand
that now. I am only 36 but I should not be feeling like I am.
133. THE CHAIRMAN: You are not a doctor and nor am I, but to what do you attribute
the arthritis, of the various experiences that you have described when you were in the Gulf?
A. I have no idea. I was a private. I was not told anything about the injections that we had,
what they were for, what they were.
134. THE CHAIRMAN: How did you come to mention in your statement the fact that you
paid these visits to the tanks which had been knocked out, and your references to depleted
uranium? What was that in your mind?
A. Over the last couple of years I have heard
several bits of information with reference to using uranium-tipped shells. Obviously, once the
shell has exploded it becomes depleted uranium. I have got pictures just to prove that I was
climbing all over the tanks unprotected. In the Second World War they were told that to be
anywhere near any blown-up artillery or anything like that they had to wear protection but we
were not.
135. THE CHAIRMAN: Again, thank you very much, Mr Capps. It was very good of you
to come. What are you hoping for as a result of the inquiry?
Recognition that there is
something wrong with us; it is not all in our minds. Hopefully they can start giving us the
correct treatment to help us carry on with our lives, not necessarily improve our lives but just
help us cope with the way that we are. If my two sons have got something that I have passed
on to them, I would like to know how much further down their generations that is going to
carry on, all because, as I say, I acted out a dream. My family is suffering and my sons
families are going to suffer. If so, for how long?
136. THE CHAIRMAN: How old were you when you joined the Army?

A. I was 16.

THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you very much.

MRS DEBORAH CAPPS, called

137. THE CHAIRMAN: Mrs Capps, you heard the evidence that has just been given. We
now have a statement from you as well, for which we are grateful. How would you like to
deal with this? Would you like to read this statement or summarise it for us? A. I will read
it. When I married my partner in December 1986 he was a fit and healthy young man. He
regularly played rugby for the squadron and joined a civilian club to maintain his fitness. He
also was a member of the judo team which again helped him to improve and maintain fitness
levels. He was fun-loving and a confident extrovert who enjoyed nothing more than playing
with the three girls that we had before the Gulf War. In January 1991 he was deployed to the
Gulf with his unit. Prior to going he was given several injections by the medical officer but
was never told what the injections were. On arrival in the Gulf he was given more injections,
again without being told what they were. He was also ordered to take NAPs tablets, one
every eight hours. These commenced 17 January until the ceasefire. Mike and I wrote to
20

each other constantly. I told him about the children and how they were doing. He wrote and
told me about the thick acrid smoke he had to drive through that was burning his throat, about
the camel carcasses left to rot by the side of the road. He also told me about visiting burnt-out
tanks and photographing them, and enemy soldiers giving themselves up, relieved that their
war was finally over. He told me of his constant fear when the chemical alarms were going
off around him. Mike was also alarmed when the tents in Tent City were covered with a fine
mist. This was done by fellow soldiers but nobody told Mike why this was being done, just
that it was for his own good.
Mike returned on 6 April 1991 and from the moment I saw him I knew he had changed and
that something was wrong. He became withdrawn and very quick-tempered and snappy with
the children. Soon after returning his medical problems started to appear. The first thing he
did was stop his judo but he tried to continue with the rugby which was getting harder and
harder due to the constant pain in his joints. He had constant diarrhoea after food or if he got
stressed. Night sweats and flashbacks occur so often that they have become a normal part of
our lives. Seldom do we have a good nights sleep. He has sleeping tablets but if he takes
them he is knocked out for days, almost being in a stupor. He is constantly depressed. Some
days are better than others but even on a good day he has suicidal thoughts and can be
aggressive if not approached in the right way. He has post-traumatic stress disorder and
paranoia; he is constantly fired up and watching over his shoulder. He has attempted suicide
on several occasions and has it all planned out, how he would do it in the future. He has
planned out in his mind how to kill someone else and his mental health team have gone to the
extreme of making the police aware of his thoughts. I have control of his medication because
of his past attempts at suicide and to stop him trying it again. He takes seven different
medications at the moment, a total of 29 tablets a day; his medication is constantly changing
and sometimes he takes more. He cannot be left alone at all as he is unsafe. He has vacant
spells and often does not know what he is doing. He cannot work because of his disabilities
and I cannot work because I am his carer. We have to rely on his army pension and state
benefits, which at 36 is very difficult to accept, that your working life is over. Mikes
problems have severely affected our relationship in the past, mainly due to Mikes inability to
feel any emotions. Our children and I live our lives on a knife edge, not knowing what mood
he is in or how he will react. Each day he reacts differently to similar situations. Sometimes
the smallest thing will set off a rage. He has smashed several items around the house, ranging
from cups to knocking doors off hinges.
Since he came home from the Gulf we have had two sons who have both been diagnosed with
autistic tendencies. Sometimes it is very hard to cope with their mood swings and my
husbands. My own health has suffered. Until he came home from the Gulf I never had cold
sores or tonsillitis, but now I have them almost constantly. I also have gynaecalogical
problems which make intimate relations difficult. Twinned with Mikes increasingly
diminishing libido and fear of ejaculation which causes an intense burning pain, our love life
is almost non-existent. Our quality of life is very poor. The constant physical and mental
health problems on all our parts make us take one day at a time. We cannot plan ahead
because we do not know what the future holds. My husband has gone from being a lovely,
caring family man, always game for a laugh, often the life and soul of a party, to being a
housebound agoraphobic who does not care and cannot care about his own life or the lives of
his family. He feels that we would all be better off without him. He is a young man trapped
in the body of an old, infirm man. It is almost like a living death for Mike and his total
frustration is apparent to everybody else every day. It has taken an immense effort for him to
come here today. He has no confidence to go out or socialise even with his family, to whom
21

he is very close. Mike lost his mother last year and he still has not grieved properly because
of his illness. We would like to have Gulf War Syndrome recognised as an illness with the
hope of finding out how this will affect our childrens futures and so that we do not have to
fight for everything all the time, leaving us able to try and make the most of the time we have
left.
138. THE CHAIRMAN: Mrs Capps, we are very grateful to you for coming and producing
the statement. Please forgive me for asking, but you referred to suicide attempts. We did not
ask him about that. Can you recall roughly when the first suicide attempt was?
A. About
18 months ago.
139. THE CHAIRMAN: So quite a long time after his return from the Gulf?

A. Yes.

140. THE CHAIRMAN: Was that because his condition seemed to you to be deteriorating
rapidly at that time?
A. Yes. He seems to have got worse quicker as the years have gone
on.
141. THE CHAIRMAN: On another matter, this statement, which if I may say so, is very
well written, have you written that yourself or have you had some help with it?
A. No, I
did it.
142. THE CHAIRMAN: And it goes without saying that you have never appeared at a
previous inquiry of this kind? A. No.
143. THE CHAIRMAN: What really has made you want to take part in this inquiry? What
do you and your husband hope for?
A. To get it recognised, for our children more than
anything. The future is what is important now and, like I say, that it is recognised, that we do
not have to fight all the time to get the benefits we get.
144. THE CHAIRMAN: So it is not so much the money? I cannot now remember, and I
should remember, what he is getting. Is it 50 per cent or 60 per cent? A. Seventy per cent.
145. THE CHAIRMAN: So it is not strictly speaking the money that you are concerned
about? A. No. It is the recognition and the future lives of our children.
146. THE CHAIRMAN: What are you able to live on? Do you go out to work yourself?
A. No. I cannot leave Mike.
147. THE CHAIRMAN: But you have got enough, have you, to live on with the 70 per
cent war pension? A. Yes.
THE CHAIRMAN: It is very good to hear anybody saying they are satisfied with anything,
Mrs Capps. Thank you.
148. DR JONES: That was a very moving statement and I think it is very brave of you to
be here. I have one or two questions. You did separate for a while? A. Yes.
149. DR JONES: Was the reconciliation due to any improvement in Michael?
150. DR JONES: Just that you thought you would give it another go?

22

A. No.

A. Yes.

151. DR JONES: And for the children?

we could work through it.

A. Yes. We love each other and we thought

152. DR JONES: You have answered most of the questions I was going to ask you in this
statement, which is very helpful. You obviously are really in effect a full-time carer.
A.
Yes.
153. DR JONES: Have you explored the possibility of getting recognised as one?
No, I have not, actually.

A.

154. DR JONES: I am not an expert on this but it might be worth, from someone like the
Citizens Advice Bureau, ascertaining whether there might be any benefit for you in
becoming recognised as Michaels carer. It is just a thought. A. Yes, thank you.
THE CHAIRMAN: Exactly the same question had occurred to me as well. What I do not
know is whether a carers allowance as it were takes the war pension into account or whether
it is additional to it.
DR JONES: It is worth exploring.
THE CHAIRMAN: It is certainly worth exploring. Thank you.
SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: I do not have any questions for you.
THE CHAIRMAN: I would like to repeat what Dr Jones said. We are very grateful to you.
The witness withdrew

HAKIM TELLA, called

155. THE CHAIRMAN: Can you start by giving your name and address to the shorthand
writer? A. My name is Hakim Tella. I live at number 13B Napier Road, Luton LU1 1RF.
156. THE CHAIRMAN: I think you served in the Royal Artillery?

A. Yes.

157. THE CHAIRMAN: You have just produced for us a statement, and once again how
would you like to deal with it? Would you like to read the statement? A. It is fairly brief.
I will just read it. I was sent out to the Gulf as a gunner on 27 January 1991, as a BCR (Battle
Casualty Replacement) with 19th Field Regiment, Royal Artillery. At this stage in my career
my physical health was at its best. I was not prone to suffering from any particular ailments,
and actually took my fitness for granted, like most soldiers. Prior to my discharge from my
regiment in Alanbrooke Barracks in North Yorkshire, we also received a number of injections
at camp. Blood samples were also taken on a few occasions at intervals of a day or so.
Whilst based in Blackadder Camp in Al Jubayl within days we received injections. We were
instructed to form a single file and the medics then administered the vaccinations. As to the
precise number of injections I myself and the other soldiers received, I am unsure of that.
However, I am confident in saying that I was aware that I received a number of injections in
quick succession of one another. After the injections I almost immediately began to feel
unwell. My symptoms could be best described as feverish and I also experienced a loss of
appetite. I complained to an NCO who spoke to the medics on my behalf. I was then
23

instructed to rest in the tent for the rest of the day. As part of the pest control regime our tents
were pumped full of smoke insect repellent and a pump action spray was used, I believe for
the same effect, in and around the tents. Upon arrival at Blackadder we were advised to take
NAPs tablets every eight hours, as was also stated in the MBC manual. This was followed up
by a tannoy message that prompted soldiers to take their NAPs tablets. This went on for the
duration of the operation. Within weeks of our stay in Blackadder we were told after a muster
parade that we were to take on an infantry role and relieve the Scots guards of their duties in
Riyadh. One of the main buildings we were protecting was the headquarters of the British
Forces Middle East. In this particular building I was put on guard duty on the roof. On a
number of occasions I vividly remember the NIAD sounding. We were told that they were a
false alarm set off by aircrafts flying overhead each time. The same thing happened while we
were at Blackadder. To my knowledge, if my memory serves me correctly, the NAIADs we
had been trained to use were only supposed to activate upon detection of blood and nerve
agents. During the latter part of my career I began to suffer from lower back pain, loss of
appetite, irritable bowel, joint and chest pain. After discharge these symptoms became more
aggressive and frequent. Other symptoms also developed, such as palpitations, general body
weakness, clicking joints, night sweats and muscle spasms. At present I still have the same
ailments. I am hoping that through this inquiry the Ministry of Defence recognise that their
British veterans have been and are still experiencing illnesses due to their service in the Gulf,
and I hope that they can come forward and address the complaints of the veterans and cooperate fully with this inquiry.
158. THE CHAIRMAN: Mr Tella, thank you very much. You do not say when you left
the Gulf. A. It was 18 March 1991.
159. THE CHAIRMAN: What happened after that? A. Nothing really. We were told to
carry on taking the NAP tablets actually until one of the NCOs told us that we were basically
to hand in the NAP tablets that we had still in our haversacks, so we just stopped taking them,
but we basically took them for the duration every eight hours.
160. THE CHAIRMAN: Until you came back to the UK?

A. Until we came back, yes.

161. THE CHAIRMAN: And that was in March of 1991?

A. Yes.

162. THE CHAIRMAN: How long did you remain in the Army for?

A. Until 1995.

163. THE CHAIRMAN: Tell us about your health during those four years after you
returned from the Gulf.
A. Six months after my discharge I was medically downgraded
with a back problem anyway. At that time I also started to have problems with my eating,
loss of appetite, and I also complained to the Major at the MRS, who was a medical officer,
that I was having stomach problems and he basically told me I had a stomach bug. I was also
preparing for my medical discharge but I ended up getting a P9405 for turning up late on a
parade.
164. THE CHAIRMAN: I am not sure I understand that.
A. A P9405 is an
administrative discharge, even though I was waiting to come out on a medical discharge at the
time. I had a back problem, a prolapsed vertebra. That is why I get a war pension. I also get
a war pension for anterior knee pain after complaining of joint pains, clicking joints. The
results came back and I was told that I am entitled to a war pension for anterior knee pain
syndrome. I get a war pension of something like 30 per cent.

24

165. THE CHAIRMAN: Are you still in receipt of a war pension of 30 per cent?
Yes.

A.

166. THE CHAIRMAN: So you say you had an administrative discharge from the Army?
A. That is correct.
167. THE CHAIRMAN: But you continued to serve up to 1995?
I got the administrative discharge.
168. THE CHAIRMAN: What about since 1995?
169. THE CHAIRMAN: Why not?

A. Yes, 1995 and then

A. I have not worked at all.

A. Because of my back problem.

170. THE CHAIRMAN: Have you tried to get work? A. Yes, I have, but you have to
remember I came out with a P9405, which makes it difficult, and I was also P7 when I came
out.
171. THE CHAIRMAN: And it is entirely a physical problem, your back, is it?
my prolapsed vertebra in my back.

A. Yes,

172. THE CHAIRMAN: But, like some other witnesses we have heard, do you happen to
suffer from mood swings of any kind? A. One thing I failed to put in was mood swings. I
have actually tried to avoid that one. I did mention something like that in my initial statement
over the net.
173. THE CHAIRMAN: If I may say so, you do not look as if you suffer from back pain.
A. One of the problems why I was discharged was that I had a fight with the commanding
officers driver. I basically knocked the guy out. I was waiting to come out. I had actually a
GBH charge hanging over my head. The reason why my commanding officer said that he
was discharging me, when I asked him, Why are you going ahead with this, P9405, sir?,
because I had a pretty exemplary record before that, was, Because I cannot see how I can
trust you any more.
174. THE CHAIRMAN: Have you ever given any evidence to an inquiry such as this
before? A. Never, apart from the fact that I sued the Ministry of Defence when I came out
with my back problem, the prolapsed vertebra, and also when I tried to delve into the
injections that I had received at the Gulf they just sent us blanked sheets of paper. They were
blanked out. This is what my solicitor received at the time, so I could not pursue that.
175. THE CHAIRMAN: What led you to give evidence in this? How did you hear about
this inquiry?
A. I get an e-mail every now and again from the Gulf Veterans Family
Association. I have appeared once. I have been down on one of the campaigns; this was
quite a few years ago.
176. THE CHAIRMAN: Are you a member?

A. I am a member, yes.

177. THE CHAIRMAN: Of which of the two associations are you a member?
A. The
Gulf Veterans Family Association. I also believe that I am suffering from Gulf War
Syndrome although when I said in the symptoms to war pensions all I got back, although I did
also claim for my prolapsed vertebrae, was anterior knee pain syndrome even though I
complained of general body weakness, and I also made a statement.
25

178. THE CHAIRMAN: I am sure Dr Jones will ask you about your back. Can you
describe it a bit more? Many of us have had back problems. Why is your back worse than
anybody elses?
A. I mentioned my back because that is a medical problem, so that is not
put in alongside my other symptoms. I believe I have Gulf War Syndrome through the
injections I had been taking. I just happened to mention that because it is also one of my
symptoms.
THE CHAIRMAN: Yes, I follow.
179. DR JONES: Can you toll us a bit more about the back problem? This developed, if I
am right, somewhere in the period 1991 to 1994?
A. Yes. I was on exercise and I was
lifting a platform. One of the guys dropped one side and I took the full weight of it.
180. DR JONES: So there seems to have been an initial event and you date it from that
really? A. Yes.
181. DR JONES: Is it getting worse? A. No, it is basically the same. If I do not do too
much bending and anything physical I am not too bad but when I wake up I am in agony.
182. DR JONES: Very stiff? A. I am on tablets. I was on Abraxin(?), actually, initially,
I was in that much pain which I am learning to live with.
183. DR JONES: What are you taking now?

A. Codramol.

184. DR JONES: You also, I think, and correct me if I am wrong, mentioned joint pains.
A. Yes.
185. DR JONES: Which joints?
A. My arms, my knees, everywhere, every joint in my
body almost, clicking. It is really sore, especially in the morning time when I get up.
186. DR JONES: Have you been given a diagnosis for that?

A. No.

187. DR JONES: And presumably therefore you are not receiving any medication?
Painkillers, Codramol. I do not think they give you anything else, for my back also.

A.

188. DR JONES: You draw a distinction in a sense between your back problems and your
other symptoms which you attribute more to the Gulf War. I think it would be helpful just to
enumerate those. You mentioned fatigue. Could you go on?
A Fatigue, mood swings,
which I never mentioned. It was just something that I did not print because I was quickly
typing it up. It was short notice. Mood swings are my main problem. It has destroyed my
relationships. I was supposed to be taking some kind of tablets to keep me calm but as far as
my missus and my family were concerned, I have been advised otherwise because of the
problems in the family, if you keep taking tablets and get addictions to these types of tablets,
so I avoided that. I am basically learning to live with my mood swings.
189. DR JONES: They are a prominent feature?
family.

A. Yes, because it has destroyed my

190. DR JONES: Anything else apart from that and fatigue?

A. Basically joint paints
and my stomach. I have problems with my stomach. Six months before I came out of the
Army I was complaining about my stomach and my doctor recently told me I might have hpylorea(?) now. I have had the cameras down three times but they still have not found out
26

what is wrong with my stomach. I have got appetite problems. Anything I eat, it is the same
difference, no real appetite. I have not even eaten this morning.
191. THE CHAIRMAN: Mr Tella, I owe you an apology. I thought you said that you did
not suffer from mood swings but you have now explained that. A. Before I came out of the
Army that was one of the reasons why I have been pushed out. I had rounds in my weapon.
I had rounds taken off me on guard by my commanding officer who could see that there was
something not quite right. In fact, what he said in my report was, I think Tella would be
happier in another type of job, because he could just see that it was no longer the job for me.
192. DR JONES: Can you tell us something about your family situation?
with my missus now.
193. DR JONES: When did that happen?
194. DR JONES: 1995?
times.

A. I am split

A. That happened just before my discharge.

A. Yes, but we had been splitting up before then quite a few

195. DR JONES: And you have not had a long-standing relationship since?
are not back together.

A. No, we

196. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: You are able to look after yourself, unlike Mr Capps, are
you? Do you live alone? A. No, I do not live alone. I have got a girlfriend.
197. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: So you have a relationship?
198. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: And she looks after you?
199. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: Or does she work?

A. Several years now.

A. Yes.

A. She works too.

200. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: So you are not as badly incapacitated as Mr Capps?
am not relying on her constantly 24 hours, no.

A. I

201. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: Is your discomfort worse when sitting or standing?
A.
Getting up in the morning is definitely the worst for me. Sometimes I have a bout of really
bad chronic back pain along with my joint pains and then mood swings, which just tops it all
off. Also, not being able to eat adds to my problems, not having an appetite. I have to force
myself to eat.
202. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: But you could look after yourself in the worst situation?
A. Of course, because I have up to this point. I have been through really hard times and this
is the best I have been since I came out. I used to be very confident. Now I am twitchy and
nervous. My personality as well. Even my family have mentioned it, which happened
straight after the Gulf. I had a really close relationship with one of my sisters. We used to get
up to all sorts, go everywhere, and then when I came back from the Gulf she just turned round
to me a few months in and said, You have changed. My little brother she always called
me. She said, Look, Hakim, you do not want to end up like that. At first it did not click.
As time went on, as my moods started to get worse, I started avoiding my family because they
live in Manchester and I live on my own in Luton with my girlfriend. We are not married or
anything; we are living together.
203. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: How old are you?
27

A. I am 38 now.

204. THE CHAIRMAN: You mentioned in your statement that the tents in which you
were living were sprayed from time to time. Why did you mention that fact?
A. It just
came to mind and I thought maybe it was important that I mentioned this to you. That is what
I saw out there. I just thought it was added information that might have something to do with
the Gulf War illness. That is why I thought to mention it, not to leave any stone unturned.
205. THE CHAIRMAN: You were quite right to mention it but how often did that happen,
as far as you remember? It is a long time ago.
A. Visibly I can only remember it the one
time happening.
206. THE CHAIRMAN: Again, I think you did tell us, but your current pension is 30 per
cent? A. Yes.
207. THE CHAIRMAN: What is your feeling about that level of pension? A. Because
it seemed like a chore and it was long, I was depressed when I was applying for this. I
remember writing to an MP saying I was going to commit suicide because these people
should be hurrying up with my pension, that I was living in a slummy area, in one room.
208. THE CHAIRMAN: Who was your MP? A. I cannot remember his name. I wrote
to the wrong MP actually at the House of Commons at the time, but further on my local MP
got in touch with the war pensions and tried to push to get it.
209. THE CHAIRMAN: Can you remember when you wrote that letter to somebody else?
A. No. It was straight after I came out, after April 1995. Straight as I came out of the Army I
applied for the war pension.
210. THE CHAIRMAN: Have you appealed your 30 per cent pension?
A. Initially I
appealed because they gave me 20 per cent. I appealed and I eventually got anterior knee
pain syndrome. Of all the ailments I complained to them over I got anterior knee pain
syndrome. I just took that. I thought, I either take this or they are going to try and whip the
whole thing off me. I was not too sure of what my entitlements were. I was not even sure if
I was entitled to it at the time, so I have basically accepted it since that date and I have never
bothered them since.
THE CHAIRMAN: Mr Tella, thank you very much indeed for coming today.

MR MARK McGREEVY, Called

211. THE CHAIRMAN: Mr McGreevy, can you begin in the way others have by giving
your name and address to the shorthand writer, please.
A. My name is Mark McGreevy
and I live at 22 Ennerdale Close, Horndean, Waterlooville, Hampshire.
212. THE CHAIRMAN: I gather that you joined the army as a boy soldier.
16.

A. Yes, at

213. THE CHAIRMAN: And you served in the RAOC. What was your service career?
A. I originally joined the Royal Signals as a junior soldier at 16. After a year, I realised that I
was not suited and, since I have left, I joined the reservists. You have a choice, you can either
become a reservist or you join the TA, so I joined the TA. Would it be easier if I read from
my statement?
28

214. THE CHAIRMAN: Please do. I think we have several documents from you including
letters from your consultant physician. I think it is probably best, if it suits you, if you read
from your statement and is this the one dated 15 July?
A. Yes. To assist in this inquiry, I
have written a summary of my health background and of my time in the army together with a
list of my symptoms of which I either suffer with all of the time or most of the time but the
fatigue is constant. I had a healthy childhood with no disease or asthma. I joined the Army as
a boy soldier at 16 in 1985 and after a few years left and joined the reservists until I left in
about 1996. However, in 1991, I rejoined the regular Army as a result of the Gulf War. I had
a full medical when I re-enlisted and my health was given the all clear. Prior to deployment
with RAOC AMF(l) we received a number of vaccines and, from memory, it was about four
injections a day twice over a short seven-day period. I am not sure what injections I received,
but we were all aware prior to deployment that we were battle casualty replacements, so I can
assume we were protected against chemical warfare.
As it was, when I arrived in March 1991, the land war had just finished and I was employed in
the Gulf in my trade as a petroleum operator. This entailed cleaning up/organising of all
military petroleum and lubricants for transportation back to the UK. One of the main tasks
and most unpleasant was decanting thousands of army jerricans which were from all over the
theatre of operations and placing the fuel back into large bulk fuel containers. We had no
protective equipment or facemasks, only thin fatigues and desert boots. We worked long
hours in extreme temperatures for two months whilst completing this task and I can still taste
the petrol in my mouth now from when we did this task.
There were occasions when we conducted battlefield tours around Basra and Kuwait and we
were exposed to damaged tanks from depleted uranium shells and the burning of oil fields. I
arrived in the Gulf in March 1991 and left in June 1991. Upon returning, I continued to work
at the school of petroleum at Westmoors, Dorset until I left the Army in November 1991 and
rejoined the reservists. I can recall failing an Army BFT three mile run within a few months
of returning from the Gulf struggling with a tight chest and wheezing and reporting sick to the
medical officer and then being placed on remedial PT together with at least ten other soldiers
who also failed the run. Ever since that time over the years, I am aware of repeatedly
catching any cold that is going which will infect my chest and I can remember one night after
only a short time of being at home from the Gulf that a doctor had to be called out to me in
the middle of the night as an infection was so bad I was struggling to breathe, for which I was
treated with a nebuliser and steroids. Throughout this time, I have suffered fatigue, tiredness
and headaches. I have listed a full list of symptoms at the end.
I joined the police in 1993 and, during the beginning of my career, I hid my symptoms and
struggled to work as best I could. However, my employer became aware of increasing
sickness four years ago and, in June 2003, I was given a warning about my sickness record
and, since then, my employer has paid for me to see a private consultant to help my return to
work. I have been seen by Consultant Physician Dr Chauhan who gives strong medical
opinion that my illness and symptoms of repeated infections, ME, chronic fatigue syndrome
and ill-defined conditions and hypertension are a consequence of my Gulf War Service. I
have also recently been seen by Dr Myhill who is a specialist in ME/chronic fatigue syndrome
and immune system disorders. She is convinced that all of my illnesses are attributed to Gulf
War exposures and that my whole immune system and metabolism have been damaged. I am
still suffering with a multitude of symptoms and, last June 2003, I was so ill with repeated
chest infections fatigue and high blood pressure that I was signed off work until 5 April 2004.
In 2000, I applied for a war pension for my condition of repeated chest infections. This was
29

rejected and subsequently accepted at an appeal hearing. However, I was only paid a one-off
payment of 4,000. A year ago, I explained to the Veterans Agency that I am now getting so
ill that I am frequently off work and my condition is worsening. They have rejected my claim
for worsening and I have to go to an appeal again. This has been ongoing since October
2003.
I volunteered for the Gulf War as a fit and healthy young man and have struggled for years
with repeated episodes of ill health ever since. I am not looking for huge amounts of
compensation, just recognition that my illnesses are attributed to my service in the Gulf and
medical assistance is available when required and when times are hard when I cannot work
that financial assistance is given. I do not qualify for any army pensions that are in place and
I do not receive any weekly war pension. I have had a constant battle with the Veterans
Agency over my entitlement, one of which where I feel like a scrounger. I should not have to
do this when I am ill. I am just thankful that at the moment I am clinging onto my police
career. I have listed a list of symptoms that I suffer with and at times all of them in one day.
215. THE CHAIRMAN: I do not think that you need read out a list of symptoms. I think
they are fairly similar to the symptoms which we have seen before. So, the position is that
you joined the police in 1993 and are still actually a policeman.
A. Yes, in July 1993 and
I am a detective constable at CID in Hampshire.
216. THE CHAIRMAN: I am very glad that you are still able to work. Among this long
list of symptoms, what is the thing which worries you most?
A. My main concern is my
breathing, my respiratory problems. That has been the biggest problem over the years. As
soon as I have a cold or a throat infection, it goes to my chest and I am bed bound for a few
days until it clears up and then, for months, I am literally coughing up copious amounts of
sputum non-stop. That is my biggest discomfort.
217. THE CHAIRMAN: Of course, many people suffer from asthma and breathing
problems of one kind or another; why do you attribute your problem in fact to what happened
in the Gulf? A. Purely the circumstances and the timings were that, as I was called up as a
reserve for the Gulf in January 1991, I had a full army medical to make sure that I was fit for
service.
218. THE CHAIRMAN: Had you had asthma before 1991?
respiratory problems whatsoever.

A. No, no asthma and no

219. THE CHAIRMAN: Is there any history of asthma in your family?

A. No, not in
the family. Also, prior to that, at 16, I was a boy soldier and underwent rigorous infantry
training for six months and it would have been detected if there had been a problem with my
chest and asthma then.
220. THE CHAIRMAN: But, at the moment, you can do a full job as I understand it.
A. No.
221. THE CHAIRMAN: You cannot?

A. No.

222. THE CHAIRMAN: But you are still with the police.
A. In April, I saw Dr
Myhill; I was referred to her through Dr Chauhan. She told me in April that I was still
suffering with chest infections and fatigue and high blood pressure and she felt that I should
not go back to work but, being a family man with a mortgage to pay With the police, you
30

have six months full pay and then you go on to half pay and, after 12 months of work (sic),
your pay stops completely. I had nothing to fall back on and I forced myself back to work
and my GP allowed me to go back to work for half days. The police medical officer sees me
every six weeks. I originally went for only four hours a day and I am now at five hours a day,
but I am not allowed out of the police station, it is purely inquiries around the office,
answering the phone and on the computer.
223. THE CHAIRMAN: Dr Myhills report, which we have, is dated 29 March or she saw
you on 29 March of this year.
A. That is correct.
224. THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you very much, I think that is very clear. You, in your
mind, attribute the onset of the breathing problems and everything else to the injections which
you received --A. I will be honest with you, I think it is a combination of everything I
have been exposed to. It could be the oil fires when I was out there and I have photographs
where it was black soot and we had inadequate clothing and I am not a medical expert but
just the environment we were in and the circumstances with the injections, I do not know
what has made me ill.
225. THE CHAIRMAN: You refer to the depleted uranium; why do you put that down as
one of the possible causes?
A. There has been a lot of research over the years and, with
the help of the Internet, it is well publicised as to what causes Gulf War illnesses. I have
pictures of me next to burnt-out tanks when we went into Kuwait and Basra and I knew I was
around all these tanks which had been blown up by shells. From the research that has been
done and it was obvious I was in that area.
226. THE CHAIRMAN: Were you in the area of the so-called flume, the Kamisal(?) I
cannot remember the exact name explosion?
A. We were in Al Jubayl in Saudi Arabia.
I honestly do not know how far the flume went. I know there has been research but I do not
know whether we were affected or not. One thing I would like to add is that, throughout my
time in the Gulf, there was always a very grey sort of misty environment; it was not like a
nice sunny day which you expect in a sunshine state. I can remember throughout there was a
very dull atmosphere.
227. DR JONES: I think I know the answer to this but just to clarify: you were deployed to
the Gulf after the cessation of hostilities.
A. That is right.
228. DR JONES: So, you had no NAPS.
A. We were told how to use the NAPS at
Bulford Camp but, when we arrived, we did not use them.
229. DR JONES: Has Dr Myhill advised any therapy following her consultation?
A. Yes, she has put me on a detoxification which I tried and I have lost two stone in
six weeks.
230. DR JONES: Where was that carried out?
A. I did that myself. She gave me the
diet to try and numerous multivitamins and she has prescribed what Americans doctors
describe at Gulf Veteran Ovar(?), a detoxification of the system through sweating and saunas
but I do not have the funds to do that at present.
231. DR JONES: Did you detect any improvement apart from the weight loss?
A. A
slight improvement and then, after detoxification, you reintroduce foods to see if there is a
reaction. I will be honest, it has come back again already. I have spoken to her about it and
31

she has told me to go on the detox again. You end up feeling like a yoyo backwards and
forwards. One of the biggest problems she is concerned about is the aching muscles and the
joints; that is not going away. She thinks there is maybe a magnesium deficiency there, She
has given me B12 and injections of magnesium at the same time.
232. DR JONES: Are you on any regular medication for your chest?
numerous antibiotics; my last antibiotic was in April.

A. I was on

233. DR JONES: But nothing regularly?

A. I am on hypertension tablets which is
Rakonil(?) and Atenolol to control my blood pressure.
234. DR JONES: Are they doing the trick?
A. My blood pressure is still up and down;
it was high again two weeks ago; it is still up and down at the moment.
235. DR JONES: Presumably, no one has given you beta blockers?
A. Not yet, no.
For years I was on asthma drugs, on steroids and inhalers. Since seeing Dr Myhill, she has
said, I do not think your problem is asthma, I think you just have an immune system which
keeps getting chest infections, so I have stopped using the inhalers as of when I saw her.
236. DR JONES: Do you know what the inhalers were?
and flexatide(?), one is a preventer and one is a reliever.
237. THE CHAIRMAN: I am an asthma sufferer.
years, ever since I came back from the Gulf.
238. DR JONES: Until she stopped them?

A. I used to take salbutamol

A. I was on those for a period of ten

A. Yes, until she stopped them.

239. DR JONES: Have you seen Dr Chauhan since you have seen Dr Myhill? She wrote
to him I think.
A. Yes, that is right. I saw him a month ago.
240. DR JONES: Did he agree with the need to stop the medication?
A. Yes. He said
it would be interesting to see what happens, my symptoms will have either got better or
worse. Touch wood, I have been free from chest infections for the last six weeks, so I am
keeping my fingers crossed at the moment.
241. DR JONES: The difficulty with doing more hours in your police job, which can be
demanding even if it is indoors, can it not?
A. That is right.
242. DR JONES: What is the main problem there?
hours?

A. As regards me increasing the

243. DR JONES: Yes.

A. It is basically fatigue. Even on four hours, I was coming
home to my wife and two young children and I am completely worn out. The mornings are
the worse; I struggle to work in the mornings. Once I am there, I am okay for a few hours
and, in the evening, I fall asleep. That is the best way to describe it. I feel like a 35-year old
man in the mornings and, at night, I feel twice my age.
244. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: You said to Lord Lloyd that breathing difficulties and
asthma were your primary concern.
A. Yes.
245. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: But in fact it seems, from what you have said, more
recently that it is actually a sort of chronic fatigue that you are suffering from but a desk job in
32

the police should not be affected by breathing or asthma difficulties, it is the fatigue really.
A. It is a combination of everything, I suppose. If I return back to full operation as a police
officer, I feel at the moment that would kill me off in a way. I am in that grey area of not
knowing what is around the corner at the moment. I am constantly monitored, so I could be
dismissed from the police at any time. I just do not know what is around the corner. I am
clinging on to my job by going in to make sure that I stay in with my job because there is no
backup from the MoD or anything.
246. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: What about making the journey up to London? Has that
proved a great effort for you?
A. It has. My wife has accompanied me and I know that I
will be completely worn out when I get home tonight and I will struggle into work tomorrow
morning. My wife continually nags me not to go into work because she knows that I am
feeling rough but needs must with a mortgage and young children to support.
247. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: If you were to lose your police job, is there any other type
of work that you would try to take on or do you think that basically that would be the end of
your working life?
A. I am fighter; I do not want to give in. Dr Chauhan suggested to me
a few weeks ago that I could retire early from the police but, to be honest, I do not want to
give in, so I will find something at a desk at least. There are just not enough benefits or
anything like that that I have been trying to obtain that I can receive, so I will have to find a
job as best I can.
248. THE CHAIRMAN: In the first statement that you gave us, you referred to something
called Epstein Barr. That is new to me; what exactly is that?
A. When Dr Chauhan was
trying to investigate what the problem was last year, he discovered that I had the presence of
Epstein Barr in my blood which means that I have been exposed to a virus and glandular
fever. He says that it is a very common debilitating illness. He did add to me that it has been
found commonly in America; it has been found in Gulf War soldiers.
249. THE CHAIRMAN: No doubt, we will hear about that from the experts when they
come. In the meantime, you say that you are not in receipt of a war pension and in fact the
4,000 --A. Yes, just a one-off payment.
250. THE CHAIRMAN: I think I can say on behalf of all of us that I do hope that you
manage to keep up your job with the police.
A. Thank you.
THE CHAIRMAN: In the meantime, thank you very much for coming.
The Witness Withdrew
THE CHAIRMAN: I think that our last witness before the adjournment is Carole Avison.
MRS CAROLE AVISON, Called
251. THE CHAIRMAN: Would you give your full name and address to the shorthand
writer.
A. My name is Carole Avison, 31 Dawson Road, Newsome, Huddersfield, HD4
6LX.
252. THE CHAIRMAN: First of all, thank you very much for coming and providing us
with these letters. Could you tell us your reason for giving evidence before the inquiry.
A.
My husband was a Gulf War veteran; he was a 24-year regular soldier; he started off as a
33

private and worked up to a major. He left the Army after 24 years, came out and started up a
nursing home business. He had a commitment with the TA until the age of 55, being an
officer. When it came to the Gulf War in 1991, he was under the age of 55, so he was called
forward as one of the reserves. He had a speciality of setting up operating theatres on medical
sites and that was his job, to go out and set up the operating theatres. Once they were set up,
then he would go in a helicopter with the surgeon; they would go forward to the front, treat
the lads or lasses and bring them back to the hospital they had just set up and that was
supposed to be the way in which it was set up. Unfortunately, he became very ill while he
was out there in the first week of being out there and he was actually bedded down in the
hospital and was treated for various chest infections and given various antibiotics and he
returned home three weeks later.
253. THE CHAIRMAN: Can you give us the dates again.
1991 and he was back in early February.

A. He went out in January

254. THE CHAIRMAN: What was the state of his health when he went out?
A. A1 fit;
they all had to be A1 fit; they went through full medicals; they were pulling trucks around.
They really had to go through a thorough medical and he was a very, very fit man. He was
playing rugby; he was a very fit lad.
255. THE CHAIRMAN: You say that he came back ---

A. He was airlifted back.

256. THE CHAIRMAN: Was that in March 1991?

A. He was airlifted back. He
developed a pneumonia-type illness on 19 January while he was out there, photophobia and
everything like that, and he was treated while he was out there. It was diagnosed as bronchial
pneumonia, so they started antibiotics, and he was airlifted back but he did not improve and
Colonel Jones, the Commanding Officer of 205, got him back to the UK and that was on
3 February. He came back to Brize Norton to QMH at Woolwich and was admitted to the
medical ward under the care and direction of Guy Radcliffe, a consultant physician. He had
chest x-rays, blood tests, ECGs and he tried to have an exercise on the (?) but he collapsed.
Treatment was (?) ventolin and simple linctus and he was sent home on sick leave and
because we were running a nursing home and we were qualified nurses, he actually came
home under my care and I looked after him at home. He then returned to QMH because he
was determined that he was going to go back to the Gulf on 21 February and he was seen by
Guy Radcliffe again and he was downgraded to G7. He was only able to work part time but,
when he worked in operating theatres, he was taking over to let somebody else go out from
Woolwich, the hospital, to take his place out in the Gulf and he took their place at Woolwich,
so he felt that he had to do a full-time job in the operating theatres but he could not do it
unfortunately, so that really got him down. They sent him home on 7 March because he was
unable to carry on.
257. THE CHAIRMAN: What was the subsequent history here?
A. He got demobbed
from the Service or we thought he got demobbed on 12 March 1991, we thought that was him
out of the Army completely, but they sent him forms I think that was a year before he died
and he was in a wheelchair and assisted by oxygen because there was a conflict going on
and they asked him to go to the conflict and we could not work it out but we found out then
that he had not been properly demobbed, the papers had been lost. So, even in a wheelchair,
he was supposed to be in the Army! Anyway, on 4 April, he saw his own GP with a chest
infection and the way we looked at it was because the MoD was saying it was all in the head
of Gulf War veterans, this so-called Gulf War illness, but then the press got into a syndrome
that was their wording a syndrome so, what the GP decided to do was that as every
34

infection brought a new symptom, just to treat it and carry on. Everything that came up, chest
infection, treat it and get on. Something else happened, treat it and get on.
One morning, it was weird, there was something wrong with his eyes one was up there and
one down there; he could not see anything and they thought he had a brain tumour. He was
admitted and he was seen by Dr Lassall(?).
258. THE CHAIRMAN: When was this?

A. This was in April 2001.

259. THE CHAIRMAN: Very soon after?

A. A brain tumour he was admitted under
the care of Dr Lassall, an absolutely fantastic man, at the MRI unit in Manchester where he
had four brain scans, EEG, full blood tests, x-rays, lumbar puncture. The treatment was
analgesics but he still did not respond and the pain he was in was terrible; they put him on
diamorphine I thought we were going to lose him and more antibiotics. Then, what we
decided to do one weekend was try to something different and we put some steroids up and
that worked on him, it brought his eyes back down to where they should be and he felt a lot
better for them. From the lumbar puncture, it showed that he had Q fever, which I am sure
Dr Jones knows all about. That we found out later. His spinal fluid was sent down to Porton
Down; they also sent Ians blood down to Porton Down, which I cannot get hold of. He also
had (?) syndrome which is another condition which was like somebody squeezing the back of
his eyes all the time, the pain was there and it was absolutely horrific. He was in hospital for
three weeks and then he had to go back every week. In the meantime, he had repeated chest
infections always accompanied with coughing, severe pain behind the eyes, dizziness and
extreme tiredness. He was sent up under the Rowntree Foundation I am sure you have
heard about this in the past couple of weeks to see Gomez Mall(?) at Sutton General. He
did the neurotesting and that was paid for by the Rowntree Foundation but they would not
give out the results but a locum GP that he saw referred him up to (?) and he went up there
and we got the results back.
Even though the Gulf Veterans come in front of you and they look well and fit and you cannot
see what is wrong with them, they look fit and healthy young men, which I am sure you must
have seen, Ian looked a fit and healthy young man. He knew there was something wrong. By
the tests, it showed that he had neuropathy The way it was explained to me was that his
brain cells were degenerating quicker than they were regenerating and that were was nothing
we could do about it. It would affect his He could put his hands in boiling water and he
would not know. He would not know the difference until you said, You have blisters on
your hands. He just could not tell hot from cold. It was horrific for the lad and it was
horrific for the whole family and people who saw Ian as such an active person. That is what
Gomez Mall put it down to. Whatever happened, there is only one common denominator that
we have. It has affected veterans who went to the Gulf and it has also affected veterans who
have not been to the Gulf and they have one common denominator. I have not come along to
preach to you here or anything like that. What I am going on about is the vaccinations; that is
one common denominator. The other thing that we found out (inaudible) was that it
seemed to be the older age group who became ill first. It is as though the younger ones had a
stronger immunity system. Their illnesses, if it run at the spread we saw, the way that it
worked out, unfortunately they will all end up the same as the older group and we see it
happen.
260. THE CHAIRMAN: That is an interesting point because I see that your husband was
perhaps the only person we have so far heard about was 54.
A. Yes, when he died.
35

261. THE CHAIRMAN: No, when he went out to the Gulf.

A. He was 45 when he
went to the Gulf and 54 when he died. He was terminally ill for the last seven years; he died
in 2001.
262. THE CHAIRMAN: We have a letter here from the Ministry of Defence to your MP.
Is Christine Russell your MP?
A. I have no idea.
263. THE CHAIRMAN: We have a letter and I think it relates to you but maybe I have
this wrong. Tell us in your own words what your war pension position is.
A. I do not
know who Christine Russell is at all. My MP is Martin Bell.
264. THE CHAIRMAN: It is possible that we have been given the wrong information.
A. I have not seen anything at all.
265. THE CHAIRMAN: At the moment, you are not in receipt of any form of --- A. Yes.
266. THE CHAIRMAN: Tell us.
A. Ian was in receipt of a 100 per cent war pension.
It started off at 10 per cent and then, as his illnesses progressed, he got so much for being
doubly incontinent, so much when he needed assistance in breathing machines and he had to
be suctioned out, so much for (inaudible), so much for emphysema. He got a 100 per cent
war pension.
267. THE CHAIRMAN: Did that continue after he died?
A. No. I get a war widows
pension; they give me 144 a week and, in that 144, is 60 towards my council rent and I
have a 14-year old daughter. That is it.
268. THE CHAIRMAN: So, money is quite tight?
A. Yes. He was in receipt of the
AVRS; that stopped the day he died. They said they would wait for the death certificate;
unfortunately, the inquest took three years; it came through last November and have you seen
a copy of the death certificate?
269. THE CHAIRMAN: No.
A. It actually states on here: Verdict: Edward Ian Hill
died from natural causes to which service as part of the 1991 Gulf Campaign contributed. I
also have the documents of Mr Weinberg(?), the coroner. There were too many medical
reports to go through and he instigated a man, a consultant, Mr Saltizi(?) to go through them
all and correlate them all and, in his opinion unfortunately, that file is left (inaudible), so I
will get that over to you had Ian He died from a heart attack; Dr Gomez Mall said it
would affect his heart and unfortunately it did affect Ians heart. It states in that that, had Ian
not gone to the Gulf, he would still be alive today. This actually states that, that he would still
be alive today had he not gone to the Gulf.
270. THE CHAIRMAN: The letter that I think you must have written to the inquiry does
say that, in April, the Department was still considering whether you, Mrs Avison, should be
entitled to some further benefits.
A. AVRS stopped until the death certificate; the death
certificate was sent in; that will give you the familys part of the AVRS but we are still
waiting and it is three years since Ian died.
271. THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you very much for coming.
A. Can I just have a
couple more minutes, please? It is about the Association. Ian was Chairman of the Gulf War
Veterans Association when it first started; this is where he got involved with Lord Morris.
When the Association started, it was all self-funding, no money came from the Government at
all, not one penny. Then this is when they started asking questions to MPs, Can you help?
36

Can you help?, so he got involved. Like I say, it all came out of the War Veterans
Association. We met up with the Conservative Party when they were in government. We met
up with Tony Blair and he said, If we get into government, we will leave no stone unturned
and we will get a public inquiry. That is what he promised to do himself. I have written but
it just seems that it is all dead promises. They make promises before they are in government
to get that vote and that is it. I am just sorry but we have asked for an inquiry and he read the
report from Dr Saltizi and he said that he can only deal with that on a one days inquest. It
did need a public inquiry but So, this is why I am grateful for this.
272. THE CHAIRMAN: We are very grateful to hear you say that. Obviously, if there had
been an inquiry, there would not have been a need for us.
A. I am really grateful for what
you gentlemen are doing and whoever is funding it.
THE CHAIRMAN: We are very grateful to you for saying that and possibly Dr Jones may
have some questions for you.
DR JONES: I do not think so; that was very clear.
the inquest

A. I will leave you the full report on

THE CHAIRMAN: And anything else you have or can get. In the meantime, thank you very
much for coming.
The Witness Withdrew
THE CHAIRMAN: That completes the list of witnesses for this morning, to whom we are
always grateful. We will start again this afternoon at 2.00 with Alvin Pritchard. So, we will
be back at 2.00 and we have a list of some seven or eight witnesses this afternoon.

After a Short Adjournment

THE CHAIRMAN: Ladies and gentlemen, we should resume.
MR ALVIN PRITCHARD, Called
273. THE CHAIRMAN: Mr Pritchard, could you start by giving your name and address to
the shorthandwriter?
A. My name is Alvin Pritchard, and my address is
1, Groeslon Cottages, Brynsiencyn, Anglesey, North Wales.
274. THE CHAIRMAN: I was up there at the weekend, and a fine weekend it was. Were
you there this last weekend?
A. I was, yes.
275. THE CHAIRMAN: You can bear me out. Mr Pritchard, you served in the Queen's
Dragoon Guards, is that right?
A. Yes.
276. THE CHAIRMAN: Tell us a little about your service. Did it take you to the Gulf?
A. Yes, indeed.
277. THE CHAIRMAN: Could you tell us about it?
A. Yes. We were deployed to
the Gulf. We started having innoculations in Germany where we were based prior to the Gulf
and also various innoculations in theatre itself, various injections and tablets we were taking,
almost on a willy nilly basis, to be honest.
37

278. THE CHAIRMAN: Sorry to interrupt already but can you remember how many
vaccinations or injections you had all at one time, or spread over?
A. To be honest
I lost count but there were quite a few, maybe a dozen or so. NAPS tablets, BATS tablets
also, anti malaria, anthrax, one for plague I think, and there was one in case we were under
chemical attack. There was deep concern on the ground with the men in general and the
amount of innoculations that were suddenly appearing in the Gulf, but we were not in
a position to question. We had to accept them. We could not refuse. We were ordered to
take these various drugs. Basically after the Gulf -279. THE CHAIRMAN: Just to go back a little in time, did you feel anything as a result of
that first lot of injections, which you had in Germany as I understand it?
A. Not in
Germany. I think it was just the anti malaria tablets they issued in Germany, but the main
ones were issued in theatre.
280. THE CHAIRMAN: I follow, yes.
myself.

A. There were changes that happened in

281. THE CHAIRMAN: So when did you actually get out into the Gulf?
A. October
of 1990. We were a medium range reconnaissance unit, armoured cavalry. It affected me
really after coming back from the Gulf.
282. THE CHAIRMAN: How long were you in the Gulf for?
altogether.
283. THE CHAIRMAN: So you came back in March?
1991.

A. Five months

A. March, that is right, of

284. THE CHAIRMAN: Anything else while you were there? Did you take tablets while
you were there?
A. Yes.
285. THE CHAIRMAN: Can you describe that?
A. NAPS tablets, two tablets -I think they were about 30 mgs. We also took BATS tablets and I am not sure of the strength
of them.
286. THE CHAIRMAN: How often were you taking the tablets while you were out there?
A. On a permanent basis morning and evening every day.
287. THE CHAIRMAN: And how did you feel during that period, between October
and March 2001?
A. During that period it carried on pretty much as normal. My
problems did not start until after really. It is my belief really that all these tablets and
whatever have created a potency in one's body and chemically induced conditions. In myself
anyway.
288. THE CHAIRMAN: To go back again, were you under canvas while you were in Iraq?
A. No, we were out in the open. There were chemical alarms that were being triggered as
well. We had to don our gas masks on a number of occasions, but obviously we were told
they were false alarms so the respirators came off.
289. THE CHAIRMAN: And when an alarm went off, did you in those circumstances take
additional tablets, or what?
A. No. We were already taking the tablets regarding the
alarms but we did don nuclear, biological and chemical warfare suits on a number of
occasions.
38

290. THE CHAIRMAN: So after you had come back in March 2001, what did you do?
Were you still in the army?
A. Yes, I was still in the army. The regiment was in the
process of moving from Wolfenbuettel in Germany over to Tidworth, Hampshire, and that is
when I started having the mood swings. My wife was the first to notice the change in
character.
291. THE CHAIRMAN: Again, it may be difficult to describe but what was the effect of
these mood swings so far as you were concerned?
A. I would be okay one moment and
I would be smashing something up the next. Losing my temper all the time. Up one minute,
down the next.
292. THE CHAIRMAN: How long did this state of affairs last?
A. Well, it is still
going on now, to be honest with you. Moods up and down and psychological stress,
basically, which I am suffering. Like I said, my wife noticed it in me at first. I went into
a state of denial that there was anything wrong with me for about two years. I finished my
time in the army in November of 1991, I finished my terms of service, and when we moved
into the civilian world things just got worse and worse.
293. THE CHAIRMAN: Did you come out for medical reasons?
my engagement.

A. No. I finished

294. THE CHAIRMAN: I follow. What did you do after that?

A. Then we came back
to live in North Wales, on Anglesey, and that is when the problems escalated really. Got from
bad to worse.
295. THE CHAIRMAN: About when did they start to escalate, as far as you remember?
A. During the time I was in, really. They just went up and up and up. I knew there was
something wrong with me but I did not know what it was.
296. THE CHAIRMAN: Did you see your GP?
forced to by the family, yes.

A. Eventually I was more or less

297. THE CHAIRMAN: When did you see him first about this?
A. I made first
contact with the GP about my experiences in 1993, it would have been, and then from there
I went on the Gulf assessment programme.
298. THE CHAIRMAN: Can you describe that?
A. Yes. I went to see
Wing Commander Coker in RAF Wroughton. I had been on the Gulf assessment programme
three times altogether and I got in touch with a psychiatrist on the advice of
Wing Commander Coker. Dr Dafyd Alud Jones has been looking after me. He has been my
psychiatrist ever since, basically. I have not been able to work for thirteen years and I have
been told I will never work again.
299. THE CHAIRMAN: Did you have any job when you went back to Anglesey after
leaving the army?
A. No.
300. THE CHAIRMAN: Did you try to get a job?
A. I tried to get a job, yes. There
was a job where I took up as a fruit delivery driver and I lasted there for one day. The second
day I just did not bother going in because I simply could not handle it.
301. THE CHAIRMAN: Can you say why not? What was the problem, as far as you were
concerned, in your own words?
A. Pressure, basically. There should not have been any
39

pressure on that particular job but basically I could not handle it. I have just been in and out
of psychiatric institutions for the last thirteen years with these problems.
302. THE CHAIRMAN: Have you been treated for psychiatric troubles?

A. Yes.

303. THE CHAIRMAN: Can you describe the treatment you have had?
A.
Psychological treatment for post traumatic stress disorder, and treatment in Tegryn Nursing
Home in Llandudno. Only last month I came out of Alderley Court ex servicemen's mental
welfare society, and I have been to see my psychiatrist. I have also had eminent psychiatrists
looking at me as well. Dr William Spry as well has written reports. I have prepared a small
file of written evidence.
304. THE CHAIRMAN: Perhaps you could let us have that? We would be very grateful.
A. Yes. Also round about 1994, I think it was, or 1995, my wife lost a child as well, a
prenatal death. It is recorded in my evidence. I was so concerned that there was something
up, with people being born with birth defects and that, that I opted for a vasectomy at that
time and I had it done.
305. THE CHAIRMAN: At the moment do you feel you are getting better or about the
same or getting worse?
A. About the same.
306. THE CHAIRMAN: What about your pension position?
A. I initially started off
with 40 per cent war pension, and it was recommended by Dr Gabriel -307. THE CHAIRMAN: We have his report of 17 June 1998 where he supported your
application, and you have a 40 per cent war pension as a result?
A. Yes.
308. THE CHAIRMAN: What percentage do you have at the moment?
to 70 per cent.
309. THE CHAIRMAN: And that is where it remains at the moment?
310. THE CHAIRMAN: On what basis has that been awarded?
stress disorder, mood swings.

A. It went up
A. Yes.
A. Post traumatic

311. THE CHAIRMAN: I think that is all I would want to ask and of course, if we may,
we will look at your papers and study them.
A. The psychiatric reports are in here.
312. THE CHAIRMAN: Perhaps you could hand them up now and if there are any further
questions we would like to ask on the basis of that perhaps we can ask you to come again
some time?
A. Yes. I am currently having four lots of medication now which I take
permanently every day.
THE CHAIRMAN: Yes, and I think we have details of those. Tegretol and Zopiclone.
Dr Jones?
313. DR JONES: I am not quite clear when you attended the medical assessment
programme. I think you said you saw Wing Commander Coker?
A. That is right. That
was the first contact I had with him.

40

314. DR JONES: That was in 1993, was it?

A. No, sorry, that must have been about
1995. I went to one in Lambeth house, I think, as well, which was the second one, and on the
third one I went to St Thomas' hospital.
315. DR JONES: So you have been three times?

A. Yes.

316. DR JONES: Have you found any of those helpful? I know Dr Roger Gabriel
supported your increase in pension claim, but apart from that?
A. Not so much helpful,
no, I would not say. It was just questions and answers basically. There was no treatment as
such offered, but reports were relayed back to my GP and psychiatrist.
317. DR JONES: You have helpfully provided us with a list of your complaints and
symptoms, one of which is dysthymic disorder. Could you elaborate on that?
A. That
was diagnosed by the War Pensions Board, Dr Peter Spry, whose report is in the file. He
diagnosed dysthymic disorder.
318. DR JONES: Thank you. This is not an easy question to answer but perhaps you
would have a go. Of this list of problems starting with post traumatic stress disorder, which
do you think chiefly restricts you and limits your ability to get a job?
A. Mental pressure,
psychiatric problems.
319. DR JONES: Before the war, could you just tell us something about your health and
personality?
A. Before the war I was fighting fit and fit to fight. No problems at all.
320. DR JONES: And no problems with personality or anything? Relationships with
people?
A. No.
321. DR JONES: No problems?

A. No. I was a very happy man.

DR JONES: Thank you very much.

322. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: Forgive me asking this question but there are a lot of ex
servicemen who find it very difficult to adjust to discharge and return to civilian life.
I understand a lot of the homeless in London are ex service people. What distinguishes your
situation from that type of ex serviceman? How do you assess your position as being
different to that? Do you put it down to these injections entirely, or to the service you saw in
the Gulf?
A. Yes, I do, because I felt these effects happen before I came out really but I
bottled them up and refused to admit there was anything wrong with me. They happened
while I was still serving, while we were in Tidworth really, so the effects of the Gulf war
happened prior to coming back, while I was still serving.
323. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: And you served for how many months after your return?
A. Six months.
324. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: And you left the army because of the increase in ill health?
A. No. I had completed my terms of service. They let me out a month early which is
standard practice. They were starting to take effect really.
325. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: My only other question is to ask how old you are. A. I am
39 years old. My wife as well has been through hell and back over this illness.
326. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: She cares for you?
41

A. Yes.

327. THE CHAIRMAN: I am not sure I took a note of when you joined the army in the
first place.
A. Well, I joined the territorial army initially -328. THE CHAIRMAN: When?

A. The territorial or the regular army?

329. THE CHAIRMAN: Well, either. Start with the earliest connection.
A. The
earliest connection was when I was 13 years old, when I joined the Army Cadet Force.
330. THE CHAIRMAN: And that was when?
army, the Royal Military Fusiliers, in 1986.

A. 1977, and then I joined the territorial

331. THE CHAIRMAN: So by the time you went out to the Gulf you had seen fifteen
years' service one way or another, had you?
A. It was not constant service; it was off and
on. I was in the cadets first. I had civilian jobs after I left school and then I joined the
territorial army and then the regular army.
332. THE CHAIRMAN: I think I am being slow but when did you join the regular army?
A. I joined the regular army in November of 1988.
333. THE CHAIRMAN: So you had three years' service in the regular army before you
went out to the Gulf?
A. Yes.
334. THE CHAIRMAN: And what about your health during that time?
problems reported at all.

A.

No

335. THE CHAIRMAN: I follow. Mr Pritchard, we are very grateful to you for coming.
A. You are welcome. Thank you for chairing this.
336. THE CHAIRMAN: If I may ask you, what are you hoping that this inquiry can do for
you? What would you want it to do?
A. I am hoping the government will just put their
hands up and say, "In all good faith we gave these drugs out but we got the potency wrong",
so just put their hands up and admit that there was some wrongdoing here, and also, maybe
more importantly still, for something to be done about this so it des not happen to my
children's generation.
337. THE CHAIRMAN: For the future?
children's generation.

A.

Yes, so it does not happen to my

338. THE CHAIRMAN: Well, that is a very unselfish view, if I may say so, of what it is
all about. We are very grateful to you, Mr Pritchard. Thank you very much for coming, and
please do stay.
A. Thank you.
The Witness Withdrew
MRS LOUISA GRAHAM, Called
339. THE CHAIRMAN: Mrs Graham, please take a seat, and perhaps you could start by
giving your name and address.
A. I am Louisa Graham. I live at 30, Old Budbrooke
Road, Hampton Magna, Warwick.
340. THE CHAIRMAN: Can I thank you very much for coming. I think you are a teacher,
is that right?
A. Yes.
42

341. THE CHAIRMAN: You still are?

A. Yes. That is right.

342. THE CHAIRMAN: Can I ask you, then, what you would like to tell us?
A.
I would like to tell you about my husband who sadly committed suicide in 2002. He had 21
years' service with the forces and saw action in a number of places round the world before he
went to the Gulf war. We were married for 23 years so it was not a new situation at all.
343. THE CHAIRMAN: And he was in the Queen's Own Highlanders?
A. He was
attached to the Queen's Own Highlanders, yes. He was fit, active, a runner, windsurfer,
a surfer, a cyclist, he had a long service, a good conduct medal, he never had any problems,
was a very outgoing sort of person. When he returned from the Gulf he returned very quiet,
and within a short period of time he started to suffer problems. His speech deteriorated and
became very slurred and it continued like that. He became very withdrawn. He began to have
memory problems, nightmares, he used to wake up in the middle of the night sweating so
much that we had to change the bed, and in the end we began to sleep separately for a while in the same room but in separate areas - because he just used to absolutely wake up soaking
wet at night. During the day he used to have flashbacks, dizzy spells
344. THE CHAIRMAN: What do you mean by "flashbacks"?
A. Well, it was almost
like waking nightmares sometimes. All of a sudden something would trigger him and he
would literally start to put his head in his hands and shout "I cannot stand this any more.
They are coming, they are coming again", and particularly as the second Gulf war started this
became more and more frequent. He had occasional blackouts. He did go and see the doctor
about the dizziness because I was concerned for his safety, particularly because he was a chef.
He did have some unexplained rectal bleeding as well but one of the worst things that
happened was that he gradually became violent, particularly towards myself, and that
escalated. To a certain extent I was able to cope with it because of the kind of job that I do.
I deal with young adults and children with very challenging behaviour so I was able to see
that the changes in his behaviour were not him but obviously something exterior, and I was
able to deal with him and protect myself, but eventually in 2002 his outbursts from the
beginning of the year became more and more frequent and more and more dangerous, and he
was becoming very depressed and would not speak hardly at all. He was threatening me in
such a way that I felt it was necessary that I had to leave home for my own safety, because
even though I am to a certain extent able to support people who have violent outbursts and
I am trained to do that, I felt I could not cope with it any more.
I left home at the end of September. My husband attempted suicide. In October he destroyed
our home and our garden. He spraypainted every wall, floor, ceiling in the house, threw
bleach everywhere, slashed all the furniture, took everything he could possibly remove out of
the house into the garden and burnt it. He weedkillered the complete garden which had up
until that point been a real pride and joy to him and a real refuge and destroyed it completely.
I at the time was living amongst various friends and bed and breakfast accommodation for
a period of about two months and never stayed more than about two days in the same place
for their safety as well as my own. He was stalking me, trying to follow me wherever he
could. I work in a secure building because of the kind of children we deal with so I was
continuing to work, but he was waiting for me and hiring different cars to try and follow me.
He again attempted suicide in October, and the police were called several times to the house
345. THE CHAIRMAN: I think that is the first time you have referred to a suicide attempt.
When was the first?
A. The first one was the end of September/beginning of October.
43

346. THE CHAIRMAN: Of 2002?

A. Yes.

347. THE CHAIRMAN: I follow.

A.
because he had been destroying the property --

At the second attempt the police were called

348. THE CHAIRMAN: That attempt was before you had separated?
A. No, just
after, because the neighbours were very concerned for their own property because at that point
he was threatening to set fire to their property as well. He was eventually taken to court for
my safety and was convicted of harassment and asked to keep a safe distance from me, and it
was also to put on record so that the police were aware and also to try and raise the profile of
his problems with the medical profession, which locally were less than helpful.
349. THE CHAIRMAN: Can I interrupt you now and go back right to the beginning
again? You must have talked about what he thought the cause of all this was. What did he
tell you about that?
A. He did not accept that there was anything wrong. He did not
accept that he had any difficulties or any problems. The only thing he did accept was that he
had pains and bleeding and memory loss and speech deterioration, but he really would not go
and see anybody about it at the time.
350. THE CHAIRMAN: To what did he attribute that?
talk to anybody at all.
351. THE CHAIRMAN: So he went out to the Gulf?
352. THE CHAIRMAN: And that was when?

A. He would not discuss it or

A. Yes.

A. January 1991.

353. THE CHAIRMAN: And that was after, I think you told us, many years' service?
A. Yes. He did several tours of active duty in Northern Ireland.
354. THE CHAIRMAN: In the Queen's Own Highlanders?
A. Attached to various
different regiments. He had been attached to the Parachute regiment.
355. THE CHAIRMAN: What was the condition of his health then?
Very fit. He ran, windsurfed, surfed, cycled everywhere.
356. THE CHAIRMAN: So he went out in January 2001?

A. He was A1 fit.

A. 1991.

357. THE CHAIRMAN: I am sorry, January 1991. Did he tell you anything about any
vaccinations or innoculations or anything of that kind which he received before he went?
A. Yes.
358. THE CHAIRMAN: What did he tell you?
A. Just for a period of time for a few
weeks before he went he came home and said, "Oh, I have had another set of vaccinations
again today, I am going to be a pin cushion by the time I have finished", and it seemed to be
a constant thing that was going on for quite a number of weeks before he went, that he was
taking an amount of vaccinations, and when he actually arrived in the Gulf he wrote to me
and said, "I thought I had got away with this and I am still receiving yet more vaccinations",
although he did not state what for.
359. THE CHAIRMAN: Obviously he did not know what they were.

44

A. No.

360. THE CHAIRMAN: Did he mention those to you both before and after he came back?
A. Yes.
361. THE CHAIRMAN: Did he take the view that they had anything to do with his health
after his return, or did he not discuss that?
A. He did not discuss it. He became very
withdrawn, did not speak at all, and used to disappear for hours and hours on end over the
fields and we just did not know where he was. He literally would go away early in the
morning and come back late at night and would not say where he had been or what he had
been doing.
362. THE CHAIRMAN: And this continued right from his return in March?
but it escalated over a period of time.

A. Yes,

363. THE CHAIRMAN: Mrs Graham, it must have been very difficult for you to tell us all
that but we are very grateful. Is there anything you want to add about the period leading
immediately up to his taking his own life?
A. He was an entirely different man to the
man I had been married to for such a long time. He had always been a very caring person.
We had always spent a lot of time together, we had always enjoyed lots of hobbies, lots of
open air active sports, and he was just a totally different person. He was just so aggressive
and so violent.
364. THE CHAIRMAN: After he had returned, could you tell us whether he was able to do
any work?
A. He did work. He worked four days a week as a chef at the local hospital.
365. THE CHAIRMAN: And that went on until when?
before he died.

A. Until about two months

366. THE CHAIRMAN: So he was in work, and therefore did he apply for any form of
war pension?
A. Yes. He did have a war pension.
367. THE CHAIRMAN: Can you remember the percentage?

A. Fifty per cent.

368. THE CHAIRMAN: And what happened to that after his death? Did that lapse or
what?
A. Yes. That died with him.
369. THE CHAIRMAN: So are you yourself getting anything at the moment as a war
widow?
A. No.
THE CHAIRMAN: I follow. Thank you.
370. DR JONES: Do you know much about what your husband did in the Gulf? What
parts he went to?
A. Yes. When he was actually in the Gulf he wrote to me very
regularly on a daily basis, and he phoned me when he could. He appeared to be at the
spearhead most of the time and on one particular occasion he went down a road called the
Basra Strip which had recently been bombed which he was absolutely horrified by because he
said there were literally burning bodies hanging out. As I say he was a very caring man and
certainly on his return the one thing that really hit him very hard was seeing the children, and
certainly he was one of the first people into Kuwait. He wrote about the oil fires, and he took
photographs as well that he brought back while he was there of the oil fires, and he could not
believe the total destruction that was going on and it weighed very heavily with him. Once he
returned, within a few months he never spoke of it again. He would never speak of it again.
45

371. DR JONES: During the time that he continued to work part time, as I understand it,
were there any problems at work? Did he have difficulty in holding a job down?
A. He
did not because he worked largely on his own. He did not work in the main kitchen; he
worked as a special diet chef so he worked for his own little area, so he did not have to
interact with people which suited him very well. Certainly he had odd illness but because of
the way he worked - he worked Monday/Tuesday, Thursday/Friday - I presume he found he
was able to cope with that because he would work two days, have a day off, work two days
and have a couple of days off, and he coped with it that way.
372. DR JONES: You say he never really accepted his illness?
always been so incredibly fit.

A. No, because he had

373. DR JONES: What persuaded him to apply for a war pension?

A. I think that was
a case that he felt that if he did not do that, he was going to be in a situation where he could
feel his health deteriorating. That if he did not do that he was going to be in no position to do
so.
374. DR JONES: Even if he did not outwardly accept it, as it were?
would never accept it with myself.

A. Yes. He

DR JONES: Thank you very much.

375. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: You have recently told Lord Lloyd that it was images of
Basra and children and other ghastly horrors that he saw in Iraq that upset him most. Would
you agree that perhaps that was the cause of his change of mood rather than the injections and
vaccinations he had?
A. No, I would not, because he had seen such active service
elsewhere. He had seen quite a few things in Northern Ireland, particularly in the 70s,
particularly serving with the Parachute regiment that he talked freely about for years, and it
never upset him in the same way. Obviously he was not happy about them but they never
upset him in the same way.
376. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: Did he go to the medical assessment programme or would
he not accept that he was sufficiently ill for that?
A. No.
377. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: So he was not seen by any medical person at all?
A.
Not as far as I know. He used to occasionally go away for the odd day or perhaps not appear
home overnight but then not say where he had been.
378. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: Did his GP see him at all?
A. His GP did see him,
yes. He did visit his GP fairly regularly but he would not discuss anything with me any
further.
379. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: How old was he when he died?

A. Forty-eight.

380. THE CHAIRMAN: Would it have helped if his GP had known that he had served in
the Gulf and had known what other Gulf veterans were suffering?
A. I am not sure
because, as I say, he would not discuss it with me and his GP would not discuss things with
me. At the time when he became increasingly violent he was trying to get some help for him,
and I contacted his own GP and the only answer I ever got was "I cannot discuss it with you.
Patient confidentiality".

46

381. THE CHAIRMAN: But I am again wondering whether, if his GP had known perhaps
more about Gulf war illnesses, that might have helped the GP discuss it with your late
husband?
A. As a personal opinion I would say so, yes.
382. DR JONES: Could I just ask, do you have children?
383. DR JONES: How old is he now?

A. Yes. We have one son.

A. Twenty-two. He is a student.

384. THE CHAIRMAN: He is in good health?

A. Yes. He is, yes.

385. THE CHAIRMAN: Mrs Graham, thank you very much indeed for telling us about
that. I think you perhaps have never given this evidence before?
A. No.
386. THE CHAIRMAN: How did you know about the inquiry? How did you hear about
it, and why did you decide to come?
A. After my husband's death I heard about the Gulf
Veteran's Association which I joined because I suddenly became aware, after his death, of
a number of people having very similar sorts of things happening to them. I was beginning to
read about things, people with similar sorts of health issues that he had had, and as a result of
that I had a newsletter come through which told me about the inquiry.
THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you very much, Mrs Graham.
The Witness Withdrew

MR ADRIAN WILLSON, Called

387. THE CHAIRMAN: Mr Willson, could you begin by giving your name and address to
the shorthandwriter?
A. I am Adrian Willson. I live at 36 Barbers Mead, Taunton TA2
8PY. I was in the Royal Air Force for all of my service career as a flight engineer. I joined
and did my whole service as a flight engineer. Not everybody knows that a flight engineer sits
behind the co-pilot on the flight deck of the larger aeroplanes. We have our own Royal Air
Force magazine published occasionally, and these copies show the flight engineer's
instrument panels for a Nimrod and a VC10, to give an idea of my job.
388. THE CHAIRMAN: I think I know what a flight engineer is, although the kind of
aircraft I used to fly was so small it only had one person in it!
A. That is fair enough.
They are not well known. I have a flight engineer's civilian commercial licence with the
American FAA endorsements on it, and a private pilot's licence.
389. THE CHAIRMAN: Did you serve in the Gulf?
A. I did, sir. I have written
a statement but it will take me twenty minutes or more to read it. I wrote this for my War
Pension Appeal Tribunal but I think it quite adequately describes my problems since 1991. In
1990 I was on a VC10 training course in the build-up to the war. I never finished the flying
programme with the training before I was sent out to fly solo on the VC10 so I did not feel
I was very prepared. I was not familiar with the aeroplane. This, on top of the biological and
chemical warfare threat, gave me quite a lot of worries. I make this clear in the statement, We
were also operating the aeroplane above its normal operating weights, which means you have
no safety margins and if you lose an engine in the early stages of flight you will crash.

47

390. THE CHAIRMAN: What would you like us to do? We have this statement. Would
you like to summarise it for us, or would you like us to read it to ourselves?
A. I would
like you to read it later, sir, but in summary I mention this build-up and how I was not very
well prepared when I went to war. However, the vaccinations had very little effect on me
when I was given them and I cover quite well in my statement the regime of the vaccines
I had, and the fact that there was a Porton Down scientist monitoring it at the time.
After the war I settled down and was learning a lot more about the aeroplane, I seemed to be
in good health and I was on an upward spiral until the latter half of 1991 when I first started
reporting physical symptoms. A lot of problems were going on with me physically. I did not
report them myself to the medical centre because also I was trying to put them out of my mind
but a lot of things were going on psychologically and mentally as well. It was the pilots I was
flying with that started to report me for all manner of errors and omissions in the air. Coupled
with a whole series of motor accidents, the Air Force eventually grounded me and stopped me
flying. After going to Wroughton, and further training they eventually said I was not going to
be fit to fly again, and I was thrown out of the Air Force on compulsory redundancy even
though we were short of flight engineers. It was not a medical discharge. I just felt very
ashamed of the way my life had gone, and I feel that at that time somebody should have been
looking at me to see what had gone wrong me, and why had I deteriorated from a flight
engineer who was well respected.
While I was on Nimrods at both Kinloss and at RAF Luqa, I was the flight engineer on board
the station air display aircraft. I was handpicked to go to Boscombe Down on research and
development flying. I used to fly as a safety pilot with the Empire test pilot school;
I frequently flew as the flight test engineer with British Aerospace, yet I ended up a vegetable
unable to sit on the flight deck of an aeroplane.
391. THE CHAIRMAN: In this statement I see that you have set out a number of possible
factors which may have caused this collapse in your health. Can you just again, in your own
words - we will of course read this - summarise what you had in the way of vaccinations,
injections and so on?
A. I know what some of the vaccines were but some of them just
had code names, so I do not even know.
392. THE CHAIRMAN: When did you receive those?
A. On 8 January I had I think
either six or seven vaccines given in both arms, and again two days later I had exactly the
same vaccines pumped into me.
393. THE CHAIRMAN: This was when you were still in the United Kingdom?
A.
This was at RAF Brize Norton with a Porton Down scientist controlling it and he kept
records. Although I took my air crew vaccination record they refused to put anything on there.
394. THE CHAIRMAN: So there is nothing about these six or eight vaccinations you just
described in that book?
A. Nothing at all, sir, but on my medical documents which I now
have a copy, there is an entry for 8 January saying I was referred to the SMO because of my
concerns, they said, over the anthrax vaccine. But I was concerned about why I was given not
just anthrax but so many others, and I thought they were doubling up vaccines I already had
as my standard RAF air crew issue, shall we say.
395. THE CHAIRMAN: How did you get hold of your medical documents?
Through a solicitor initially.

48

A.

396. THE CHAIRMAN: He wrote to the MoD, did he, or what?

A. Yes, and we
waited more than a year before they arrived, and I think I mention in my statement that none
of the physical symptoms that I was reporting through 1991, 1992, 1993 appear. They put
something like "complaining of stomach cramps", and I never had or complained of stomach
cramps, but what I was going through was far more disruptive. I will not list them now, they
are in the statement, but they are not reported. So, either the doctors in the medical centre did
not list my complaints or somebody has removed them from my records.
397. THE CHAIRMAN: Going back now to the seven or eight injections you received at
Brize Norton, you then did go out to the Gulf, did you?
A. Yes. I had about 14
vaccinations in all, seven or eight one day and two days later the same again. On 22 January
I went out the first time and stayed mainly in Cyprus doing trips daily in and out of different
air strips and cities within the war zone. I flew eleven sorties during the actual combat period
into what was known as the war zone. I picked up three campaign medals, one with a clasp -398. THE CHAIRMAN: And you came back, as it were, each night to Cyprus?
A.
Yes. I had a couple of trips back to Brize Norton as well. Throughout my time in Cyprus or
the Gulf I was taking the NAPS tablets as well. I cannot say I felt any particular trauma.
I was very frightened at the beginning but I do not think I had enough trauma to satisfy what
MAP describe as "post traumatic stress".
399. THE CHAIRMAN: So when did you first start feeling any symptoms?
A. In the
latter half of 1991 in my annual general medical in October of that year they list that I am
complaining of some stomach problems.
400. THE CHAIRMAN: Are you back in Brize Norton by then? Where were you based?
A. I was back in Brize Norton when the war finished. I then started flying on trips around the
world. It was a wonderful job!
401. THE CHAIRMAN: By September/October, whenever, the end of 1991, you were
beginning to feel certain symptoms?
A. I was indeed, sir.
402. THE CHAIRMAN: Were you at that stage able to feel they were due to anything in
particular?
A. No. I had no suspicion that it might have been connected with the Gulf at
all.
403. THE CHAIRMAN: When did that suspicion first occur to you?
A. Probably not
until 1993/1994 because I make it clear in my statement that I am the only air crew from 10
Squadron that had the vaccinations. There is a reason for that -404. THE CHAIRMAN: I think I remember you saying that.
A. I chased round and
I still cannot trace anybody else who had vaccinations but I do know they were all
recommended not to have them. So I was not amongst a peer group that was suffering. I think
some regiments have a lot of people with similar symptoms but I just found myself on my
own. It was only when I started reading press statements that I realised other people were
getting problems. It was many years later when I read in the press of a group of veterans
marching in Whitehall that I travelled up and joined them. That was in 1997 which was the
first time I had any contact with other veterans, and it was from there that I later heard about
the National Gulf Veterans & Families Association. It was through them that I found out
about the medical reports and research work that had been written. I was completely in the

49

dark and isolated until this time. I was just at home vegetating and wondering why my life
was destroyed.
405. THE CHAIRMAN: When did you leave the RAF?
A. In the middle of 1994.
They threw me out because I could not do my job and yet they gave me a discharge medical
of A1, G1, Z1 which means I was fit to fly anywhere in the world on any air crew duties.
406. THE CHAIRMAN: You were discharged on medical grounds -- ?
A. No. I was
thrown out because I could not do my job because they stopped me flying. They made me
redundant.
407. THE CHAIRMAN: You are still not conscious of it being attributable in any way to
what you have done in the Gulf?
A. I was beginning to suspect it, sir, and now I am
100 per cent certain that something that happened to me during the Gulf war has affected me.
I think it has affected the nervous system, the brain and various organs in my body, and what
I want more than anything else is a proper diagnosis. I have been to MAP three times in all
and they do nothing but routine, very simple tests, which is what I really wanted to talk about
now.
408. THE CHAIRMAN: Please do.
treated me.

A. I am very unhappy with the way they have

409. THE CHAIRMAN: This is all set out, I am sure, in your statement but tell us in your
own words now.
A. The first time I went to MAP I was unaware of it because as part of
my discharge medical I was sent to RAF Wroughton where I saw Wing Commander Coker.
I thought I was sent because of all the gut problems I was complaining about but I discovered
years later he had been a research scientist at Porton Down, and I only discovered this year
that he was running the MAP programme at Princess Alexandra's Hospital in 1994 when
I went to see him. Therefore somebody at Brize Norton medical centre must have known or
suspected that I had symptoms similar to other Gulf veterans because I was sent on this
programme.
410. THE CHAIRMAN: Otherwise you would not have been sent to Dr Coker?
A.
Absolutely, and I was not aware of that until this year, but I did go back to MAP in 1997 and
the one thing they did discover there is that I had a missing left kidney. When I was at St
Thomas's Hospital the radiologist, who was using an ultrasound scanner on me, called his
colleague over and he said something like "Here's another one". They explained to me that
they were getting a lot of veterans through with kidney problems. I asked them what I should
do next and they, quite rightly, said they were not supposed to talk to patients but suggested
I had an internal examination into the bladder to see if there were two feeds coming into the
bladder which suggests there should be two kidneys there. This was refused by MAP who
said it was not necessary. The only further test they did was an IVU, where I was injected
with something and I then stood in front of an X-ray plate which gave an image of my body
with a very clear right kidney but a black hole where the left kidney should be. The consultant
wrote a report saying that it was probably a lesion from birth. However, Dr Gabriel from
MAP, changed the wording when he sent a letter to my doctor saying that instead of lesion he
would put the word "missing", and from that moment onwards it has been put down as a birth
defect. I asked my doctor for a second opinion, and she said "Well, who do I listen to?
A medical professional or you?" So I have never had a second opinion.

50

Some time later a friend of mine produced a photocopy from a medical journal all about
kidney diseases and when I read this I thought "Well, this is almost identical symptoms to
those I had been reporting when I was at Brize Norton", which of course made me very
suspicious. Then in 2000 I read in a copy of the Sandy Times (newsletter of the Gulf Veterans
Association) a letter by a lady named Sylvia McCormack. She said that her partner had been
diagnosed by MAP as having a birth defect with his kidneys, but he was now under another
specialist who stated it could not possibly have been a birth defect. One of his kidneys was the
size of a five-month foetus and the chap had done two and a half thousand parachute jumps
which would have killed him with a kidney like this.
I then contacted her and she said she had already had over 100 Gulf veterans contact her to
say that they had been diagnosed with birth defects in their kidneys by MAP. To me this is
statistically not correct. I even happen to know that Saun Rusling was identified, by MAP, as
having kidney scarring. MAP told him "probably from childbirth". Now this is one area
where I feel it would be nice if the inquiry were to investigate how many people had birth
defects or kidney defects.
411. THE CHAIRMAN: It was always in the kidney, was it?
A. I am only looking at
the kidneys. When I asked Dr Gabriel how many patients he had had through with kidney
defects, he said, "We do not keep statistics" and I had quite an argument with him because
I suggested that his job was to keep statistics. He then threw back the Data Protection Act at
me and said "I cannot keep statistics because I am not allowed to". Well Sylvia McCormack,
in her letter, also states that she asked Dr Gabriel how many people had kidney defects and he
said they do not keep figures on these things, so I think there is an area there for investigation.
While I am talking about MAP I have included two letters I have had from Dr Gabriel. One
of them is to my doctor and it says, "He" - me, of course - "now appreciates, I hope, that he
has a psychiatric illness and will not waste time, energy and aspirations chasing after non
existent organic explanations which will never be found" because I still believe my illnesses
are organic in origin.
He wrote another letter directly to me where he says That very substantial progress on Gulf
war-related illnesses have been made, the most telling feature being that they are primarily
psychological dysfunctions of a post combat nature. Similar events have been recorded since
at least the American Civil War and are not unique to the Gulf conflict. There are no illnesses
specific to participation in Operation Granby".
Well, there is a contradiction straight away because his opening sentence says there has been
considerable progress, and then he says there is no illness specific to Operation Granby. With
letters like this, my GPs will not give me any treatment. I have spoken to my MP who referred
me to the primary care trust, who just referred me back to MAP.
412. THE CHAIRMAN: Who is your MP?
A. Adrian Flook. All I ever get is another
referral to MAP and all they do is simple routine tests; they will not look deeper. They will
not look at my brain, my blood brain barrier, my nervous system. They will not look for
squalene antibodies or the possibility of auto immune.
413. THE CHAIRMAN: We have heard about squalene antibodies this morning. Tell me
a bit more about that. How do you connect that with your condition?
A. Only from the
research that has been done and papers I have read. I have listened to a researcher named Pam
Asa, who came to Britain and gave a speech about the work they have been doing. A number
51

of researchers in the United States have done tests with animals on squalene. Almost 100
per cent of sick Gulf veterans, that have been tested, test positive for squalene antibodies.
414. THE CHAIRMAN: Do you connect that with any particular vaccine or injection that
you have received?
A. Yes. They do have proof that a lot of the American vaccines had
squalene in them when they were given.
415. THE CHAIRMAN: Any particular vaccine, can you recall, or not?
anthrax vaccines from the United States had squalene in them.

A. Well, the

416. THE CHAIRMAN: I thought you had not mentioned the anthrax until that point.
That is fine.
A. I have got something here which I am giving you a copy of. There is
a lady who lives in Taunton, her name is Paula Goodship. She was a nurse serving in the NHS
but she went to the Gulf with the territorial army where she was given all these injections and
she had to give them to the troops. She was told she was not allowed to keep her own record
but being a nurse she did, illegally I suppose, keep her own record, and this is it and it has -417. THE CHAIRMAN: What is her name?
A. Paula Goodship. She has been very ill
like all the rest of us since the war and she now cannot work at all.
418. THE CHAIRMAN: Do you know whether she has been in touch with the inquiry?
A. No. She has not, sir, and only recently - well, only this year I told her about the NGVFA
but she has had very little contact with other veterans.
419. THE CHAIRMAN: It might be that we want to get in touch with her.
A. I will
leave you her phone number. She has batch numbers for two lots of anthrax vaccines which
she states came from the United States. She said they were manufactured in the States yet our
government keep denying that any anthrax they gave was manufactured in the United States.
420. THE CHAIRMAN: She could trace it by the batch number or something, could she?
A. I hope somebody can, yes.
THE CHAIRMAN: It seems to me you have done an incredible amount of work, and I can
see why if I may say so, but we have obviously got to do work on your papers as well, now,
but I am just wondering whether at this stage it would not be sensible to ask Dr Jones if he has
any further things he would like to ask, but by all means come back after he has finished.
421. DR JONES: I take it that the significance you attach to the manufacture of the anthrax
vaccine in the States is because of the inclusion of squalene as opposed to the anthrax vaccine
that is manufactured in this country?
A. Yes.
422. DR JONES: You state, while we are on the subject of squalene, "Many veterans are
ill with a form of auto immune disease caused by squalene contained in the anthrax vaccines".
What is the source of that information?
A. The papers by Tulene University. Have you
read these, sir? There are several names given on these papers but the only one I can
remember is Asa.
423. DR JONES: We have heard about that before from other vets, thank you. Going
backwards rather, you have stated in your statement and again this afternoon that when you
wanted to have your vaccines recorded on your personal vaccination record you were not
allowed to do so?
A. Correct.
52

424. DR JONES: Was any reason given?

A. No, not at the time. I was just told to add
my number, rank and name on to a clipboard with a list of names.
425. DR JONES: You believe, and obviously you have looked into it, that you were the
only air crew member in No 10 Squadron who got those vaccines?
A. Yes.
426. DR JONES: Because the other clever chaps had been advised not to?
A. Well,
I mentioned I had been on a training course which had been disrupted because of the war.
I could not go to the Gulf because I was not fully qualified so I was sent home for Christmas
and New Year on leave. I think I was the only member of the Squadron who went home on
leave, and I was called by telephone and told to go and have these vaccines and then come on
to the squadron, and when I got to the squadron they said, "Oh no. We've been told don't
have them", so they were all right.
427. THE CHAIRMAN: So they never got them?

A. No.

428. THE CHAIRMAN: We have heard from several veterans, not necessarily in the RAF,
that it was made a disciplinary offence not to have them?
A. So I understand.
429. THE CHAIRMAN: But they managed to wriggle out of this?
A. I believe that
the Tornado pilots who were shot down during the war, will tell you that they were told all
their air crew did not have the jabs, but the ground crew did. It certainly was not an offence
on 10 Squadron, and there was very little record kept. Nobody checked up if you had had
them or not.
430. THE CHAIRMAN: Do you know the background or any details about Sylvia
MacCormack?
A. None at all, sir. I have only ever spoken to her on the telephone. She
was the practice nurse of a local doctor, that is how I got to hear of her, but she has now given
up work.
431. THE CHAIRMAN: Are you in work at the moment?
A. Not at the moment, sir.
I have done some work over the last three weeks on a building site in Bristol doing some
electrical work but that was really for a friend.
432. THE CHAIRMAN: Are you saying you are not fit to work?
A. When I sit
down a lot, sir, I get terrible backaches. Whenever I am on my feet for more than a few hours
I find I can hardly walk. I get such pains in my legs and joints, my whole body aches, and
I get very confused. I make a lot of errors.
433. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: You said that the reason for your discharge from the RAF
was because of errors that had been reported. Do you still hold a private pilot's licence?
A. I do, sir, all I need is a medical to keep it current but I have not had a medical since the
1990s, since before the Gulf war.
434. THE CHAIRMAN: So it is not current?
A. It is not current. The engineer's
licence has completely lapsed. The private pilots I could re-instate with a check flight and
a medical, but I have no confidence. I do not think I could judge a hot air balloon safely.
I used to ride motor bikes but I have given those up. Too dangerous.
435. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: So holding that licence is not a practical proposition
because you would be risking your own safety?
A. I would, yes.
53

436. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: And you have no confidence in the use of that licence?
A. None at all. I think I would be very dangerous. I have blackouts. I have periods where
I suddenly come out of a trance. I do not know where I am, I do not know what I have done
that day, I do not know what I am supposed to be doing.
437. THE CHAIRMAN: Lastly, following up Dr Jones about the refusal of certain people
to take the injections, is a flight engineer an officer rank?
A. No. I was what was called
a master engineer.
438. THE CHAIRMAN: John Nichol told us he had refused the injections, and it may well
be that officers felt confident to refuse them and other ranks were obliged to take them?
A. As I understand it, on 10 Squadron it was just the air crew who were told not to take
them. Somebody felt it would affect our performance, as I understand it.
439. THE CHAIRMAN: We are extremely grateful to you, but I just want to ask you one
other question. You have listed in your statement a long list of symptoms from which you
suffer or which you suffer. I think you have already answered this but which of those is the
real problem? Obviously you have some physical disabilities but how would you have
described the main problem?
A. I think it is a memory problem. I cannot remember what
I did in the morning. People come and talk to me and I cannot remember having
conversations, and because of the lack of memory I become very confused with the things
I do.
440. THE CHAIRMAN: But the difficulty is that you have set this statement out so well -A. I have been working for months. It took me months -- well, I have days when I feel very
confident, when everything goes well for me and I feel I should be in a proper job, and then
I have these breakdowns where I get overloaded if I try and do too much at once, and
I completely break down and I get into terrible rages. This is something else I cannot explain
and I keep having real aggressive outbursts with people, even friends and people I like. This
I cannot explain.
441. THE CHAIRMAN: All I can say is that, as far as we are concerned, you could not
have put it more clearly than you have and we will certainly study your statement with the
greatest care, plus all the other documents which I hope you will hand in.
A. Yes. May
I say one more thing about a particular publication which is published by the Gulf Veterans
Investigation Unit. The first time I got a copy of this was Issue No 3. It was given to me by
a senior army officer who had been sent it by post. He had no interest in it but he thought I
might have, and when I read it my blood boiled at the things I was reading. It was very
clearly propaganda, and it is very biased in everything it says.
Seeing this was Issue No 3, I telephoned the number at the back to obtain Issues 1 and 2, and
I asked to be put on the mailing list for future issues. However that never happened. When
I got hold of Issue No 1 it says, "The aim of this newsletter is first and foremost to reach
veterans and their representatives to keep them informed" but when I went to the NGVFA
AGM last year and asked if anybody had ever seen these magazines, nobody had. But I have
discovered they have sent them to GPs, MPs, the House of Lords - everybody they want to
canvas on to their side - and it is very biased reporting. It does not contain any reporting on
things we want to know about.
Lastly, sir, in Issue 3 there is a statement from the Gulf Veterans Medical Assessment
Programme where they say that the satisfaction rate from the people they have seen is over 95
54

per cent and continues to be maintained. Then in Issue No 4 published a year later they have
gone from 95 per cent to 96 per cent of veterans now completely satisfied. Now I have met
many Gulf veterans and I have not yet met anybody satisfied with their diagnosis from MAP.
So I held these up and read these out at the NGVFA AGM and there were cries of derision
and anger so I asked for a vote. I said "Of all the people in this room" - about 100 plus -"who have been to MAP, how many are satisfied", and nobody was, so I asked how many
were dissatisfied, and it was 100 per cent.
Now, if a government department are going to distort the facts so badly, how can we ever get
any proper satisfaction?
442. THE CHAIRMAN: I am glad you came back to that point, if I may say so, because it
seems a very powerful point, but all that you will let us have, will you?
A. Yes.
THE CHAIRMAN: Thank you very much.
The Witness Withdrew
DR NIGEL HUMPHREY GRAVESTON, Called
443. THE CHAIRMAN: Can you give your name and address to the shorthandwriter,
please?
A. Dr Nigel Humphrey Graveston, 2 West Gate, Worley Road, Read, Burnley,
Lancashire, BB12 7PN.
444. THE CHAIRMAN: How would you like to deal with this? Do you want to
summarise this in your own words?
A. This is a skeleton of what I would like to say and
I would like to embellish on some of these points.
445. THE CHAIRMAN: Please do that.
A. I was deployed in late 1990 with 33 Field
Hospital RAMC at Al Jubail in Saudi Arabia. I was a consultant anaesthetist in the army.
I spent all my time in Al Jubail except for a period of four weeks at the end of 1990 and the
beginning of 1991 when I was detached with a small company size of men to King Khaled
International Airport in Riyadh to prepare that site for 205 Scottish General Hospital when
they deployed there early the next year. During deployment I was vaccinated against anthrax,
plague and pertussis. We were actually told because we were a medical unit what these were,
and being a doctor obviously I was very interested in what was being given. After some of
the vaccinations I became ill for 2 or 3 days. I suffered from fever, a painful inflamed
indurated injection site, and general debility.
My records have not come but they will be in the post somewhere. I had three anthrax
vaccinations and with the whooping cough two of them are dated and one is not dated. There
is no record of my plague vaccination. During the air war phase, when I returned to Al Jubail,
I remember one night, I think it was 17 January, we had an NBC alarm. This was in the form
of "gas, gas, gas" being broadcast over the tannoy system at Camp 4 which was our residence.
We assumed full IPE state with respirators. We were later told it had been a false alarm and
that detector equipment had been set off by unburnt fuel from the afterburners of fast jets
flying overhead. Today I heard the same story several times. It was evidenced today by all
the earlier speakers that the RAF personnel have not been able to replicate this phenomenon.
I was repatriated on 10 March, only ten days after the cessation of hostilities. I was very
surprised by this, very surprised indeed. Very pleased, but very surprised. I was repatriated
very soon after the war. After repatriation I left the army on 22 April 1991. I applied for a
55

premature voluntary release one year earlier. I worked in the NHS in several consultant
anaesthetist posts and was generally well until 1999.
Moving on to development of my ill health, I think you will find this somewhat familiar after
listening to speakers earlier today. In November 1999 I became ill with what I felt was
work-related stress. At this time I was working as a consultant anaesthetist in an NHS
hospital. Our department was short-staffed, I was a clinical director, I thought "Well, I have
gone down with stress." I was anxious, I became a little depressed, and a bit concerned for
my future health in general. I saw my GP but did not receive any treatment and after three
months of basic rest I returned to work but no longer did the arduous management tasks I had
done before. After ten days I started my sickness absence, this would be in November 1999,
I received a telephone call from the brother of a very good friend of mine, my best friend, and
he informed me that my best friend had committed suicide while suffering from depression.
My best friend was Dr Alan James Mathams, MB, BS, FRCS, MRCGP, Major RAMC(V)
who had served in the Gulf War with 205 General Hospital in Riyadh. This was my first
contact with Gulf War illness though I did not realise at the time. After returning to work in
early 2000 I was fairly well but was at times suffering from some anxiety when going to
work. Later in that year, I was at work and began to feel really quite unwell. My blood
pressure was taken by the charge nurse and found to be extremely high. I think the diastolic
was more than 120. I saw my GP who after some false starts got my blood pressure under
reasonable control, and I arranged a date to return to work.
When the day came to return to work, I could not do so. I froze and became very anxious.
I think we have heard this sort of thing from one of the early speakers this afternoon. I again
saw my GP and a diagnosis of depression and anxiety was made. I was started on treatment
and eventually returned to work after a five-month absence, in the spring 2001. For the next
year, sir, I remained at work, but tended to have multiple short periods of sick leave.
However, during this time my anti-depressant requirements had increased, as had my antihypertensive therapy. In spring 2002 I was on sick leave again. During this episode I visited
my parents, and my mother raised the issue of whether I had this Gulf War Syndrome. Like
the majority of doctors, I knew next to nothing about this at that time. I think that is
something to be noted; that most doctors in this country know very, very little, if anything,
about Gulf War Syndrome, and I think that is a major problem. I rang the National Gulf
Veterans and Families Association and spoke to Shaun Rusling.
446. THE CHAIRMAN: You are now the Chairman of that Association, I think.
A. Yes, I am. From that day on, in my opinion, there is no doubt that the diagnosis my
mother made is correct. I confronted my general practitioner with this, and he seemed
bemused. I told him I had Gulf War Syndrome. He knew nothing about it. I am fairly
confident that had it not been for my extensive reading and contact with other ill veterans that
I would not have received the treatment today which means that I can function as a near
normal human-being. Of course, by now my health had deteriorated. I had accumulated a fair
collection of signs, symptoms and conditions, which I now detail. We have had this on a list
several times today.
447. THE CHAIRMAN: I do not think we need it again.
A. I will just leave that.
After some time my GP referred me to a psychiatrist at my request. I should say that at this
time I was actually telling my GP what to do. I saw the psychiatrist, and at my request he
56

ordered an MRI scan of my brain. This is the second annex, which you do not have. I will
read it out.
448. THE CHAIRMAN: I am wondering whether it would help to have the technical
terms. Obviously, we will look at that, but I am not sure you need to read it out. Just
summarise it.
A. There are numerous abnormal areas in the brain which the radiologist
says may be possibly an underlying vasculitis or eschaemia. That means poor blood supply to
the brain. I have three other MRI scans from Gulf War veterans that also mention the term
eschaemia. I returned to work after five weeks sick leave in 2002 but I was taken off the oncall rota because of my mental state, and in fact I can only function normally by taking my
medication. By April 2003 my health had deteriorated such that I was off work for 11 months
I basically collapsed. Due to the complexity of the job I did as a consultant anaesthetist and
the fact that you really need to be on the ball and on your toes and to explain this, I would
have poor memory and poor concentration, irritability and panic attacks and this is
obviously not the person you would like to give an anaesthetic - it became obvious to me at
that time that my anaesthetic career was over.
After a period of 11 months I returned to work in March 2004 but now I work as an
occupational health physician. It is a much slower-paced job where if I have problems I can
take the time out without it having any adverse effect on the patient. It is also an area which
has stimulated some of my ideas concerning Gulf War Syndrome. I now work actively in the
NGV&FA. I have started some studies looking at various aspects of Gulf veterans health,
looking at the conditions for which war pensions have been given. It is really quite a range of
conditions. We have also looked at the treatment that Gulf veterans are on, and it is
particularly of interest not in so much for what treatments they are on, but what treatments
they are not on. There are veterans who have severe problems with, for example, depression,
who are not on any effective anti-depressants, which I find very interesting and not a little
worrying, because it is well known that people who are depressed have a tendency to take
their own lives, as we have seen today. I am also in the process of collecting MRI scans of
the brains of Gulf veterans. My own scan is highly abnormal. I have availed myself of
information held by the Association and do my own Internet searches; and last, but not least, I
have spoken to many Gulf veterans.
The big question is: why am I ill? My investigations into why I, and many other veterans, am
ill has led me to use numerous sources. I have referenced these as best I can, without making
this statement into an incoherently turgid scientific paper. I hope that copies of these
documents will available from the NGV&FA in time for my giving oral evidence. I think
they have arrived in fact. In regard to the disease pattern, there are numerous papers outlining
the various symptoms, signs and conditions suffered by ill Gulf veterans. Some are from the
Ministry of Defence sponsored work; others from sources in the UK and USA. As I say, the
NGV&FA has done its own survey on this.
All these studies show a great diversity of symptoms and the fact that both Gulf veterans in
the UK and the USA are more likely to be ill. These are not only stated by independent
papers, but by people like Simon Westlake and Professor Harry Lee. These are references
3-9. The great variety of symptoms does in fact lead to people saying there cannot be one
illness because they are so wide; there is nothing to explain this great breadth of
symptomatology. However, it is very interesting that Professor Robert Haley in the United
States has analysed this rather complex business called methodology and the various
57

distributions of symptoms, and he has come up with three distinct sub-syndromes for Gulf
War Syndrome. One involved anxiety and depression the other was confusion and ataxia; and
the third is muscular/skeletal problems. Today, we have heard a lot of people complaining
about the symptoms in those ranges. The range of symptoms is wide and varied.
The diagnoses of Post-Traumatic Stress disorder (PTSD) and Signs and Symptoms of
Ill-Defined condition (SSIDC) have been made. However, the problem with these is that
these seem to be made by the veterans agency in conjunction with giving a war pension.
However, there are some problems with these. SSIDC is no longer in the International
Classification of Diseases, known as ICD10, and diagnosis of PTSD has been made on
veterans who were non-deployed and went nowhere near the Gulf; so where the trauma in that
Post-Traumatic Trauma Stress Disorder comes from, I am not quite sure. Were they worried
to go out to the Gulf? I do not think that is really an adequate explanation. What causative
factors might we look at for origins of Gulf War illness, Gulf War Syndrome use what term
you like? I have listed the ones which are the main ones being considered.
The vaccines: was it anthrax; was it pertussis; was it plague; or was it the way the vaccines
were given, the vaccine regimes? It is less common now, but certainly at that time and for a
long time in the past vaccines have contained a preservative known as Thiamersal, while
formerly known as ethyl mercury salicylate. If you are going to have a whole lot of vaccines,
as certain of the veterans did, this could leave to a considerable amount of mercury being
given in a short period of time to the veterans. Mercury is a very, very toxic compound; it is
the most toxic metal which is not a radionucleotide. Then there are organophosphates in the
form of chemical warfare agents: Sarin, or Cyclo-Sarin; and insecticides in the form of sprays
or flea collars; infections have been implicated; combat stress which does not explain the
non-deployed people and the people who were in more rural areas and depleted uranium.
However, one has to consider that there are veterans who were not deployed who are ill.
Hence, that rules out all those except the vaccines, because they are the common experience
of all veterans, employed or otherwise. Therefore, logic determines that the vaccinations and
the way in which they were administered needs closer scrutiny.
I will now deal with the vaccines individually. The anthrax vaccine was devised to protect
veterinarians, workers in laboratories and in the hair-and-hide industries against cutaneous
anthrax. The mode of delivery, if one were to use anthrax as a biological weapon, would be
in the form of anthrax spores and an aerosol. There is no evidence that this would protect
anybody against aerosol-delivered anthrax.
The manufacturers recommended administration regime is four doses over 32 weeks.
veterans were given the anthrax vaccinations over much shorter periods of time, and I think
veterans have come along with records of vaccinations to show this.
449. THE CHAIRMAN:
We have plenty of evidence of that already.
A. Additionally, there were concerns over the efficacy of the vaccine, and they started to use
the pertussis vaccine as an adjuvant.
450. THE CHAIRMAN: You then set out the various other vaccinations: pertussis, 24
plague, 25 pertussis as an adjuvant; multiple immunisations. Perhaps it would help us if you
started again at paragraph 26. We will obviously take into account what you have said in
58

paragraphs 23-25. What do you say about multiple immunisations?

A. In addition to the
ones you have mentioned, many veterans received other vaccines. I quote the reference here.
451. THE CHAIRMAN: It refers to the administration of 20 innoculations over a sixmonth period.
A. I have the reference here, sir. The section is 182 of the document, of
the implementation of the immunisation programme against biological warfare agents for UK
forces during the Gulf conflict 1990/91. It is for 20 July 2000, Gulf Veterans Illness Unit.
I shall read out the paragraph: The full regime of all these vaccines over a period of about
seven weeks would have been 17 immunisations in total. For those that were deployed in the
Gulf for a period of six months or over, a further cholera immunisation would have been
required.
452. THE CHAIRMAN: You are now reading from something we have not got. Can you
go on with paragraph 26, which possibly summarises what you have there. I am sorry to
interrupt.
A. In addition to the above-mentioned immunisations, many veterans received
numerous others. This reference refers to the administration of 20 innoculations over a sixmonth period. However, many veterans had these over a much shorter period of time, as I am
sure that other statements of veterans have evidenced. The administration of so many
vaccines to so many individuals over such a short period of time is unprecedented.
Additionally, not very much was known about the anthrax and plague vaccines, and probably
nothing was known about giving so many vaccines together in such a short period of time.
For medical science, this is undoubtedly virgin territory.
I would like to elaborate on that. People will say, there is no Gulf War Syndrome because I
cannot see any evidence in any of the textbooks. I have to say that as far as I am aware,
there is no precedent to giving so many vaccinations to so many people, all over a short
period of time. There is a book by an American dentist, Hal Huggins, who describes back in
the thirties some nurses getting a large number of vaccines, but not a very large number of
nurses and then developing rheumatoid arthritis. Apart from that, I am not aware of any
similar occurrence.
453. THE CHAIRMAN: In paragraph 27 you set out your concerns about the vaccines
under (a) to (c) and then at paragraph 28 you give an overview. Could you start again there?
A. I think the vaccination programme was poorly planned; there was disregard for scientific
evidence and the references I have given in 11 and 12 will bear that out a disregard for
safety, a disregard for the medical adage prima nonno sera first do no harm; disregard of
operational requirements and one of the references I give shows that concerns from the
GOC and some of the medical officers - they started not to have the vaccines, and some local
commanders decided not to give their troops vaccines because of the concern that they may
have produced so much illness in their unit that the unit was ineffective woolly thinking and
incompetence; an element of panic; and I think there was arrogance.
454. THE CHAIRMAN: Then your overall opinion.
A. It is my considered view that
Gulf War illness is due to the cocktail of vaccines given to the troops and in particular the
anthrax/pertussis/plague combination. There has been work to look at the pathological
mechanisms which may have caused this, and evidence of physical damage to body tissues.
59

The best work done so far is by Professor Robert Haley and I give two references, which are
quite technical. They are basically damage to the basal ganglia area of the brain.
At the NGV&FA I have been collecting MRI scan reports of ill veterans. This work is in the
early stages but is nevertheless starting to show some interesting things. A comprehensive
theory of Gulf War Syndrome needs to be developed. The attempts to somatasise that is
say it is all in the head and you are imagining these things the symptoms of Gulf War
veterans is to skirt over the problem and not to engage constructively in addressing issues of
research in Gulf War Syndrome. As a doctor, being inquisitive analytical and logical, I have
extensively searched the Internet for useful information. This, combined with the type of
medical work I now practise, has lead me to seriously consider that the problem of Gulf War
Syndrome is dysfunction of the limbic system due to physical brain damage. The limbic
system is the part bang in the middle of the brain, and performs a very important function,
namely cognitive functions.
I would most welcome the opportunity to discuss this line of thought and inquiry with experts
working in this field.
455. THE CHAIRMAN: Your final paragraph?
A. I would like to see a recognition
that a frameworks exists; that it is a physical organic illness; that there is appropriate research
into this; and that there is development of effective treatment for ill veterans.
456. THE CHAIRMAN: Can I express our great gratitude for this. It sets it out extremely
clearly, if I may say so. I must ask one question straight away about the third paragraph,
when you say a physical organic illness. Do you think it is only one illness, or could it be
one or two or more related illnesses, organic related illnesses?
A. The mechanism, I
think, is that somehow the brain has been damaged.
457. THE CHAIRMAN: That is Dr Haley, is it?
A. Haley has shown there has been
brain damage, but there has to be a mechanism for the brain damage. Certainly three of the
four MRI scans I have do mention eschaemia. If there is eschaemic damage to the brain, you
obviously get brain damage dysfunction of the brain. I do know that there are certain areas of
the limbic system which are very sensitive to blood flow. The other thing is that a lot of the
symptoms are symptoms of dysfunction of the limbic system the depression, the confusion,
all the memory problems; the problem with sexual function, appetite. Also the limbic
function inputs to a lot of other areas of the brain, and particularly the hypothalamus, and that
and the limbic system are part of the stress mechanism of the brain. I have seen in my
practice as an occupational health physician a lot of people with work-related stress, and their
symptoms are very similar to those of the ill Gulf War veterans. However, there is a big
difference. The people I see with work-related stress, if you take them away from work and
give a course of anti-depressants and a bit of counselling, sort out problems at work they get
better. Gulf veterans do not get better. I think it is the same mechanism being disrupted, not
by a chronic stressful environment, but by physical damage secondary to auto-immune
disease, a cause of eschaemia. I have handed over some papers to Vijay, one of which is quite
interesting, looking at the role of thrombin in possible brain damage. I also handed papers
dealing with the effect of a hypothalamo-pituitary-adrenal and a hypothalamo pituitary
gonadal axis in the development of rheumatoid arthritis and also systemic lung disease ----60

458. THE CHAIRMAN: That was just what I was coming to ask you about. Were you
here this morning?
A. I was, yes.
459. THE CHAIRMAN: A number of veterans were giving their primary symptoms of
something like asthma, shortage of breath; and others were saying that their primary
symptoms were muscular either their backs were bad or their joints were aching. Is the Dr
Haley theory that that could all be due to damage to the brain?
A. Yes. If you look at
illnesses which can be caused or exacerbated by stress, you will see that they are arthritis,
asthma A recent paper published showed that hypocortisolism may be a factor in chronic
fatigue syndrome. Cortisol is released from the adrenal cortex, which is controlled from the
hypothalamo-pituitary axis, which in turn has an input from the limbic system.
460. THE CHAIRMAN: I shall hand you over in a moment to Dr Jones. You are in the
very unusual position of having been a doctor who actually had these injections over a very
short time. At that time, did that strike you as being in any way unusual, or were you quite
satisfied that this was a proper ----A. We went out there, and I think that we did not
know what was going to happen. If I may digress, I saw a chap called Sergeant Sergeant, and
he had been out in the Falklands. He said: Sir, I think what is going to go down here will
make the Falklands look like a long weekend. I think he was concerned that it was going to
be a long job, and who knows how long he might be out there. Thankfully, it did not turn out
like that.
From my view, I trusted people. I presumed these people knew what they were doing. If you
go round questioning what everybody does, you are going to get you know.
461. THE CHAIRMAN: You left the Army in April 1991, but it was only in 1999 that you
really began to feel bad.
A. Yes. There were a few episodes beforehand, where I
thought, is this me? Then working in a stressful environment like the Health Service, you
put it down to stress.
462. THE CHAIRMAN: I am not quite sure why in your case there was such a long delay
between the injections and the serious onset of your symptoms in 1999 and 2000.
A. If
you talk to quite a number of veterans, there is quite a lag between the initial injections and
then the disease process developing. If I could refer to my friend who committed suicide in
1999, he obviously developed the illness at a similar time to what I did.
463. DR JONES: So far amongst the veterans we have seen and others we have read about,
the delay between your Gulf War experience in its totality and your illness is far longer than
any other that we have come across. Do you have any view about that?
A. I think it is
an ongoing process. Certainly I spoke to ill veterans who have only recently developed the
condition.
464. DR JONES: There is a long list of references, up to 15 in the paper. I do not have that
list but I understand we will get it in due course. Have you discussed your views on the
limbic system possibility with neurologists or neuro-physiologists or anybody?
A. I
61

have not, no. I think one of the problems is that there is too little known abroad about Gulf
War Syndrome. One of my distinct impressions is, both having seen my general practitioner
and my neurologist, is that they are very busy people. They do not want yet another illness to
foul their day. They are probably overworked and do not have the time to come to terms with
it; plus what has been published in the UK about Gulf War illness is not desperately helpful.
Most of the useful work has come from the United States.
465. DR JONES: You have not corresponded with Robert Haley about it?
not, no.
466. DR JONES: Are you thinking of doing so?

A. I have

A. I am thinking of doing so.

467. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES:

You say in paragraph 27A of your paper that
miraculously this fax has been found. Do you mean miraculously from the Gulf War
veterans point of view or are you suggesting there has been some sort of deception on behalf
of MoD or ----A. Well, if one reads the reference ----468. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: It is actually helpful to the Gulf War veterans case.
A. It is, but the problem is that it was lost for so long. The problem with the fax is that it
was from the Department of Health to the Ministry of Defence, explaining the findings of the
National Institute of Standards and Control, saying that combining some of these vaccines
was causing ill health in the rodents. Vaccine patient programmes had already started and it
would appear that this fax was sent to the Ministry of Defence and then lost. If it had been
not lost and acted upon, they may have taken a different course of action.
469. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: Who found it? Did they find it or did you find it?
A. I cannot remember. Shaun Rusling may know. Was it the NIBSC or the veterans group,
but the problem is that it was lost and the Ministry of Defence said, we dont have it. Then,
obviously, it has been somewhere, and it has just re-appeared.
470. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: Mr Wilson, who we heard from just before, said that
kidney damage was one of the main features of Gulf War illnesses. You said that it is damage
to the brain. Which ----A. The problem is that the brain, through you may have
heard of the nervous system, the endocrine system and the immune system; well, the present
view is that it is not a nervous system/endocrine system/immune system; they all are
interlinked together. Therefore, a nervous problem can cause damage to the immune system.
If you look at long-term stress, that can have problems with the immune system. You tend to
find people who are heavily stressed tending to have more infections, and the problem with
rheumatoid arthritis, which is an auto-immune disease.
471. THE CHAIRMAN: Dr Graveston, thank you very much indeed for that. Obviously,
you are going to take a continuing interest in this inquiry.
A. Absolutely, sir.
472. THE CHAIRMAN: So if at any stage there are other things that you want to tell us, I
hope that you will ----A. I have deposited some more papers with Vijay.

62

473. THE CHAIRMAN: Am I right in thinking that Raymond Bristow, who is to come
later on, is the Chief Executive of your Association?
A. He is Chief Executive in so
much as he looks after the office side and the running side.
474. THE CHAIRMAN: We have a long-ish statement from him as well. But between
you, you can make sure that we get all that we need to have.
A. Yes.
The witness withdrew
THE CHAIRMAN: There is a very short statement, which I am going to read, because Lisa
Mates is unable to be here this afternoon. It is about her brother, Paul Carr, who died in
August of 1997. I will read that statement into the record in the absence of Mrs Mates.
Paul served in the Gulf in 1991 as an armoured vehicle driver. He was on the front
line during the conflict. Paul loved the Army, said it was his life and the best thing he
had ever done. That was up until the time he came back from the Gulf. Paul only
spoke briefly about the war and the things that happened over there. He told us that he
had received a concoction of drugs, including the anthrax injection and NAP tablets
that made him violently sick for days after.
When Paul came out of the Army his moods became very upsetting for the family.
He was very agitated and would often snap at the lightest of things, which was very
out of character. Paul started to become ill after around nine months of leaving the
Army. It started with slight rashes over his body, then he had convulsions. He was
admitted to hospital and later had a CAT scan to see what the problem was. The
doctor told our parents there was a problem in Pauls brain, which was best left alone.
Paul was admitted to Monsall Hospital for over six weeks with a rash all over his
body, and at one point he had lost 50 per cent of skin through an unknown allergy
according to the doctors. Paul suffered from many rashes in the following years and
started to fit a lot more often. He was put on medication for the fits, and steroids for
the unknown rashes, and as a result of the steroids Paul began to have problems with
his bones. He started to walk with a limp.
About 1993 Paul went to see a specialist at Hope Hospital to have a biopsy on his
head to find out what his problem was. He was told he had a brain tumour and was
given radiotherapy. The doctors told him he had probably had it for about two years.
The radiotherapy did not work so Paul then received chemotherapy. The doctor told
Paul there wasnt much more they could do for him and was given between 6-12
months to live. At this time, Paul had two young daughters to support, both of which
had had to have heart operations. Neither sets of parents had any history of heart
problems in their families, which the doctors found strange. Even while Paul was
suffering and worrying about his family, he was an avid campaigner for the Gulf
support group. He was very bitter with the Ministry of Defence for never recognising
Gulf War Syndrome and never received any support in his quest for the truth about his
illness. Paul Carr died in Augusts 1997; requiescat in pace, RIP.
We will tell Mrs Mates that her statement has been read on her behalf.
The next witness is Raymond Bristow, the Chief Executive of the Association.
63

MR RAYMOND BRISTOW, Called

475. THE CHAIRMAN: Mr Bristow, thank you very much for coming. We much look
forward to what you have to tell us. Can you start with giving your name and address for the
shorthand note?
A. Certainly. My name is Raymond Alan Bristow and I live at no.1
Linden Gate Avenue, Brockliffe Green, Kingston-upon-Hull, HU7 0EA.
476. THE CHAIRMAN: We have a very lengthy statement from you, for which we are
very grateful and which we will read in detail. Can you start by giving an overview of your
own position before you come to anything you want to say on behalf of the Association? Did
you serve in the Gulf yourself?
A. Yes. Before the Gulf War I was a proud member of
the Territorial Army. I joined that in 1975, when I was 17. I was a civilian principal
operating theatre technician. I was military warrant officer theatre technician and combat
medical technician, both Class 1.
I was exceedingly fit. Between 1985 and 1988. I served with B Squadron of the 23rd Special
Air Service Regiment. To keep my fitness for selection and continued service, I ran wearing
boots and combats, carrying 50lb bergen 3 to 4 times a week in my own time, over a distance
of 15 miles. That was from work to home at the end of the day. It took me about one hour
ten to twenty minutes; plus I also did a four-mile run each lunchtime, just wearing running kit.
On military exercises, this increased to 120lb plus belt kit of 35lb and a weapon of 11lb.
I believe this more than demonstrates my fitness and endurance levels before the Gulf War.
I also ran marathons for charities. The last marathon I ran was the London Marathon
immediately before the Gulf War. I had also been accepted following the Gulf War for one,
but I had to pull out due to the onset of my ill health.
I ran a successful business, earning well above the normal amount for a theatre technician,
and when I was deployed to the Gulf, my warrant officer pay was increased by 20 per cent to
compensate for loss of income.
Apart from my grandfather, who was a medic and he was gassed in World War I ill health
has not been present in my family until the ages of around 70, 80, 90. My father is a Korean
veteran, and he had 38 years with the Medical Corps. I served 20 years with the Medical
Corps.
The operational roles of the medical unit and of the Special Air Service meant that I had
received extensive training and had an excellent understanding of nuclear, chemical and
biological warfare defence. As a theatre technician, with my training in pharmacology and
physiology, I also understood how NAP tablets gave protection against certain nerve agents.
When the 2nd Brigade was deployed to the Gulf, I realised that there would be a requirement
for additional medics. I volunteered at the earliest opportunity, on 29 November 1990. I was
processed through the Tactical Mobilisation Centre at Keogh Barracks on 27 December 1990,
and I was designated to go to 32 Field Hospital, which was located near Hafaral Batin in the
Kingdom of Saudi Arabia. I was aged 32 years at that time.
Whilst at the depot for mobilisation, I was issued with various equipment to go to war.
I underwent a routine Army medical examination, and I was designated FE that was the
highest fitness level. I was then given routine vaccinations for Hepatitis A, Polio, Yellow
64

Fever, Tetanus, Meningococcal C. I declined the Hep B because I had just been given it as
routine for my civilian job.
To assemble the troops and give further training, I reported to the Royal Marine Commando
Centre at Seaton Barracks on 2 January 1991, as per orders. I was given a further Cholera
vaccine, and three other vaccines, which I was advised were biological and no other
description was given. It must be noted that none of the vaccines, routine or secret vaccines,
were recorded on my F Med 4 medical documentation, despite my documents being present at
the time, here in the UK.
A few days later, on or around 7 or 9 January 1991, we flew out to Dhahran in Saudi Arabia.
We stayed at the Blackadder Transit Camp until we could be moved to the location at 32 Field
Hospital in the desert. I was given another vaccine in each arm and issued anti-malarial
tablets and nerve agent pre-treatment tablets, or NAPs, which we were ordered to take on the
morning of 18 January, the air war having started on the night of 16/17th. I was taking them
as per instructions, one every eight hours. This had followed Scud attacks in the area, when
nearby NIADS (chemical alarms) had sounded following the attacks.
Whilst at Blackadder, there were constant chemical alarms moving us into full protection
NBC state Black. Also, whilst at Blackadder camp there was constant spraying of the tended
area with liquid around the doorways and window area and in the latrines and dining areas by
civilian employees with plastic canisters. The civilians were what I believe are called Saudi
guest workers. They did not wear any protection equipment other than a rag over their faces,
and nobody thought anything about it at the time. I/we did not know that the product being
used, Diazanon was harmful to man, and a sheep-dip type pesticide, which I believe is banned
in the UK.
A chemical attack without warning: I was on the second transportation of personnel from
Blackadder to our war location. We were en route to our war location from Al-Jubyal. We
consisted of a convoy of three ambulance coaches from the Ghurkha Transport Regiment.
We had no chemical alarms with us, only one map between three coaches and two weapons
per coach, each weapon only having five bullets. We stopped for ablutions and a meal at an
American forward supply depot. When we de-bussed, no-one was to be seen, and the
chemical alarm was sounding. An American soldier broke from cover wearing full individual
protection equipment. He ordered us out, stating that they were under chemical attack. We
all had to scramble back on to the coaches and put on our respirators and IPE. As a warrant
officer, I found it my duty to get my men and women back on the bus first, and when I was
satisfied they were all on, then I got on myself. For the next 24-36 hours, we all suffered flulike symptoms to varying degrees. I was the worst, and I was bedded down for 24 hours.
Bacterial or viral infections do not present like this; however, exposure to Sarin at
concentrations lower than lethal doses would present like this.
Two days later the three coaches ferrying personnel were very late arriving. They did not
have a map issued because of the shortage of maps at the time. They got lost and were
re-directed off the main supply route by an American military policeman, and ended up at he
Kuwait border, facing Iraqi machine guns. CNN came to the rescue and gave them a spare
map.
Moving on to COLPRO, the regular soldier operating theatre staff were unfamiliar with
COLPRO (collective protection) and it had been set up incorrectly. As a TA soldier, I had
65

trained with this equipment on a regular basis for three years. I was then put in charge of
COLPRO and I set it up as it should be. I was then ordered by Major Yogornathon, a regular
soldier, to turn it off. I was told that the filters would wear out and need replacing, and they
were expensive! I was only to turn it on when needed. I protested quoting Standard
Operational Procedures, but to no avail. It takes 20 to 30 minutes to inflate COLPRO; so to
turn it on in time you would need notice from the enemy before a chemical attack. This was
nothing more than ridiculous. So what COLPRO we had was in effect useless and could have
cost the lives of many casualties. This was against SOPs.
During the air war, whilst Iraqi artillery batteries were being attacked, we often had chemical
monitors sounding. In fact, we were briefed that the air strikes had released Sarin nerve gas
into the atmosphere. However, the next day the powers that be decided to change their
minds and said the alarms were due to the incineration of rubbish, and it was the fumes from
that. It was pointed out in the form of a question that there were incinerations every day, but
the alarms did not go off every day; but the Colonel refused to answer the question.
Incineration of rubbish continued on a daily basis, but the alarms only went off intermittently.
Because nobody dropped down dead, we were often given the all clear whilst the alarms
were still sounding. This, again, was against Standard Operational Procedures.
Towards the end of the land war, there was a loud explosion, an air burst, which left a cloud
nearly above the hospital. Once again, alarms sounded, and we went into state Black, and
then we were ordered all clear whilst the NIADS were still sounding.
477. THE CHAIRMAN: Did you discover what the loud explosion was?
A. I do not
know. I didnt hang around. I masked and suited up and got under cover as quickly as
possible.
Those who had specialised training nuclear, chemical and biological warfare knew that direct
attacks could be lethal but in the desert heat Sarin would dissipate quickly and would not be
lethal but disabling and harmful to health. The Tokyo underground terrorist attack in an
enclosed environment only produced six or seven deaths, but created several hundred
casualties. So in effect we were ordered to remove our protection and carry on working in an
unsafe environment.
During the demolitions at Al-Khamassiya, which released Sarin into the atmosphere, that
passed over the 32 British and 1st Canadian Field Hospitals between 4th and 10th March 1991
(recently confirmed by the American Governments General Accounting Office). Corporal
Martin Thomas can confirm that he had returned all our chemical monitors back to Al-Jubyal
before the demolitions; therefore, we would not have had any warning of this exposure.
478. THE CHAIRMAN: Where were you at the time of that explosion?
A. I was at
32 Field Hospital. Prisoners of war were infested with lice. We had our protective suits taken
from us early in March so that the prisoners of war could wear them. So even if we had an
alarm, we would not have had anything to wear to protect ourselves anyway. I have
photographic evidence of this. The MoD said that as a hospital we would have had COLPRO
available to us. Only the Resus and Theatre had this set up, but as I said earlier, it was not set
up correctly because of a direct order. It would be no use without an alarm. One would have
to get to it wearing IPE. We would have had to get 600 soldiers into an area of less than 24
square feet. I was the warrant officer responsible for COLPRO and I can confirm that this
was the first part of the hospital to be dismantled; this was done on 1 March 1991, before the
Al- Khamassiya incident.
66

Sergeant Tony Delahunty was in charge of the chemical Protection Unit. When an alarm
sounded, he had to go round the entire hospital to ensure everyone was aware and suited up.
When commanded, he was the first to remove his protection, and he had to go round the entire
hospital to give the supposed all clear. He would have been the most exposed individual at
32 Field Hospital, and it just so happens that he has died following the Gulf War.
More vaccines: During the set-up phase we were given more vaccines. Troops had not been
going for their vaccines at their designate times because we were a hospital there were night
shifts, day shifts, and some people were asleep. Part One Orders were produced to ensure
attendance. It stated that failure to attend could lead to court martial.
We then had to attend in the form of a drug/vaccine parade in the order of departments; the
parades were in one of the wards. We had anthrax and plague and some of the vaccines just
had nicknames. I was ill for over 24 hours. I could not even get out of my bed the next
morning. I experienced severe sweating, just like a fever, pains in my joints, headache,
nausea, and by this time I had started to become worse with frequency of micturition which
originally started when I started taking the NAP tablets, which I still suffer from this day.
479. THE CHAIRMAN: Your statement goes on a long way and we may not have time to
read it all. I have glanced forward and see you have something to say on the subject of
depleted uranium for example. Would you like to take the story up at that point?
A. Could I just say one thing about Botulinum first? I was given Botulinum; however, later
in 1997 at the MoD MAP, Lt. Col. Dr Bhatt said that this would not have been possible.
There was not enough uptake time to vaccinate for Botulism, so a serum was sent out for
treatment instead. I asked if I could have been given the treatment in error, a mistake at 32
Field Hospital. He replied: No, of course not; treatments were tablets, not injections. I
reminded him of my job, and I told him I know the difference between a serum injection and a
tablet. He then stated that I was more challenging than the usual infantryman that he saw at
the MoD MAP.
480. THE CHAIRMAN: I wonder whether challenging is the word he used or another
word!
A. I thought that was a rather bizarre remark to make in the circumstances. I
knew nothing of depleted uranium or its dangers to health until about four or five years after
the war, when I was horrified on seeing a television programme. I then researched the topic
thoroughly. I have become an international speaker on this topic.
481. THE CHAIRMAN: I am sorry to interrupt again. It is just that we have two other
witnesses that we want to come to. You say at the top of the page that you were the first
British soldier to be tested for depleted uranium.
A. Yes, by Professor Durakovic, and I
was found to be highly positive. I was tested again by him with a more refined technique at a
different university and laboratory; this confirmed the first. I then travelled to the United
States for a clinical examination by Dr Reid, an oncologist who specialised in radiation
victims, and the DU test was again repeated, this time in a clinical environment. A peerreviewed paper was then published. In laymans terms I was showing readings in 1998 of
being exposed to over 100 times of what is considered to be the safe limits.
482. THE CHAIRMAN: Do you have records relating to that which have been made
available?
A. Yes.

67

483. THE CHAIRMAN: To what would you, as a layman, attribute the depleted uranium
presence in your body?
A. I would believe that the uranium, when it burns at 3000
degrees Centigrade, forms insoluble ceramic particles that can pass through the alveoli of the
lung, and because it is ceramic Professor Durakovic explained that it is recognised as calcium
by the body and is usually laid down in the bones.
484. THE CHAIRMAN: Were you exposed to this more than others?
A. I was
exposed to Iraqi casualties that had been blown up with depleted uranium munitions.
A. There is another important thing. In 2002 I was tested by Professor Albrecht Schott for
chromosomal aberrations, basic biological damage caused by depleted uranium. I showed the
highest level of damage of all those tested. These tests led to a peer-reviewed paper being
published. In laymans terms again, I was showing readings in 2002 of three times the
biological damage than the firemen that attended the Chernobyl disaster, and they were tested
at the time of the disaster, not 11 years later.
Before the Gulf War, in 1990, produced with the American Department of Defense, I have a
document that states that under combat conditions the ground troops that re-enter a battlefield
following the exchange of armour-piercing munitions, either on foot or in motorised
transports, are most likely to be at risk. It also says, following combat, however, the
condition of the battlefield and long-term health risks to natives and combat veterans may
become issues in the acceptability of the continued use of depleted uranium kinetic
penetrators for military applications
485. THE CHAIRMAN: You refer further on to a German professor, Professor Gunter.
Do you have that page?
A. One of the speakers from Germany was Professor Gunter of
the European Green Cross. Over lunch one day he told me how he was breaking house arrest
at the time, what I suppose we would call bail in this country. He was arrested at a German
airport after returning from a previous fact-finding mission in Iraq. Later he was to be
prosecuted and fined by the German Government for bringing dangerous radioactive material
into the country. This dangerous radioactive material was one 38mm cannon shell. It was
confiscated for safe disposal. British and American service personnel had handled many of
these during the Gulf War. Professor Gunter had actually taken it from the hands of a little
four-year old girl who was playing with it in the gutter in southern Iraq.
486. THE CHAIRMAN: I am not hurrying you, but could you pick out the things of most
importance at this stage?
A. I attended this medical conference in Iraq. We were not at
war; it was in 1998. Whilst I was there, the police the Ministry of Defence arranged for a
police raid on my house and confiscated a computer and copied my hard drive. Even one
hour before I was due to land at Heathrow, upon my return, which was several days after the
police raid when they had already returned the computer having got all the information, they
refused to let my wife know if I was to be arrested or not. They said they had not made up
their minds. I was not arrested. I had not committed a crime. I have never even been
questioned by the police about this. They had stolen my evidence. They said they would tell
me what files they had copied and which they had not, and I am still waiting for that and
that is seven years later. It caused a great deal of stress to my wife and my daughters, who
were young and impressionable at the time and had been brought up to trust the police. They
then lost all confidence in them. David Batty, a journalist on the Big Issue wrote about this,
and he was arrested and questioned, which was more than what happened to me.
I did suffer character assassination although I was never even questioned by the police. I was
accused of stepping outside of the law by the Countess of Mar, and then the Defence
68

Secretary, George Robertson, accused me of being a traitor and a collaborator. We were not
at war, or if we were it was a secret, and it was only a medical conference. My daughters
have pen friends in Australia: are they traitors because of previous wars? Of course not! I
believe this was a demonstration from Big Brother intimidating people and also indicating
that there is something to hide.
Depleted uranium was categorised by a United Nations sub-committee as falling under the
category of a weapon of mass and/or discriminate destruction, causing unnecessary harm to
combatants of both sides, the civilian population and the environment. Therefore,
someone/some people are war criminals; but it is a sad fact that only losers of wars or lowranking personnel are charged with war crimes.
487. THE CHAIRMAN: You say on the next page that you were already feeling unwell
during the war. When did you come back from the Gulf?
A. As soon as the ground war
finished and I was stood down from all duties.
488. THE CHAIRMAN: We obviously have this before us, but can you tell us what your
health was after your return from the Gulf? You were already feeling unwell while you were
out there.
A. I had a conventional whiplash injury which I received. I could go through
my conditions, but I suffer from I do have memory problems. From the top of my head it is
very difficult. I work my way down. I suffer from from brain scans it has been identified
that I have got reduced perfusion to the cortex of the brain, more marked in various areas. I
have got those scan results. I have got loss of hearing, double vision, loss of peripheral
vision, excessive thirst, difficulty in breathing, concentration problems, high blood pressure,
pain in the muscles and joints that are described as fibromyalgia. Levels of pain are
controlled by a global analgesic, a depressant, plus I take morphine and other top-up drugs
too.
When I came back and I could not work, I did not want to be a sponger or anything, so I went
to my daughters primary school to help do one-to-one reading. After about two years I found
that it was difficult doing this one-to-one reading. Yes, I have read from this, but not word for
word, as you have probably noticed. It has been more prompt, and I have read through it
several times. But when I was reading with the children, I started to find it very, very
difficult, with this concentration.
489. THE CHAIRMAN: What year are we talking about now 1994/1995?
or 1996 time, yes.

A. Yes,

490. THE CHAIRMAN: were you in receipt of a pension at this stage?

A. I applied
for a war pension for my whiplash injury for my neck, and within a matter of weeks I was
awarded 20 per cent. I applied for Gulf War related illnesses, many conditions, and after a lot
of desk-thumping and complaining it took three and a half years to process that claim, and I
was sent to ----491. THE CHAIRMAN: Three and a half years before you got 20 per cent?
A. No,
three and a half years before they processed the claim to do with the Gulf War illnesses. I
was put through to a special section to, I believe, discriminate against us. Three and a half
years This is a demonstration now, interrupting my flow, of the memory problems,
jumping from one topic from another, and I think this is what you have found with a lot of
Gulf War veterans.
69

I have been diagnosed with PTSD. I worked in the operating theatres in the Gulf, and there
were legs blown off and shrapnel injuries and what-not, and I have seen plenty of road-traffic
injuries where there have been legs ripped off, and I have worked with children doing
resuscitation some successfully, some not successfully and I would think that is more
distressing than grown men who are serving in the Armed Forces.
Going back to the school, because I could not do the reading, I moved on to describing what
computers were because they did not have anybody who worked a computer at the school;
and that lasted a year. Then I had to stop going because I had to give up driving because of
poor concentration. Oh, and the other thing I suffer from is fits and black-outs and
involuntary movements.
492. THE CHAIRMAN: What is the present diagnosis, so far as you are concerned?
A. By my doctors? There was a case conference which involved all of my consultants at the
Hull Royal Infirmary within the Hull NHS Trust, and the diagnosis is Gulf War Syndrome. I
have been to see three specialists in the United States of America, and the diagnosis from each
individual was Gulf War Syndrome. One of the doctors, Dr Baunsweiger(?), is a consultant
neurologist, consultant neuro-physiologist, and a consultant psychiatrist, so if anybody knows
whether it is in your head, organic or otherwise, I think it would be him. He sees about 300
Gulf War veterans.
493. THE CHAIRMAN: This was in America, did you say?

A. In California.

494. THE CHAIRMAN: Was there a specific diagnosis of lymphoma or not?

A. I
was diagnosed with lymphoma. It was later downgraded to monoclonal gammopathy of
unknown significance, which is very interesting when you look at the website of the Imperial
Cancer Research Unit. What I did do, with the various test results being very technical, was
write for a simple mans explanation, and I asked Dr Chris Busby, who is on the
Governments Depleted Uranium Oversight Board. An extract of his reply is: You have
received a hefty dose of ionising radiation. Such doses are capable of causing serious
biological and clinical harm. This suggests that you have some material in you that is
continuing to cause this level of chromosome damage and has been causing this damage since
you were first exposed. In my view, this can only be insoluble depleted uranium particles
trapped in your body, following your exposure in the Gulf War 1991. This is supported by
the measurements made by the Uranium Medical Project and published on 15 March 2000,
which showed that there was measurable DU in your urine.
From the Imperial Cancer Research site, I quote: MGUS is a condition related to myeloma.
MGUS, like myeloma, is most common over the age of 70 years. Causes: The only wellestablished associations are with radiation Among atomic bomb survivors the relative risk
of developing myeloma increased with the radiation dose. I was about 42 at the time of my
diagnosis and I am still a little away from 70, although I feel 80!
495. THE CHAIRMAN: When did you start having to use a wheelchair?
A. First of
all, I was embarrassed having to use a walking stick, and I used it occasionally, then all the
time; then a walking frame gradually; and then I use a wheelchair when I am out for a long
time so I have support for my neck, in particular and if I am going great distances. I can
shuffle about the home usually adequately with either a stick or a walking frame, depending
on my stability at the time.

70

496. THE CHAIRMAN: Mr Bristow, can I thank you very much for what I think is one of
the fullest accounts we have had from one of the veterans. You have taken an immense
amount of trouble with this, and obviously we will read every word.
A. I must say that
yesterday, when I was printing it out I ran out of ink, so some of the supporting evidence is
not complete. I will ensure that it is forwarded to you. I thank you, my Lord, for listening to
my account. As Rudyard Kipling put it: If you want to know why we died, tell them our
fathers lied.
THE CHAIRMAN: It may be that Dr Jones will have some questions for you.
DR JONES: I do not think so, sir; it is all there.
497. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: You said that the depleted uranium in your body was
perhaps from contact with Iraqi casualties that you dealt with. Is that a confirmed diagnosis,
or is it from the depleted uranium on the battlefield? Treating casualties is that realistic?
A. When a casualty comes in, it is not like a road-traffic accident; it is a battlefield casualty;
he has been in an explosion. It is not bullets and shrapnel but dust and debris as well. The
sand in the desert is not like Blackpool beach; you get it in your fingers and you crumble it,
and it becomes as fine as talcum powder. The first thing you do when you get a casualty on to
the operating table and again there is a language problem; they may be incoherent as well
is you cut off their clothes top to bottom, examine the casualty front and back, head to toes, to
make sure there may be a wound on the front, but there could be a bigger one on the back.
That re-suspends the dust and debris into the atmosphere, which you inhale. Also, of course,
we did experience sandstorms coming in from the battlefield, and you can see you have all
got a photograph in the supporting documents of myself with Sergeant Delahunty, with a
sandstorm coming in. That was at the time of Al-Khamassiya, so it could contain Sarin nerve
gas and depleted uranium. Sadly, that is the gentleman who is dead. All of my friends that I
made in the Gulf are either ill or dead. My best friend, who I palled up with for BuddyBuddy, when you are checking each others gas mask, was one of the first to commit suicide
on his return.
THE CHAIRMAN: What was his name? (Pause) It escapes you for the moment. Never
mind. Mr Bristow, may I say again that we are very, very grateful for your help. I am sorry
to have asked you so abruptly for his name.
DR JONES: Perhaps you could include it with the remaining documents you are going to send
to our secretary.
498. THE CHAIRMAN: At any rate, he was one of a number of your friends who are no
longer here or still ill. Thank you so much.
A. Mick Charman.
The Witness withdrew
MRS JANET CALVERT, Called
499. THE CHAIRMAN:
Mrs Calvert, thank you very, very much for coming.
A. Thank you for asking me to attend.
500. THE CHAIRMAN: Can you first of all give your name and address to the shorthand
writer?
A. It is Janet Mary Calvert, 4 Cane End, Princes Risborough, Buckinghamshire,
HP27 9BM.
71

501. THE CHAIRMAN: Your husband was a meteorologist in the RAF.

A. That is
right. He worked for the Meteorological office over 37 years in civilian and military postings,
but in 1982 he joined the mobile meteorological unit known as the MMU, which went into
uniform as volunteer reserve officers, and served in deployed areas of conflict. He joined in
1982 around the time of the Falklands conflict.
He was deployed at the time of the Gulf War and went out to Bahrain in December 1990 and
returned in March 1991. From probably 1992 up until late 1994 he would have been saying
he had memory problems and did not remember things well enough. I have brought a
colleague of Trevors with me, Mr Kenneth Ingermals, who wishes to speak briefly because
he was working with him at the time at RAF Strike Command before and after, which I think
is quite crucial to being here today.
I just really wanted to say a few points just to make you understand why he felt it was that,
and why I am here to speak on his behalf. Even though from the word go he thought it was
the NAP tablets and possibly the innoculations they were given before the war and he was
deployed rather hurriedly because somebody was going out there and they could not go at the
last minute, so he went in their stead. But even though he felt it was that - he always used to
say it was that, he did not blame anybody. He did not think anybody deliberately tried to hurt
him. He would have always said that. He would say it now if he was able, but he is not.
In early 1995, because he was complaining so much about his memory, I said, do you want
to see our doctor?
502. THE CHAIRMAN: Did he tell you what sort of innoculations, if any, he had before
he went out?
A. I think he had the standard ones that they were all given.
503. THE CHAIRMAN: He also mentioned the NAP tablets.
A. Yes, he took them
every day during three or four months three and a half months probably.
504. THE CHAIRMAN: How was he immediately after he came back?
A. I only
married Trevor in 1993, so I was not living with him at the time, which is really why Mr
Ingermals has come.
505. THE CHAIRMAN: Carry on.
A. He became so concerned that he could not do
his job properly and things like that, so we went to our GP, who asked him a very simple
memory test that a GP would do. Immediately, he set up for him to see a consultant. Quite
frankly, by the end of 1995, he could not find his way anywhere.
506. THE CHAIRMAN: He is still with us.
A. He is still with us, but he has severe
dementia and he cannot do anything for himself any more. That has been a long, slow
process. He began having tingles through his body, and eventually in March 2000 he had his
first what turned out to be an epileptic seizure. When it first happened, it was in the night,
and I was woken. I did not really know what it was. I just thought he was going to die on me,
quite frankly. He has suffered further ones since.
507. THE CHAIRMAN: Is he in receipt of a pension?
pension from the Meteorological Office.

A. He gets his civil service

508. THE CHAIRMAN: Is that related in any way to the Gulf War?
A. No, no. He
took early retirement in 1996 but it was enforced early retirement; but he had done enough
72

years and they gave him his full pension, even though they would have given him a medical
pension if they had not been able to do that, because he could not work any more; it was
impossible he could not concentrate. He could not remember things. Generally, everything
else begins to go as well. His whole nervous system seems to have been affected in one way
and another. When he had these tingles, he would say it went right through him, and then he
would come out in a sweat and go grey, and be like this for quite some time. He was not
doing anything at the time; he would probably be seated. It was not as if he was engaged in
something stressful at the time; it just came, as it were, from nowhere.
509. THE CHAIRMAN: What about his medical records? Do you have records of the
onset of his dementia which would be of interest to us?
A. I have not got I do have
letters from consultants et cetera which I could forward to you, if you would like me to do
that.
510. THE CHAIRMAN: What I am not understanding is that was he a member of the
services, or a civil servant?
A. He was a civil servant, but he was a volunteer reserve
officer with an RAF ranking. They have the ranking of civil service status.
THE CHAIRMAN: It may be that your friend would like to tell us a bit more.
MR KENNETH ROY INGERMALS, Interposed
511. THE CHAIRMAN: Yes, would you give your name, please?
A. My name is
Kenneth Roy Ingermals, and I live at Westbrook, Upper Oddington, Moreton-in-Marsh, GL56
0XL I was a meteorologist in the most illogical office, and I first met Trevor Calvert in 1975,
when he was a meteorological assistant and I was a forecaster. Periodically, over subsequent
years, our various postings would coincide so that we would be together. Almost from the
beginning, he became a friend of the family, so that I would see him both socially and
professionally. I encouraged him over the years to improve his qualifications, which he was
able to do. He variously undertook a variety of jobs in the Met Office, both as meteorological
assistant, and he became a lecturer in the Met Office College. He was an administration
officer. He served overseas in various locations, all as a civilian, and all in the non-war
environment.
He progressively improved his qualifications by external studying. As a result of
recommendations, he became a forecaster. He progressively improved his education such that
in the late 1980s he completed an Open University degree so that he was a person who was
fully compus mentis. He was not an outstanding forecaster I can say that in front of his
wife but he was extremely diligent, and very responsible. He could successfully carry out
work.
At the time of the Gulf War, he had already served and joined the mobile Met unit, and had
been promoted to the rank of Squadron Leader in that unit. He served in various locations
overseas, always in the mobile Met unit. When he would wear a uniform, he would have a
military ranking, but he would immediately return back to his normal civilian occupation on
his return, and he served in places like Turkey, in Split ----512. THE CHAIRMAN: What about his service in the Gulf?
A. In 1990 he was
working with me at Strike Command. I was the Chief Defence Forecaster, and he was a
senior forecaster by that stage. At relatively short notice he was told that he would have to
replace a volunteer who could not go out and I do not know the reason for that. He almost
73

immediately well, he immediately agreed and in a period of 24 hours he completed what he

said was the whole gamut of vaccinations, including anthrax. As far as I know, they were not
recorded on his military documents. He had some in the afternoon and some the next
morning. He then went out to the Gulf War in December 1990, and he served at Bahrain for
the whole of that period. I can confirm that he always said that he took the NAP tablets, and
he did say that at one time they were subject to a gas alert, which turned out to be not true.
He spent the whole of his time at Bahrain.
On his return from the Gulf War, he returned to Strike Command, where I would be
occasionally we worked a shift system, and we would work together. My role was to be
responsible for the meteorological advice that was given ----513. THE CHAIRMAN: What was his state of health when you saw him again after his
return?
A. Good, no problems. But his role as a meteorologist at Strike Command was
that he would be preparing advisory forecasts which were based on a very tight schedule of
transmission. In other words, you had to be permanently on time. I noticed very, very
quickly, that he found it increasingly more difficult to complete the work in the allotted time.
It was my job to vet his work, or anybodys work in that area so I was not being special to
him; but I would notice; and because he was a friend I would notice that he was not getting
the work done on time, and when it was done, there would occasionally be some things which
showed lack of concentration.
514. THE CHAIRMAN: When did it start getting very serious?
A. It became quite
obvious to me. You must bear in mind that I knew him both as a friend and as a professional.
I was more aware of his failings than perhaps many others would be. It became quite obvious
fairly quickly, and I would have said it would have had to have been before 1992 because I
retired in the middle of 1992. It was for some months previous to that that I was aware that
increasingly I was having to prompt him to do various aspects of his work. I retired from the
Met Office, but I maintained a fairly close friendship with him, and he did operational tours in
Turkey, et cetera. Prior to this time he had always achieved the highest standard of report
from the commander of the detachment out there, but in 1995 he had gone to Turkey and by
that stage it was already painfully obvious to me that he was not the man he was. He came
back from Turkey with a very bad report, which demoralised him completely.
515. THE CHAIRMAN: We know the story from then on. Early onset of dementia was
diagnosed in 1995.
A. (MRS CALVERT) It was 1996 when we saw another
consultant and he had an MRI. The first MRI scan he had in 1995 showed very little obvious
damage to the brain. They said there was perhaps a slight irregularity, but nothing that they
could pin anything on. It was 1996 again before we saw another specialist at the Radcliff
Infirmary, Dr Hyman, a neurologist. After seeing a clinical psychologist, he then diagnosed
that it was possibly early Alzheimers; but he did not know; short of dissecting the brain, it is
not possible to tell. He does have severe dementia now, but it is how it was triggered. Trevor
always felt that when he was able to understand what was happening to him because it is a
cruel illness, and at first you know, and then you come to a point where you do not know any
more.
A. (MR INGERMALS) My son-in-law as the chair in neurophysiology at
Southampton University, and his speciality is the hippocampus. He is a prominent researcher
in epilepsy. In about 1996, at the time that he was going through these tests, he did forecast
that Trevor would have epileptic fits. He has been in hospital almost a year now, or he was in
hospital until very, very recently. A little while ago we made the decision between us that the
medical treatment that was being given to him, particularly the drugs being given to treat his
epilepsy and things like that, were not doing him any good, and Janet made the decision that
74

he should come off them. They eventually agreed they were reluctant but said they would
try and see what would happen if he came off them. From the time that he came off them,
when he was very close to death in fact Janet had been called out that she ought to go to
hospital, he was so close to death he has made a little improvement. He is no longer on that
medication, and this suggests to me that in fact he is extremely sensitive to the type of drugs
for treating any neuro illnesses. He is now a trifle better no more than that.
516. DR JONES: So he is now at home?

A. (MRS CALVERT) No, no.

517. DR JONES: He was hospitalised until very recently.

A. Yes, on 1 July we
moved him into a permanent place. Can I say one final thing? We did go to the Gulf War
veterans illnesses at St Thomass. They were very polite and very concerned about Trevors
state of health at the time this was in 1999 but when we walked in and we sat in the first
office with the sister in charge, she said, you do understand this has got nothing to do with
the Gulf War? That was her first statement; that was before he had seen the doctor. I was
probably nave, because I thought we were going there to see if there were any linkages,
anything that in Trevors case might be related to somebody elses; so in that, I was really
bitterly disappointed.
518. THE CHAIRMAN: You refer to that very point in your letter which we have of 18
June. They immediately said, forget about the Gulf War.
A. Yes. That was in 1999.
One of the consultants Trevor was seeing at the time arranged for us to go there. If there is
any information I can send to you in due course, then please let me know.
THE CHAIRMAN: Mrs Calvert, in the meantime thank you very much for coming, and
thank you Mr Ingermals.
The witnesses withdrew
MR ANDREW HAZARD, Called
519. THE CHAIRMAN: You were a member of the Royal Engineers. Could you give
your name and address to the shorthand writer?
A. My name is Andrew James Hazard
and I live at 43 Halifax Place, The Lace Market, Nottingham.
520. THE CHAIRMAN: You were with 50 Squadron. What were your duties?
A. I
was combat engineer first and foremost, and my secondary trade was plumber and pipe-fitter.
521. THE CHAIRMAN: Did you actually serve in the Gulf yourself?
A. No. I was
prepared for service in the Gulf. We started receiving vaccinations at the end of August, early
September, 1990.
522. THE CHAIRMAN: Can you remember what vaccinations you received?
A. We
were not told at the time. That continued every two or three weeks; we reported to the med
centre for more vaccinations, until October time, when I was attached to another squadron
within the regiment for a tour of Belize. My own unit was earmarked to go right from the
start to the Gulf, and indeed went out there for the clean-up operation at the end of February.
523. THE CHAIRMAN: So that took you to Belize. What happened after that?
A. Before I even went to Belize, after one round of vaccinations that we had, a couple of
75

days after, probably about a week after, I run a basic fitness test and I couldnt complete the
course. Previously, I used to run a mile and a half in round about eight and a half or nine
minutes, with no problems at all. On this one occasion I had a chest infection and was not
able to complete the run.
In October/November 1990 I was attached to the squadron for a tour of Belize. As soon as we
got out there we were told that we were on 72 hours notice to the Gulf. Whilst I was out
there, we were called to the med centre at airport camp in Belize. All the 50 Squadron
attached personnel who were there had to complete a course of vaccinations, which I suspect
was the anthrax/plague/pertussis.
524. THE CHAIRMAN: Were you told anything at the time you were given those
vaccinations?
A. Nothing. Nothing was recorded on our documents, which was a
concern at the time, especially when we received well, we were on 24-hours notice to move
shortly after Christmas.
525. THE CHAIRMAN: What about any possible claim you might have against the
Government if the innoculations proved ----A. The final round of shots we had were
round about Christmas 1990, again whilst in Belize, whilst my troop formed part of a
spearhead rapid reaction force. We were called to a camp in Belize where we received seven
or eight injections plus the polio. I asked what I was being given on that occasion purely
because I thought I was getting a double dose of things I had already had.
If I can backtrack slightly before we were given the shots, we were asked to read what I
believe was an amendment to the Official Secrets Act and told to sign our name on a nominal
roll just to say we had read it and received the vaccinations. As soon as we had had them, we
were told that should we have any illness in later life, then we would not be able to make a
claim on the basis of these vaccinations.
526. THE CHAIRMAN: I follow. I was wondering whether you recalled that. What then
happened after that further course of innoculations in Belize?
A. We were all very much
laid up for two or three days with flu-like symptoms, muscle cramps, sweats, fevers, et cetera.
It would have been shortly after then we were put on 24 hours notice to move. We were all
kitted out, ready to go and issued NAP tablets, extra respirator canisters.
527. THE CHAIRMAN: You were having NAP tablets during that period, were you?
A. Whilst we was on 24-hours notice. As soon as we were stood down, all this equipment
was taken back off us, including the NAP tablets. I do not remember taking NAP tablets
myself, but I remember being issued them and I remember seeing everybody around me
taking them, so I can only assume that I would have done as well. Because we were on so
many other medications, anti-malarials, et cetera, at the time
528. THE CHAIRMAN: You were stood down at the end of the war.
A. No, this was
before the end of the air war. We were stood down it would have been the first couple of
weeks in January.
529. THE CHAIRMAN: Because you were not needed?
deployed.

76

A. Because we were not

530. THE CHAIRMAN: What happened after that? You came back.
A. I completed
the tour of Belize and came back to the UK in May 1991. Even before I had left Belize, I had
noticed things that I had not noticed before. I was getting the shakes.
531. THE CHAIRMAN: Did you remain with the Royal Engineers?
completed my service in July 1991.

A. Yes, I did. I

532. THE CHAIRMAN: That was the natural end of your service. What have you been
doing since then?
A. Initially, I worked as a plumber, a pipe fitter.
533. THE CHAIRMAN: How long did that last?
A. I first started having problems
with being able to keep up with the work I was doing round about 1993. It got to the stage
where I was not able to make the job pay I was getting paid on priced work and I just was
not able to keep up. So I decided to get myself back to college, so I started a two-year HND
course, which I completed successfully. I passed, but it was on the second year, it would have
been 1994, that I started having problems.
534. THE CHAIRMAN:
A Higher National Diploma in what subject?
A. Construction management. I thought if I get myself off the tools into an office
environment, I may be able to cope a bit better.
535. THE CHAIRMAN: Did you ever get any work in construction management?
A. Yes, I worked although I have done that many jobs, it has been from 1995 to 1996/97 I
probably did somewhere in the region of five or six different jobs. I was just unable to hold a
job down.
536. THE CHAIRMAN: What was the difficulty in holding jobs down?
A. I was not
able to concentrate. My memory was getting worse. I was missing things. It got to the stage
where I would start a new job and I would be okay for a few weeks; and then I would be laid
up for a couple of weeks. It was just that cycle, until 1996, when I kind of hit rock bottom
and had what I can describe as a breakdown, physically and mentally.
537. THE CHAIRMAN: Did you see anybody?
A. Yes. It was round about the time
that I first got referred to a consultant psychiatrist, although my GP had been prescribing me
anti-depressants for some time previous to that.
538. THE CHAIRMAN: Do you have a job now?
voluntary work.

A. No. However, I do some

539. THE CHAIRMAN: Do you have a pension?

A. I receive a 30 per cent war
pension for fibromyalgia, irritable bowel syndrome, depressive disorder and ----540. THE CHAIRMAN: Did you have a problem getting that pension?
A. Initially,
I applied for Gulf-related conditions. The first payment I received off the War Pensions, the
first assessment, was 14 per cent for post-traumatic stress.
541. THE CHAIRMAN: When did you get that?

A. 1998.

542. THE CHAIRMAN: What are you on now?

A. I am on 30 per cent now. It took
a further four and a half years to get to 30 per cent, and two tribunals.
THE CHAIRMAN: Mr Hazard, you have explained your position very clearly to us.
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543. DR JONES: Is it the lack of concentration and the problems with the memory that
stop you working now, or is there something else?
A. The physical problems stop me
working in my trade. I have got back problems two fused vertebrae, discs that keep popping
out; I have got arthritis in my knees, which the War Pensions Agency diagnosed but refused
to award a percentage for. That prevents me working as a plumber. The last job I did was gas
fitting, fitting gas fires and boilers et cetera for British Gas. I just found that far too stressful,
especially with having memory problems. Obviously, if I forget to screw a valve in, the
potential is ..
544. DR JONES: You must obviously know what you are doing.
additional notes here, if I could leave those.

A. I have got some

THE CHAIRMAN: We will certainly look at those. If there is anything we need to ask you
about them, we will do so.
545. SIR MICHAEL DAVIES: Do you feel ill?
A. At the moment, like today, I am
not too bad. However, I am on four different medications at the moment. I have also just
been prescribed beta-blockers for the last couple of months, which I feel a little bit calmer and
a bit more able to cope since I have been on those.
THE CHAIRMAN: Having glanced at this, I think you have covered most of these points in
what you said, but if there is anything you have not covered, we will get in touch with you
again. In the meantime, thank you very much for that. Thank you all for coming to quite a
full day of evidence. We will be resuming on Wednesday at 10 am.
Adjourned until 10.00 am on Wednesday 21 July

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