INTERVIEWS by RICK HEIZMAN

in SOUTHERN BUTHIDAUNG TOWNSHIP

in September 2017, January, 2018, and October 2018

Aung Ga Phyu - Khami ethnicity

from Gu Dar Pyin Khami Village,
Buthidaung Township, Rakhine State, Myanmar
Interviewed in Kyauk Sar Taing Village, October 2018
(Kyauk Sar Taing 3)
I am Aung Ga Phyu, the Chief of Gu Dar Pyin Khami Village [It
is in the village tract of Gu Dar Pyin, but is far from the large
Bengali Muslim village of Gu Dar Pyin. The village is roughly
half Khami ethnicity and half Rakhine. Aung Ga Phyu is Khami]

This village was built in 1991. In 2002, some of our women

were raped by Bengalis. Also, in 2011 there was a problem
where the Bengalis were intimidating our women by showing
them their genitals.

During the last attack [Aug 25, 2017] we thought all of us would be killed by the Bengalis,
because we are a very small minority living around here. We have no escape, one side is
mountains, and other sides are many large Bengali villages.

For me it is also very difficult, concerning the administration of the villages. In the Bengali
mind there is a lot of crookedness. We Khami people are very simple and open. It is very
difficult to know what the Bengalis are thinking and plotting.

Question from Rick Heizman: If anyone from the village went to this mountain here to get
some firewood or something, how do they feel about their safety?

Answer: We always worry. And, we cannot attend to our chili peppers and potatoes because
they are too far away. On the mountains there is no security. So, we never know if some
Muslims are hiding in the jungle with their knives, waiting to ambush us.

Rick asks: How do they feel right now about safety?

Answer: When I see security forces around here I feel relaxed and safe, but without security
forces around we live in such fear.

Rick asks: Last year, August 25, did they wake up to the gunfire, hearing gunfire?

Answer: I heard shooting from over there, at the Gu Dar Pyin police outpost, in the early
morning.

Rick asks: Was this village invaded? Did they burn any houses?

Answer: No.

1
 U Maung Than Win
from Kyauk Sar Taing Village,
Buthidaung Township, Rakhine State, Myanmar
Interviewed in Kyauk Sar Taing, October 2018
(Kyauk Sar Taing 1)
I am U Maung Than Win, from Kyauk Sar Taing Village.

After the 2012 violence erupted many people came here from
Maungdaw Township - over the Mayu Mountains. Many of
those refugees were from Tha Ray Kone Baung Village, Khine
Gyi Village, Ah Kar Pyin Village, and other villages near them.
After all those refugees arrived here I made a list of people -
how many women, children, elderly, and men. I gave that list
to the township authorities.

Troops came from the 565 Army base and transported the refugees to Buthidaung town.
Some of the villagers from my own village, Kyauk Sar Taing, were also very frightened to stay
here, and they set out to get to Buthidaung town [an estimated 10 hour walk]. Between
Kyauk Sar Taing Village and Buthidaung there are many many large Bengali Muslim villages.

When they got near a Bengali village called Doe Tan many Bengalis came out and tried to kill
them all. A Mawlawi [Imam] came out and shouted to the Bengalis to stop trying to kill them
and to let them pass through [Note: the Mawlawi may have realized that eventually they
would be punished for killing so many innocent villagers.]

When the 565 base army troops came to evacuate the refugees I wanted to join them, but an
officer asked me to stay, because they didn’t not have enough boats at that time for
everybody. At that time, I was quite fearful, because half of our village had already fled, and
the refugees had been taken to Buthidaung. Among the villagers who were left here, for now,
many were crying in deep fear.

Before Gu Dar Pyin Village burned the Bengalis threatened everyone else, by loudly yelling
across the fields to non-Muslim villages. We all were so frightened that we all fled to the
mountains. We called the security forces and implored them to come and rescue us, and
they did.

Our village people are always worrying about safety - for themselves, their kids, their
relatives, their families, and their village. There is always a fear of what can happen, from the
Bengalis, at anytime. We don’t know when we have to flee from our village again, and next
time.

If the Bengalis burn our houses - well, those are houses - but, we are people, and we want to
survive.

In Maungdaw Township even some of our Rakhine people fishing were slaughtered by
Bengali Muslims around the time of the Aug 25, 2017 attacks. When we searched for the
dead fishermen we found a Bengali militant training camp in the jungle mountains. We found
Qurans, solar panels, batteries and tents there.

We could not bring the dead bodies all the way back to our village to bury them, we had to
bury them in Maungdaw.

2
Our village mainly lives on our agriculture in the mountains, but we lost many of our
vegetable plantations on the distant mountain slopes.

We always feel unsafe walking in the mountains now. That is why we can’t sustain our
vegetables gardens on the mountain slopes. We have so much uncertainty. We are
surrounded by so many Bengalis. We don’t know when we have to flee again, or where to
flee. We don’t know if we have a peaceful future.

Maung Than Kyaw - Khami ethnicity

from Nga Phyo Chaung Village
Buthidaung Township, Rakhine State, Myanmar
Interviewed in Kyauk Sar Taing Village, October 2018
(Kyauk Sar Taing 4)

I am Maung Than Kyaw, from Nga Phyo Chaung Village [a

small Khami village nearby].

During the 2012 violence we were very threatened. Our

village has only 20 houses, and we are surrounded by 3 large
Bengali Muslim villages. At nighttime they would shine the
torchlights into our village, and yell threats to kill us all. We
Khami people all fled for our lives.

Also, after the Aug 25, 2017 attacks we fled, again. Again, they threatened us and
intimidated us, and we had to flee in great fear.

Before the attack, the Muslims surrounded the Gu Dar Pyin police outpost, and then
attacked it. When the army arrived the Bengalis attacked the army with homemade bombs.

At that time all of the non-Muslim villages fled. Now we have come back, but it is not safe.

If we want to go out of the village to do something - go to our vegetable plantations or go to

buy something - we are afraid to go out. If we go out to the forest the Bengali Muslims kill
our minority people - that is why we are so afraid to go out of our villages. Even though we
want to go harvest our vegetables growing in our mountain plantations we cannot go - we
are too afraid to go there.

Also, if we want to buy something from Buthidaung town our women cannot go there, only
men can go, and even they have to go in a group, and they still cannot be totally safe.

There is no security in my village, but sometimes security forces will patrol around the area.

3
name unknown
from Ah Kar Pyin Village
Buthidaung Township, Rakhine State, Myanmar
Interviewed in Kyauk Sar Taing Village, October 2018
(Kyauk Sar Taing 5)

Since 2012 I have lived near here in Ah Kar Pyin Village. In the
2012 violence our village was surrounded by hostile Bengali
Muslims. When large attacks happened in Maungdaw starting
on June 8, 2012, many Rakhine Buddhists fled over the Mayu
Mountains to Ah Kar Pyin Village, and other villages. So many
of the refugees were very hungry, and we gave them food. Ah
Kar Pyin Village is very remote [in the eastern side of the Mayu Mountains].

The police from Kyauk Sar Taing Village sent a message to us that we were not safe in Ah
Kar Pyin Village and we must all come to Kyauk Sar Taing Village. We all were out of food,
and all of us - the villagers of Ah Kar Pyin Village and the many refugees who had arrived
from the other side of the mountains - started to walk for hours to Kyauk Sar Taing Village.

The police asked if we needed protection and we said yes, but they could only spare two
policemen to protect our group of hundreds of villagers and refugees. On the way, many
hostile Bengalis followed us and watched us. When we arrived here in Kyauk Sar Taing
Village the Bengalis went back into their villages. Soon the army came and took us all to
Buthidaung town, for better safety.

After the 2012 violence had finally subsided some of us came back to our remote Ah Kar
Pyin Village, but there were no security forces out there. Some of our people fled all the way
down to Yangon. But now those people have come back here to Kyauk Sar Taing Village.

Last year, in 2017, my children and I had to flee, again. We got news that many police
outposts and villages had been attacked, so we fled from here knowing that we would be
attacked any day. We got to Buthidaung town for safety. Later, I phoned people who were
back in the village and asked them if it was safe to return. They said that it seems okay. So
we decided to go back to Kyauk Sar Taing Village - this village.

First we would take a boat [to avoid the large Bengali villages along the one road] and then
walk to here. The boat was full of women and children and only 1 or 2 men. On the river
there were many Bengalis going around in their boats - we were very afraid, and there were
fires burning in villages along the way.

The boat stopped in Pyo Chaung Village - a Rakhine Buddhist village - but, it was eerily
empty, so we became scared, and then we were hiding behind a small Buddhist stupa, afraid
to walk through the empty village. Then soon, a motorcycle taxi from my village came to Pyo
Chaung Village - it was my son, thankfully, and we arrived back here.

4
We have a lot of difficulties in our lives, because of the Bengalis, because we mainly depend
on the mountain vegetable plantations.We continually feel unsafe here.

When I was younger we women could go alone to the market or the forest with no safety
concerns, but now we cannot do that, at all. Nowadays it is very dangerous to go through
the forest to the vegetable plantations. How do we get our food safely? How can we live?

Zaw Tun - Khami ethnicity

from Kyauk Sar Taing Village,
Buthidaung Township, Rakhine State, Myanmar
Interviewed in Kyauk Sar Taing Village, October 2018
(Kyauk Sar Taing 6)

I am Zaw Tun - Khami ethnicity. I came to this village - Kyauk

Sar Taing - in 1991, and have been living here since then.

I would like to tell you about how people here live. Nearly all of
us nationalities [Rakhine, Khami, Thet, Mro, Daignet] depend on
the mountains for our livelihood. At the moment we cannot do anything - growing vegetables
on our mountain plots, collecting snails and other things to sell. It is not safe anymore for us
to go into the mountains.

If I want to go to another village [Rakhine or ethnic minority] I have to pass though many
large Muslim villages. There is no security force to protect us. If I want to buy something or
visit one of those friendly villages I have to check the situation first. I have to check if there is
any bad 'news' about it, and I have to leave very very early in the morning.

Before the attacks in 2012, some of our ethnic minority women were attacked, raped, and
killed here. In the village we have security, but when we go out of the village, to the
mountains, or the market, or other villages there is no security - it is dangerous.

When we go to the forest, to work in our vegetable plantations we don't know where the
Bengali terrorists are hiding, and when they are going to come out and kill one of us.

Even near my village some Bengalis might be farming in the rice field, but we have to check,
from a long distance, if they have guns or swords or other weapons. If they don't appear to
have weapons we can pass through, but still, fearfully.

Also, I want to tell you that in the village now, if there is no security, it is very difficult for us.

5
Zaw Kaw Ri Ya - Muslim
from Gu Dar Pyin Village,
Buthidaung Township, Rakhine State, Myanmar
Interviewed in Gu Dar Pyin, October 2018
(Gu Dar Pyin Muslim 1)

[This interview is more like a conversation between U Ba Aye,

leader of my group, and Zaw Kaw Ri Ya, the Gu Dar Pyin Village
headman]

Ba Aye - How is everything? Your agriculture, and other business?

Zaw Kaw Ri Ya - Things are okay. The International Red Cross is supplying us with food and
essential supplies. Concerning our agriculture, it is a bit difficult now because their is a
shortage of people to do the work (he says, later, that about 50% of the Muslim population
from this area fled to Bangladesh) and if your family members are not enough then you have
to hire some workers - which is difficult now because so many had fled. Around here is the
Gu Dar Pyin Village Tract which contains 5 villages, some of them are ethnic minority people
villages. We are now in Gu Dar Pyin Village.

[Note: I, Rick Heizman interviewed 6 people in a Gu Dar Pyin Tract village called Kyauk Sar
Taing Village, which is half Khami ethnicity and half Rakhine]

Ba Aye - Were you here on August 25, 2017?

Zaw Kaw Ri Ya - Yes I was here. On August 28, 2017 some houses in Gu Dar Pyin were
burned, and on August 29 I fled across the river to another village.

Ba Aye - Over 700,000 Bengalis fled to Bangladesh. Did anyone from Gu Dar Pyin flee to
Bangladesh?

Zaw Kaw Ri Ya - Over 50% of the village is in Bangladesh.

Ba Aye - Would they like to come back to here?

Zaw Kaw Ri Ya - I don't know.

Ba Aye - I have heard that many of the Bengali refugees would like to come back to
Myanmar. [Joke] Even if they cut off their legs and leave them in Bangladesh their body
would like to return to Myanmar.

Zaw Kaw Ri Ya - If they are okay they will come back.

Ba Aye - Why did half of your villagers flee to Bangladesh?

Zaw Kaw Ri Ya - They fled because their houses were burned. Some of them would like to
return but they have no permission to rebuild their homes in the same location.

[They fled because they were the militants and their families who attempted a genocidal
slaughter]

Ba Aye - Is it true that Burmese soldiers raped the Bengali women, and killed many people?

6
Zaw Kaw Ri Ya - I only heard of this happening someplace, maybe or maybe not - but it did
not happen here in Gu Dan Pyin Village. But in Gu Dar Pyin about 15 people were killed. The
day of the attack is when they were killed.

[Those 15 who were killed were part of the Muslim attackers who were attempting a
genocidal slaughter]

Ba Aye - Some Bengalis refugees in Bangladesh say that they will be killed if they come back
here, and that it is too dangerous to come back. So, why are you living here? Is it dangerous
for you? Can you live peacefully here?

Zaw Kaw Ri Ya - Yes, we can.

Ba Aye - If you can speak to those refugees and your relatives in Bangladesh now, perhaps
you can tell them that you are living here peacefully, no problem, and they can return with no
problem. Yesterday we went to large Muslim village of Maung Nu, near Taung Bazar, and
there were many big houses that are empty in the village. So, why they don't want to come
back? They can live there, no problem. And now, you can go to Buthidaung, no problem, and
your children, in the whole village, can go to school now. You can send this message to the
Bengali refugees in Bangladesh - you can live here now, no problem, in your village, and your
children can go to the government school easily and peacefully, no problem, they can learn
very well, and you can go to Buthidaung no problem. And, as you know, the women are not
raped, and there is no genocide by the army.

Zaw Kaw Ri Ya - Yes.

Ba Aye - Your name please?

Zaw Kaw Ri Ya - Zaw Kaw Ri Ya

7
Ma Mauk Too - Muslim
from Gu Dar Pyin Village,
Buthidaung Township, Rakhine State, Myanmar
Interviewed in Gu Dar Pyin, October 2018
(Gu Dar Pyin Muslim 2)
Ba Aye - What is your name?

Ma Mauk Too - Ma Mauk Too.

Ba Aye - Please tell us the truth. Tell us what happened. Don't be

afraid of the government, no worries. We are not the government,
or the police, we are just seeking the truth.

Ma Mauk Too - I was not here during the attacks on August 25,
2017. Gu Dar Pyin Village is my home village, but I fled to Paung Daw Lei Village(?) just
before the attacks. I knew the attack would happen, that's why I fled.

[He is assuming we don't know much about what happened, and he is not acknowledging
the Bengali Muslim surprise onslaught on the police outpost in which the Bengali Muslims
intended to kill all the police and loot all the weaponry and ammo.]

[Instead, as the police shot back in the darkness to defend themselves at least 19 attackers
were fatally shot. So, when he says he knew the attack was going to happen, he can only be
referring to the initial attack by the Muslims of Gu Dar Pyin, because the response to that
attack only happened because of the initial attack.]

[Furthermore, why would he flee before the attack, and then come back after the attack? It
makes no sense, and I strongly suspect him of being one of the attackers and killers.]

Ba Aye - Did you know what happened in your village after the attacks?

Ma Mauk Too - I was not here during the attacks on August 25, 2017.

Ba Aye - (again) Did you know what happened in your village after the attacks?

Ma Mauk Too - I don't know.

Ba Aye - Many Bengalis fled to Bangladesh, perhaps some of your relatives, would you like
them to come back here?

Ma Mauk Too - Yes, I would like them to come back.

Ba Aye - I am not part of the government, I'm just a normal person, and I have heard the
media reports. Even on the beach of Alay Than Kyaw, where fleeing Bengalis waited for
boats to Bangladesh, the government tried to convince Bengalis that they didn't have to flee,
they could stay and live in peace. The government even gave them food and necessities.

Ba Aye - Why did they flee to Bangladesh?

Ma Mauk Too - I don't know, I see and I heard that they fled to Bangladesh, but I don't know
why.

Ba Aye - Did they tell you why they fled to Bangladesh?

Ma Mauk Too - No, they didn't tell me anything.

8
Than Than Gyi
from Ban Du La Village,

Buthidaung Township, Rakhine State, Myanmar

Interviewed in refugee camp, Buthidaung, Sept 2017
(Ban Du La 1)

During the Bengali attack on our village [August, 2017], we

were so afraid, and we all fled from our village to the forest. We
stayed in the forest for 3 days.

My sister was very pregnant, almost gave birth there. Also one
more woman was very pregnant and also close to giving birth.
We had some rice to eat, but it was very terrible to stay in the jungle.

Then the military arrived. Our village chief made a list of all the villagers, and gave it to the
military. The officer said we cannot take all of you now, so first we will take the two very
pregnant women.

So, my sister and the other lady were taken to Buthidaung town and stayed in the hospital
for 10 days, where one gave birth. Then they joined the rest of us at the Shwe Tha monastery
refugee camp in Buthidaung.

After 2 days my sister went back to the hospital and had her baby. Fortunately nobody from
our village was killed, because we all escaped into the forest, and then the military arrived,
just in time. We were lucky.

————————————————————————————————

INTERVIEW CATEGORIES

• Southern Maungdaw Township

• Northern Maungdaw Township

• Maungdaw Town and Area

• Southern Buthidaung Township

• Northern Buthidaung Township

• Rathedaung Township

• Hindu victims

• Ethnic Minority victims: Mro, Thet, Diagnet, Khami

• Others: Yangon, Sittwe, Mrauk-U

9
A DATABASE IS COMING: Enabling you to find all interviews with these types of parameters:

• Rescued / saved by Army

• Used to get along / employ / work with Bengali Muslims

• Bengalis would not buy, sell, or interact in any way with non-Muslims

• ARSA or RSO terrorist group info

• Terrorist training camps found

• Eyewitnesses to Bengali Muslims burning their own homes and villages

• Interviews by: Hindus, Muslims, Khami, Thet, Diagnet, Mro

• Talk about 1942 Massacre times, or 1950s Mujahid campaign

ALL INTERVIEWS ARE ON VIDEO AT:

https://arakan-reality.smugmug.com/ARAKAN-the-CONFLICT-VIDEOS/Interviews-October-2018/

and:

https://arakan-reality.smugmug.com/ARAKAN-the-CONFLICT-VIDEOS/INTERVIEWS/

and on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXpfh5XdTXbt6mNgNzGjZ7A

Produced by Rick Heizman June 18, 2019 Facebook: Arakan Eagle 7

Photos and Videos of Arakan at: arakan-reality.smugmug.com - go to Conflict videos

Photos and Videos of all of Myanmar at: rickheizman.smugmug.com

Papers at scribd.com/rheizman

Email: rickmusic4@gmail.com burmafriend88@gmail.com

The BEST and most ACCURATE FILM about the CONFLICT in RAKHINE STATE, MYANMAR:
ARAKAN - ANCIENT BUDDHIST KINGDOM, ENDANGERED BY JIHAD - in 4 parts:

https://arakan-reality.smugmug.com/ARAKAN-the-CONFLICT-VIDEOS/MY-EXCELLENT-MOVIE/

10