The Macedonian Digest

From the readers for the readers

Edition 71 November 2011
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Editors Notes
Our Name is Macedonia www.mhrmi.org/our_name_is_macedonia

Feature Stories
Economy Expert: Macedonia Very Lucky Not to be in Eurozone
Monday, 10 October 2011 http://macedoniaonline.eu/content/view/19329/45/ Macedonia should be grateful and count its blessings for not being part of the eurozone and able to keep the competitiveness of its economy, says Martin O. Hutchinson, former advisor of the Macedonian Government, in an interview with Voice of America. Hutchinson believes that the Greek debt crisis does not mean too much to Europe . "This is a correction of the mistakes made in 1981 and 2002, clearing up of the disturbance created through over-subsidizing of Greece , allowing its living standard to be fully uncompetitive. The problem now is that stock markets have expanded the mistrust over the payment capability of other European countries. This could have been resolved by bringing back the drachma, but is now a threat to the entire European Union", says Hutchinson . According to him, the Greek debt and eurozone crises could have an effect on Macedonia . "In the short-term, export to Greece will be heavily hit, whereas investments there will reduce. The problem in the long-term will be that EU enlargement will slow down, while the accession criteria will become stricter", stresses Hutchinson . Asked what steps should the Macedonian Government undertake in order to minimize the negative effect on the economy he says efforts should be invested in creating a budget surplus. "I have not analyzed Macedonia 's economy for several years, but the most important thing is to

preserve the international funding of Macedonia 's needs, especially in the private sector. The government must do everything in creating a budget surplus, since a sharp increase of expenditures is quite realistic", adds Hutchinson . He believes Macedonia should efficiently integrate its economy with the EU as a whole, which would result in Union membership. "On the short run, all business contacts with EU member-states, excluding Greece , will enhance development and help the upping of Macedonia 's living standards at EU levels", underlines Hutchinson . An investment banker with more than 25 years experience, Hutchinson has worked on both Wall Street and Fleet Street and is a leading expert on the international financial markets. In February 2000, as part of the Financial Services Volunteer Corps, Hutchinson became an advisor to the Macedonian Government.

Denar Stable, Macedonia Watching Closely Economic Situation in Greece

Monday, 10 October 2011 http://macedoniaonline.eu/content/view/19324/45/ Macedonian denar is stable and the serious situation in Greece will not affect its exchange rate. The denar stability depends on healthy policies of Macedonian authorities, finance minister Zoran Stavreski says. According to him, two scenarios are possible for Greece . It can either proclaim itself unable to settle its own debts and cause panicking on the capital market or it can declare a controlled bankruptcy. Both situations are not good. All missions and reports of international financial institutions evaluate Macedonia as a country with the healthiest economic policies in the region. As long as the overall economic solvency is under control through maintenance of a low budget deficit level and maintenance of predicted money supply, the stability of the banking sector is guaranteed, Stavreski says.

FYR Macedonia's chewing gum wins the U.S. market

http://www.balkans.com/open-news.php?uniquenumber=121342 Drazen Remikovic - 29.09.2011

Food company "Makpromet Stip" from FYR Macedonia increase its exports of chewing gum in the United States from the current 50 tons per year to 50 tons per month. This company known for producing brand "Cunga Lunga" began his strategy for conquest of other continents. Drastic increase in exports to the U.S. for us is a great step forward, F.Y.R.O.M. media reports, adding that this is market of over 300 million consumers. This means that the possibilities are more than great. This resulted in exports since last year invested large funds in new equipment, modernization of production, using high quality of raw materials. This new quality of old famous flavored chewing gum "Cunga Lunga" was a major factor for the commencement of exports by providing placement in major trade chains. The increase in exports shows that the reactions of consumers are more positive, and its a real sign that we are on track, "Dance Gurova, chief manager of the company stated. So far the emphasis was placed on exports to the European market, the countries of former Yugoslavia and in Israel . With the increase of exports to the U.S. , it will provide strengthening and better positioning of the factory and its, now world known, chewing gum, "Cunga Lunga". Source: Kapital.mk

Erdogan: Macedonia has natural right to use name, Greek stance unreasonable and unjust
http://macedoniaonline.eu/content/view/19247/2/ Skopje , 29 September 2011 (MIA) - Macedonia has a natural right to use its constitutional name under which it became an independent state. We see the Greek position as unreasonable and unjust. We cannot comprehend any additions such as upper, lower or northern. We live in a global world where peace and understanding should prevail, said Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan at Thursday's joint press conference with Macedonian counterpart Nikola Gruevski. Erdogan urged for Macedonia 's deserved place in NATO and EU, saying that Turkey would continue to support the country in the European and Euro-Atlantic integration process. Pertaining to Macedonia's efforts for EU membership, the Turkish PM stressed that the country makes swift progress, promotes stability and prosperity, implements its commitments, and that is why it will become part of the EU sooner than Turkey. The two PMs stressed Macedonia and Turkey do not have any open political issues, close bilateral cooperation will be enhanced, whereas commercial-economic cooperation and exchange will intensify.

PM Gruevski emphasized the excellent bilateral relations, which is best confirmed through the Agreement on Strategic Partnership. He thanked Turkey for its strong support to Macedonia 's NATO accession, as well as the respect of the identity and the constitutional name. Erdogan said both countries have mutual history and culture, recognized through friendship among people. Gruevski and Erdogan agreed that economic cooperation and commercial exchange, which amounts to approximately US$ 400 million in 2011, could intensify. Turkish PM Erdogan, who pays a two-day official visit to Macedonia , is set to meet later today with President Gjorge Ivanov and Parliament Speaker Trajko Veljanoski, as well as DUI leader Ali Ahmeti. In addition, the PMs' wives Borkica Gruevska and Emine Erdogan will visit children's embassy "Megjasi" in Skopje .

We know who we are, Gruevski tells UN General Assembly

New York , 25 September 2011 (MIA) - We know who we are and how we will live. We are Macedonians speaking Macedonian and our country is called the Republic of Macedonia, stressed PM Nikola Gruevski in his speech delivered yesterday before the 66th United Nations General Assembly, MIA reported. The Premier underscored that "we do not want to be in a position our name and identity to be disputed by a country and we haven't requested that beyond question." However, according to him, reality is oftentimes cold, hard and brutal. It is a fact that our southern neighbour protests not only our name, but our identity as well. And its objections have become our problem and a row was triggered that is one of a kind in the world - a row imposed due to the need of a country, our neighbour, to have a monopoly on two names, or on other hand, their strategic goal to prevent us from being what we feel. "Imagine the virtual situation in which my fellow citizens are, blackmailed, with obstructed development and perspective owing to blockades by our neighbour on country's Euro-Atlantic bid only because of what we are i.e. because of what we feel we are. I ask you only for a moment to try to be in our position, try to think how would you feel if someone asked you not to be German, British, American, Russian, Chinese, Nigerian, Argentinean, etc. That is the only thing I want from you, I ask you to do. Seeking support for the row to be closed, for support to be what we are without hurting anyone, without harming anyone, with understanding, tolerance and respect towards our neighbours, friends, towards all of you, with respect towards our neighbour which is involved in the dispute and understanding for its stances, we have no pretensions or intentions to have a monopoly on the name Macedonia," PM Gruevski said.

He noted that fortunately 131 countries from all across the globe had chosen to recognise us under the name we are calling ourselves - the Republic of Macedonia - and extended gratitude for that, a gratitude for their principles and consistency with respect to values protecting the rights and principles established by the UN itself. "Unfortunately, the rules in the world are such that we cannot be called the way we are calling ourselves right here, in this organisation - the United Nations - nor the country is able to join those organisations for which we have work hard to become members of, NATO and EU. We have deserved the right to join these organisations. Truth be told, this is wrong. There is no other word to describe this. What you are going to decide to do with this - your behaviour - it totally up to you," Gruevski stated. The PM said there were a myriad of words with which he could describe his homeland and each and everyone would fit perfectly. "For a start, I pick one and I deeply believe that this word describes the essence of my country and my people and explains all of the moves and strength gathered to overcome the challenges occurring in recent times. This word explains well the whole patience we have had towards each blockade imposed that we have and are enduring, from economic to institutional, solely owing to our own identity and self-recognition. These blockades have not impeded us for our actions, but simply for what we are and for existing. The word is: accountability," Gruevski emphasised. Stressing that Macedonia acted in a responsible fashion, the Premier recalled that our state had been established in the course of not so gentle history: "It rests on great sacrifices, many lives lost and interrupted dreams." "But the past is not the only reasons making us to act responsibly, we, Macedonians believe that we have a future in Europe and that we can leave a legacy to future generations. Consequently, today in Macedonia we are making efforts to establish a wide front of support and to unite all of the forces and potentials involving the courageous idea to become a regional leader. A leader in economic reforms, education, investments, technologies and innovations, environment protection, human right and freedom protection in any segment of modern living. Knowing the high awareness and accountability of my fellow citizens and taking into consideration the position of my country amid the global crisis, when it retained its economic strength and sat through it without major turbulences, I am more than sure that the effort of uniting will be successful," Gruevski said. The Macedonian PM in his speech said that an important characteristic existing for thousands of years must be mentioned when speaking about Macedonia : "Being a legacy from old times, it is a guardian of cosmopolitism, an idea allowing functional multi-culturalism. Side by side, through centuries, various cultures, religions and nations exist in my country. We are attempting to incorporate them without assimilating into the dominant culture. We are proud of the diversities and we consider them our treasure." "We as any other nation in the world, have the right to identity and to unity over our own national myth. In our myth there is room for Macedonians, Albanians, Turkish, Roma, Serbians, Vlachs, Bosniaks and others, for all those who embrace the values glorifying non-violence,

justice, coexistence and cultural competition. Chauvinism has never been a dominant feature for our people. The 1993 constitutional amendments and change of flag had demonstrated our good will. However, our accountability and maturity should not be seen as weakness or to be subjected to continuous abuse by anyone, because we must not forget our dignity and pride," Gruevski said amongst other things.

Macedonia marks 70th anniversary of People's Uprising and National Liberation Struggle
Skopje , 11 October 2011 (MIA) - The Republic of Macedonia marks Tuesday the 70 anniversary from the beginning of Anti-Fascist Uprising and the National Liberation Struggle. The Macedonian people responded to the fascist occupation by organizing an insurrection. At that time, the first sabotage units were created in Kumanovo and Prilep, with their operations starting on October 11, marking the beginning of the Macedonian people's uprising. In the course of 1942, the partisan movement was also in ascent. Nine detachments were founded acting on a large territory. During the winter and the spring of 1944, the Macedonian Army took important military operations (the February March, the Spring Offensive), causing enormous damages to the Bulgarian occupier. The network of government bodies in Macedonia was spread during 1944, over 800 in number. The preparations for convocation of Anti-Fascist Assembly of Macedonia's National Liberation (ASNOM) were taken by the General Staff and the Initiative Board. Thus, by the end of the war, the Macedonian National Liberation Army numbered over 56,000 soldiers, with approximately 25,000 victims in this part of Macedonia . The liberation of Macedonia by its own forces was an outstanding military and political accomplishment of the Macedonian people, and at the same time was a significant contribution by a small people to the anti-fascist struggle in the Balkans and Europe . In the past 20 years, along with the overcoming of the 2001 conflict and the Framework Agreement that emerged from it, Macedonia , which is full-fledged member of the United Nations, now walks on the road to Euro-Atlantic integration. On occasion of the holiday, October 11 Award for outstanding achievements in the fields of science, art, economy and other areas of public interest will be presented at the Macedonian Parliament. This year's award recipients in the field of culture are ballet artist Tanja VujisicTodorovska, writer Resul Sabani and actor Petar Temlkovski, along with advisor-librarian Mile Boseski in the field of protecting the values of cultural-historic heritage, and businessmen Tihomir Cepreganov in the economic sector.

Governmental and parliamentary delegations will lay flowers at monuments of national heroes in Skopje , Prilep and Kumanovo. A formal academy was held in the Skopje-based Army Hall on Monday evening, addressed by President Gjorge Ivanov. Moreover, reconstructed building of memorial museum " 11 October 1941 " opened in Prilep.

Not another BIG Greek Lie?

DiManno: Greeks are masters of the tax dodge
By Rosie DiManno, Columnist, ATHENS http://www.thestar.com:80/news/world/article/1067546--dimanno-greeks-are-masters-of-the-taxdodge In a country where stiffing the taxman is a national pastime, nailing scofflaws requires ingenuity and stealth. So helicopters were deployed earlier this year to count backyard swimming pools in the Greek capitals affluent northern suburbs. The flyover, in conjunction with satellite imagery, produced a shocking aqua-census: 16,974 pools tucked behind high property walls. Yet only 324 households in those areas had ticked the box on their income tax forms admitting to pool ownership. This was but one example of how upper middle-class Greek citizens hide their assets from the state to avoid levies. It had to be done to see how many Greeks had swimming pools, explains Nikos Lekkas, taxdodge investigator-in-chief as head of planning and programming controls for the internal revenue service. Such brazen withholding of whats due The Man goes a long way toward explaining why Greece is in such a fiscal mess. A nation that has fetishized tax-evasion, where residents proudly compare schemes for skirting the system, is on the verge of bankruptcy. Finance Minister Evangelos Venizelos has warned there will be no cash left in the government kitty to pay public salaries and pensions come November if its sugar-daddies the European Union and International Monetary Fund dont pony up the next instalment of promised bailout aid. Bankruptcy will lead to default on government loans held by foreign banks. That would trigger a disastrous domino effect in the Eurozone, with the debt crisis cascading across the continent, already threatening to engulf Italy and Spain .

In truth, theres tons of money in Greece , below the radar. But the state is up against a cunning adversary in its own people, whove become notoriously adept at frustrating all attempts to recover revenue. Both individuals and companies have learned to stash it good, whether in offshore accounts, domestic hidey-holes or by simple nondisclosure of assets. For decades, this phenomenon went unchallenged. Indeed, tax collectors were often in on the scam, accepting bribes to turn a blind eye. It is with almost grudging admiration that Lekkas recounts the recent discovery of a rural tax Shangri-La, a tiny town called Kranidi in the Peloponnese with only a handful of tax inspectors in situ. Lekkas, to his astonishment, learned that a multitude of businesses including some of Greece s largest companies had set up corporate headquarters in Kranidi, even if no actual office existed. By such means, their finances went undetected because nobody looked. It was operating like a small Lichtenstein. Various studies, most notably one by the Federation of Greek Industries in 2010, have estimated that one-third of taxes go unpaid. The government may be losing up to $30 billion a year to tax evasion, in a country with a colossal $400 billion debt, passing the hat around to its European allies. The pressure to collect money owed is great, admits Lekkas. But the party is over. This couldnt be allowed to continue any longer. Political decisions have been made to end all these practices. A new and detested property tax is being collected through electricity bills to thwart evasion. (Unionists have vowed not to deliver the bills.) A freeze on bank foreclosures against more than 55,000 delinquent borrowers who owe mortgage loans of up to $200,000 is about to expire after being twice extended. And lists have been compiled, released publicly, of chronic tax-ducking cheats in an unprecedented shaming campaign. Upwards of 6,000 businesses were identified as owing $41 billion in taxes and penalties, though critics pointed out that many of the companies had long ago gone bankrupt and disappeared. (Added embarrassment: Top debtor was the stateowned railroad, owing $1.3 billion.) While these lists currently cover only companies, they will be extended to ordinary citizens once the government finds a legal way to circumvent privacy laws. In any event, individual names have already been leaked through the media. Prominent were doctors, lawyers, notaries, engineers and architects. We believe this shaming campaign is effective, says Lekkas. Greek society has changed. People are embarrassed to be identified, with everyone knowing where their tax evasion has led the country. Authorities recently scrutinized the tax returns of 150 doctors with offices in the upscale Athens neighbourhood of Kolonaki. Half had reported an income of less than $40,000 and 34 doctors claimed less than $13,300 which put them below the exemption line for paying any tax at all.

That infuriated a working class which has been hammered with a slew of new taxes, salary reductions and job furloughs. In a country characterized by rampant bribery and corruption, there is roiling resentment over minuscule taxes paid by the well-heeled, most acutely symbolized by Greece s shipping magnates. Lekkas insists the tax department is going after them. We are catching people who have been part of the political establishment, even those who are close to the political leadership. But this nation of 11 million has long operated within a parallel shadow economy of undocumented cash transaction one-on-one exchanges without benefit of receipts, to keep business off the books. Its estimated the shadow economy accounts for up to 30 per cent of gross domestic product, untaxed. The Greeks have a name for paying on the side: fakelaki literally, little envelope. Theres an attack plan for that, too, says Lekkas. The government will attempt to revamp entrenched culture by forcing receipts to be issued for all transactions, even the purchase of a newspaper from a kiosk. The objective is to track every single expenditure, regardless of the bureaucratic nightmare that ensues from such a paper chase. To that end, the tax crusade is going digital. On Oct. 3, the government began issuing hundreds of thousands of new swipe cards the forokarta that automatically transmit a record of every purchase to the finance ministry. That date is then inserted into each taxpayers personal tax file. The response has been decidedly underwhelming. Most of the cards are still sitting in banks because the undertaking is on a volunteer basis. But it will become compulsory next year. Everything will come into a central server, says Lekkas. There will be no human interference in the system. That will put an end to bribery, even by tax collectors. As well, new laws coming into effect for 2012 will give tax inspectors access to all bank accounts. Well find out which companies are sending their money offshore and whos been forgetting, shall we say, to pay what they owe the state. The broader goal, Lekkas explains, is to convince ordinary Greeks that the state is serious about holding the major tax fraudsters to account because there is precious little faith left between the state and its citizenry. Offenders will go to jail, he vows. Asked how many high-rolling tax-dodgers have been thrown in the slammer thus far, Lekkas winces. Not one. Star columnist Rosie DiManno is in Greece looking at the nations debt crisis.

Hochegger: Money for Macedonias Name lobbying

Source: http://www.salzburg.com/online/nachr...g=&text=&mode= Posted by Makedonche

25 September 2011 | 12: 39 | Vienna | Share The lobbyist Peter Hochegger, which is being investigated in numerous cases of corruption suspect in Austria , had also Greek business contacts. In one of his interrogations in the case of Buwog by the judiciary he declared that it is invested, specifically to the naming of the State of Macedonia money around on a project in Macedonia : ""the Greeks wanted to prevent the name of Macedonia . Hochegger was been asked in the hearing to a receipt of payment in Cyprus , came not from his own Cypriot society of Astropolis. First, he had told investigators it was this apparently illegal of a Greek businessman, that he should invest for this. In the same hearing he corrected his own information but and said then the fact that it had gone in truth to lobbying for the naming of Macedonia . First, a large project of communication between an agency in Brussels and Hochegger Bulgaria had been identified. Then have that there was no official funds and the whole project will be fed by a Greek Fund turned out. "Greek businessmen have teamed up and deposited in a Fund, because the Greek Government it not brought, to lead the dialogue at political level." Some 100,000 euros had to be invested in a campaign, "put on both sides pressure and to find a compromise in naming". The Greek Government was furthermore informed and have also originally agreed, but then changed their minds and canceled the project. There have been so not official money. The Greek businessman have paid him money to Cyprus . Was reached but the dispute over the payment of an invoice, which would like to assign this project. Written accounts were never issued to the transfers. Hochegger, the ex-FPOe-politician and lobbyists Walter Meischberger, the Ernst Karl Plech Realtor and former Finance Minister Grasser Buwog privatization is being investigated in the case. The suspicion that which it was obtained through abuse of authority was, paid commissions amounting to almost EUR 10 million of the victorious Immofinanz Hochegger and Meischberger for information is rejected by the accused. It applies the presumption of innocence.

THE BUBBLE BURST AND THE STORY WAS A TALE / WRITTEN ON 01-09-2011
by Vassilis - Bruxelles (sorry for the poor translation by Google-translate) Recently, a delegation of the Rainbow- and , found in Brussels , Belgium , to visit the European Parliament. There, colleagues of our newspaper had the opportunity to meet a friend on Facebook and hear a very interesting history. A history afigimeni simple, but revealing all the elements of Greek nationalist myth and the level of the average Greek, on historical, political and knowledge. It's the story, the feelings that many ethnic Macedonians in

Greece , lived and felt when they realized the lie within which grew and educated. My name is Basil and I was born and I live in Brussels , Belgium . Greek-I. Belgian mother and Greek father, a native of the island of the Cyclades . Greek, among other languages, I learned the summers on the island and Greek school in Belgium , where they attend classes twice a week for five years. Since childhood I learned one word only, "Hellas", the country of Alexander the Great, Leonidas, Pericles, Achilles ... I learned that we Greeks are the chosen people, that we brought to light and democracy to other nations of the world, such as history, alphabet, philosophy, mathematics, medicine, Olympics ... Mini was proud that I was Greek. Toddler felt superior to the other kids at school. When we played at school or neighborhood, with children from different cultures (Belgian, Moroccan, Congolese, Italians, Turks, Spaniards, etc.) then told them that I am Greek and we have the longest history of the world and that you're not anything. You do not existed and lived in caves and under eat with their hands. So I had learned as a child at home and at Greek school. I remember one day in the Greek school, one teacher told us something and we laughed all day with other children: Greece is a country of 5000 years and Belgium or 200 years. The American movie my big fat Greek wedding represents very well the current Greek and exactly what I have experienced since childhood, namely that it is all Greek to this planet. But there was another word that we had learned in school. Turkey . That all Turks are bad and that means an enemy of Turkey , Greece and that we were slaves 400 years ... the Turks feared the young and hated it too. At school I did not speak with Turkish and did not like at all. From small my grandmother and other older people, telling me stories about the Turks, many bad things about people that. In Belgium I was a proud Greek, but soon descended to my village on the island, there was the Belgian, the stranger, because my mother is Belgian and very embarrassed about it. Continue on the island, children and old people were telling me that I am Greek and I'm Belgian. Many people in the village did not greet with fooling the ground. Even today, unfortunately. To 2004, when I went to Greece this summer, it was a great year for the country and the Greek people. It was the year of the Olympic Games and this year the football team won the European Cup in Portugal . That summer was a little incident: a kid told me 'you nikisameeee. " I asked who won and told me France won 1-0, the team Zidane won the quarter-finals, we won. I told him that I'm not French and did not live in France but in Belgium . The same is said. You speak French. I answered: because I speak French dilafi in Belgium , I'm French? R then the Americans and British are all in Latin America is Spanish. At that moment I realized that there is no dialogue with these people and unfortunately in Greece , there are many such. In the summer of 2006 was another such incident. Many people ask me what happened in France , in Paris in October 2005 (political turmoil). I told the kids just do not know, France is my

country and do not live there. Somebody jumped me and said you're there all bastards (Muslims, blacks, etc.) and I replied, because you're what? Purified Greek? 400 years Turks in the Balkans and you think you are clean? Then I was too tired with all this. Then I heard the same old thing for Greece and the Greeks were born and will die Greeks etc ... 2006 was the year that changed everything in my life. It was the beginning of the end for the story on direct connection of modern Greeks with the ancient Greeks. That year I met two children in Brussels , two brothers hailing from Ioannina. Their father kept a grocery store near my neighborhood and I was often there and we sat and speak. One day, I remember, Romanians immigrants came and asked to buy something and the boss, ie the father of the children began to speak a strange language I could not understand (I speak French, English, Greek and Dutch / Flemish). They left as soon as customers, asked them, but what language is that? Told me it Vlach and asked them what are the Vlach? I said, do not let go. They told me it Ellinovlachoi. Then I could not understand what was happening. The evening once I got home, I went to look on the internet in google, what was the Vlach and there I found a page on wikipedia about the Vlachs, Aromanous, "les valaques" in French. There I got a shock, I said to myself, but what are they? The next summer when I went Greece , I went and found my uncle and told him about what I read, heard and saw. So we started a conversation. He said that here on the island, there are other roots from Venice Italian and Albanian. I said, what? But what are you talking about Albania ? He said that in 1400 something, a Venetian, (Giovanni Lorendano), married a Greek woman, Mary Sommaripa and he built the castle and brought many in his own island. Until then here there was no one told me. There I got a shock. In my heart I could not believe it. I asked him if we have Albanian roots and my uncle asked me if I love Greece . I replied that yes. This is the most important he said. Now we are Greeks and nothing else. My father listened to all this and forbade me to talk about such issues with my uncle. That tells a lie and that there were Albanians, only Italians from Venice . We have only a few Italian roots. After that I kept looking and other information on the Internet. I watched many videos but I was afraid a little because I know some are propaganda and tell lies. One day I found a video and I saw that in Albania Tsamis and dance the title was tsmiko-Albanians. Again I searched on google for the Albanians and found many things for Tsamis, Albanians and realized that all of them are of Albanian origin, speak the same language, they also have a great history, " Illyria ." There I learned a bit about the history of Illyria . They lived with the Greeks at that place, that Kolokotronis and Bouboulina Albanians were not Greeks, but fought and gave their lives for the freedom of the Greek current state called Greece / Greece . In Greek school we were told then to the heroes of 1821, they were Greeks, that Albanians are Greeks, as the Vlachs, Pontiac, Sarakatsani, Pomaks etc. I heard and read that there are many Albanians in Epirus , Peloponnese , Evia, in Corinth , Attica and some Aegean islands. As there are too many Vlachs of Thessaly, Epirus, Southern Albania, Republic of Macedonia, Greek Macedonia as well. There are too many Roma, Pomaks, Turkish, Bulgarian, Greek and Turkish Thrace. Today I understand the Albanians say that Greece has stolen many of their own heroes. I searched also for the Pontian and history. Then I heard that the Pontic Greeks is that Pontiac is ancient Greek. Today Pontiac living in Greece is indeed Greek citizens, but whether relating to

ancient Greece , I do not think so. I know though that language does not understand. I found a documentary on youtube did a Greek television several years ago on the points still left Turkey , eastern Turkey and have not much freedom there, that there are schools for those that prohibit them to speak their language, that Turks are trying to uproot the Pontic culture, namely the Greek for today's Greeks. But I think we should do a similar documentary on the Vlachs, Albanians, Macedonians, who have no freedom in Greece , did not have schools and books in their language, many of them do not even know their real roots and the language of grandparents and grandmothers. They say that Pontiac ellinopoiithikan once went there when the ancient Greeks, but before that what was it? Persians and Greeks then and now Turkish? Also in the documentary I saw persons who do not like people living in the Balkans, but they look more like those countries as Azerbaijan , Georgia etc. I have many questions without answers on many topics such as the Greek alphabet which we were taught at school that is the first alphabet and the Latin and Cyrillic, depend on it. But I think the basis of today's Latin, Cyrillic and Greek alphabet is the alphabet of the Phoenicians, a simitikou people who once lived there is now Lebanon and Syria and is also the basis of the Hebrew alphabet and other Semitic languages. It was a shock all this stuff about me. I felt really bad, I did not know what to do and what to believe about all this. I tried many times to forget and say to myself that it can all be lies, but I am man who can not be lied to himself and continues to look for the roots of today's Modern Greek. I learned that many Greek words actually come from Turkey and that very few Greeks know it as: tzatziki, Zeybek, dolmades, meatballs, baklava, Mr. Punch, reziliki, ntempelis, butcher, bouzouki, port etc, but that many is Latin, like the front door, staircase, boat, etc. But I wondered what happens These are not Greek words and products? And then I learned that identical words used in Bulgarian and makedoniki and many other languages of the Balkans. I realized that many left over from the Ottoman Empire, as of course the current music that we hear every day and dancing to bouzouki music, but also that many adjectives in Greece have Turkish roots, like those who have part-Smith, Deli-, Kara- , or ending in-oglou, tzis-,-nlis etc. I asked one day a Turk, who is now my friend, what do all these words and told me kara means black, Hajji pilgrimage oglou = son, Deli = crazy etc. Anarotiomoun if all those who have Turkish names are Turkish and I made the conclusion that we are all upset and we live in Greece today and to have Greek or Turkish name means absolutely nothing. After all, I thought that travel search of the real roots of the Greeks over, but unfortunately or fortunately not. He had not even finished. There was the issue of Macedonia , I heard many years and had no knowledge about this issue. I knew nothing about the people living in Macedonia today and why they feel and are called Macedonians. Republika Makedonija. It all began in January 2009, when I went to work in a Greek shop as a waiter / bartender. There, the boss was voreioelladitis from Florina, ie the part of Greek Macedonia.

One day some people came to see the boss and there I heard talk among themselves a different language from the Greek and asked him what language he spoke. At first I thought maybe it was Albanian, but she said they were speaking locals that in Edessa and Florina and Kastoria and other places, we're talking local. And I asked him, sorry, what are the locals? And I saw in him something like fear, like shy to tell me and finally my wife said they are Yugoslavs. Yugoslavia ; I asked, what Serbian No. Serbian told me, only Yugoslavia . After a few weeks, knew better and better talked and discussed. And I have another question: how Uncle Peloponnesian and have names ending in-opoulos, Florina? And there I saw again that he was ashamed or that "kolouse" to answer me and told me that probably someone's grandfather came from Peloponnese to Florina, but was not sure. But where I knew that something bad was done again and again past the Greek state are hiding something, I was sure about this, with so much that I had read and heard, not a surprise to me these issues. After several weeks it again and I asked again. Barba what language you speak? And there he told me. Makedonika speak. He said that his father was a Macedonian, and so is his mother and that it knew Greek and that was at home alone makedonika spoke Greek and that he learned in school. But he said that now is Greek. What to do? Follow me say that it is much more Greek from Melina Mercouri. We were discussing for hours about Macedonia and its history. He said that the toddler had learned to be Macedonian, ie makedonec and Florina old named Lerin. He said that they had changed their names and forbids them to speak their native language on the streets, schools, etc. primarily a law if I am not mistaken, the Metaxas said. A fascist ruling Greece sometime. Later I talked with many who live Florina Brussels, and several of them said that only Macedonians, ie Makedonci, and some others who say they are Greeks who are married to Greek men and women have not learned the language of their ancestors to their children. Maybe because they're embarrassed? Because it can even today be afraid? Or maybe because they feel modern Greeks, as the Vlachs, Pontian, Albanians ... I read that Macedonia was divided after the Balkan wars and then there was the state of Macedonia . The issue of Macedonia is not from 1991 but much older, many Macedonians left for communist Yugoslavia and have lost homes, possessions, families, friends, relatives ... and others that remained in Florina, Kastoria, Edessa, Thessaloniki, Kilkis in many villages of northern Greece, forbade them to speak in their language, to keep their names. Macedonia 's Alexander is cut into four. Greece , Bulgaria , Republic of Macedonia , Albania and Kosovo so if I'm not mistaken, has a little bit. I read and learned that many Macedonians / Makedonci, called Thessaloniki Soloun, Selanik Turks, Jews, Jerusalem of the Balkans, Greek Salonika. Albania , Greece , Western Macedonia , like Alexander the Great on heritage and all tried in their own way to propagandize the people living in the Balkans today. For Iskander Albanians, the Greeks Alexander the Macedonians Aleksandar. With all that I read, thought and anarotiomoun. Who was Alexander? Illyrian was it because his mother, Olympias was pringipissa of Illyria , and thus want the Albanians? Was it Greek? As he

spoke the ancient Greek and believe in 12 gods? Or was Makedonec and thus They want heritage and Western Macedonia ? Only one I know is certain that Alexander Macedonians. I drew the conclusion that nobody in the Balkans has no direct connection with the Macedonians and Greeks who lived before 2000-3000 years before Christ. And that the AMA today called Hellas Greece and Greek citizens and believe they have a direct connection to the ancient Greeks, then for me there is no problem to call themselves Macedonians in the neighboring country and believe that they are descendants of Alexander. Today I feel aethnos and the only thing I know is that I grew up in Belgium , in Brussels , the capital of Europe , a democratic country, away from these problems.

Not another BIG Bulgarian Lie?

Bulgarian Document divulges activities in Prilep from October 11, 1941
By Aleksandar Donski, M.A. UGD Institute of History and Archeology Translated and edited by Risto Stefov It is well known that Macedonian Revolutionaries attacked the Bulgarian police station in Prilep on October 11th, 1941 . As a result the fascist Bulgarian police severely retaliated not only against the attackers but against the entire peaceful population in that city. This kind of behaviour left bitter feelings with many residents, including some Macedonians who worked for the Bulgarian fascists. One such Macedonian was Kosta Tsrnushanov (subsequently a folklorist and publicist) who worked for the Ministry of Education for a little while. What is not well known, publicly, is that following the October 11 attacks, Tsrnushanov wrote a protest letter to the Bulgarian Minister of Education. In the letter (which is actually an official Bulgarian document from that time) written vividly were measures the Bulgarian fascist police and the army had undertaken against Prilep residents immediately after the October 11 attack. It can clearly be seen that Tsrnushanov himself (even though he worked for the regime) had bitter feelings towards the action taken by the police and the army. Part of Tsrnushanovs letter was made public in 1996 which reads: Victims of the attacks and eyewitnesses complained to me: It was as if someone had witnessed a wolf pack attacking a herd; that is how the attack was described and that is what happened to the citizens of Prilep while being beaten and arrested by the Bulgarian police and army. People were arrested wherever they were found; at home, in the theater, in the cafs, or wherever they happened to be. They were taken to the Bulgarian police station and from there were thrown in jail. On the road there and in the Bulgarian police station they were beaten to unconsciousness and cursed for being children of Mother Macedonia! Who

then were the real attackers? Naturally they were the police, the soldiers, police officials, etc., including the former District Police Chief. They used sticks, planks, their feet and their rifle barrels to beat people. They hit wherever they could; on the head, on the back, everywhere There were around 300 people beaten and 70 jailed People were beaten regardless of age; from young up to age 70; so was the case of Mitre Mazarot Unfortunately, the beatings and abuse did not end there; the same people were also looted. Their money and other belongings were stolen; pens, watches and other items. The looting was done by the policemen and soldiers. (Kosta Tsrnushanov: Prinoc km istorijata na MMTRO Sofia, 1996). We believe that this testimonial is proof enough to counter the claims of those today who insist that the Bulgarian fascists came to Macedonia to liberate it.

Anti-Roma Demonstrations Spread Across Bulgaria

September 27, 2011 http://www.nytimes.com/2011/09/28/wo...1&ref=bulgaria Anti-Gypsy demonstrations that began during the weekend continued to spread across Bulgaria on Tuesday evening in response to the killing of a man by a minibus whose driver is linked to a man accused of being a Roma crime boss. Prime Minister Boyko M. Borisov and his main political rival, President Georgi S. Parvanov, made a show of bipartisan unity Monday in visiting Katunitsa, the village where the killing happened on Friday. Protesters had burned houses and cars belonging to the family of the supposed crime boss, Kiril Rashkov, while demanding that the authorities deport the family from the village, which has a population of 2,300. The news media referred to the protests as pogroms. The protesters shouted racist slogans like Gypsies into soap and Turks under the knife. The police guarded entrances to Roma neighborhoods across the country as demonstrators announced protests on Tuesday evening in 20 cities, including Sofia , the capital. Roma men are reported to have taken up clubs and axes in response to rumors of invasions by skinheads. The demonstrations began after word spread that Angel Petrov, 19, had been run over by a minibus driven by a relative of Mr. Rashkovs while walking his dog, Atanas Petrov, his father, said on the television station BTV. Over 125 people were arrested during the weekend, 28 of whom were charged with hooliganism, after soccer fans joined the local protesters. Hundreds of nationalists rode their motorcycles to Katunitsa on Sunday to show their support. About 100 other people were arrested on Monday around the country. In the Communist era, Mr. Rashkov, 69, was convicted several times of offenses involving

illegal foreign exchange and gold transactions. In 1998, he founded a Roma political party. Bulgaria has faced years of heavy criticism from the European Union for failing to reform its ineffective judicial system and for not prosecuting any high-level organized-crime figures or corrupt government officials. Every town in Bulgaria has local crime bosses, be they Roma or ethnic Bulgarian, said Krasimir Kunev, president of the Bulgarian Helsinki Committee, a human rights organization in Sofia . The government has consistently failed to prosecute them, he said. These incidents have deep roots in Bulgaria s post-Communist transition, he said. Mr. Kunev said the police reacted slowly at the beginning of the protest, encouraging the proliferation of ethnic hatred. He said there was no reason to think that anti-Roma feelings were especially high at the moment. It has always been very high, Mr. Kunev said. In such an atmosphere, there should be no surprise that you have so many young people marching on the streets, shouting racist slogans and destroying property, Mr. Kunev said. But he said that later actions by law enforcement officials had been sufficient. Andrei Raichev, a political analyst at Gallup International in Sofia , said the passions stemmed from three qualities attributed to Mr. Rashkov: criminality, extreme wealth and Roma ethnicity. These, he said, are the three kinds of hatred here. I cant ever remember such a case of mass aggression against Roma, he said.

From the International Scene

Greece is slipping into the abyss
As the economic crisis worsens, the very fabric of society in Athens is being ripped apart as the Greeks lose their good humour and generosity. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/greece/8799364/Greece-is-slipping-intothe-abyss.html#.ToiEBHsquOs.email Greek grannies are as ubiquitous and iconic as Greek cats. Dressed immaculately in widows black, and with their grey hair neatly styled, they are proud figures. They are treated with respect by even the most rebellious youths, and acknowledged by all as the head of the fiercely maternal family groups that bind Greek society together. The old lady I saw on the street in Athens this week was typical, except in one shocking respect. She was begging. Beggars are normal here these days, but almost all are immigrants or drug

users. This was different. The image of this proud woman sitting on a plastic crate outside the supermarket with her hands out has stayed in my mind. If a symbol is needed to illustrate the unravelling of Greek society, then this is it. The Athens I knew 20 years ago has changed radically. I used to tell British friends that despite its chaos, it was a very civilised city. When I moved here, you didnt have homeless people sleeping on the streets, there was little crime and the sick and needy were looked after. That civility is vanishing fast. With economic doom becoming ever more likely, it sometimes feels as if the fabric of society is being ripped asunder. Muggings used to be a rarity; not any more. Walk down the main streets of central Athens at night and you will see people sleeping rough. The other day I had to deal with a young man who had passed out on my doorstep. He may have been drunk, but in these crisis-stricken days, it is just as likely that he was high on crack cocaine, now selling for 5 euros a hit. I wasnt going to risk disturbing him I had my children with me. My area of central Athens is a relatively bad location, but there are much worse places. The neighbourhood of Psirri borders the popular tourist attractions. Ten years ago, Psirri was rejuvenated. Bars and cafes opened, old buildings were restored. A live jazz club opened that was an instant hit. The club is gone now, and most of the shops are closed. The area became so dangerous that people simply stopped going there. Now its riddled with drugs. People shoot up on the street and accost anyone foolish enough to stray through the area for money. And all of this takes place a short walk from the Acropolis. Many friends have headed to the suburbs but they arent as safe as they were. Last week, an elderly couple in a decent neighbourhood were held hostage in their home by men carrying AK47 assault rifles. They took their cash and credit cards and then stole the couples car. These changes to Athens didnt happen overnight, but have occurred astonishingly fast. A perfect storm has been created, with the financial meltdown which threatens to bring down Greece and the rest of the EU, combining with social breakdown and that ''other crisis immigration. Despite the turmoil, illegal immigration isnt slowing. An Afghan refugee doesnt care if Greece is in trouble, he only intends staying long enough to find a way to get to the promised lands of Germany , Britain or Scandinavia . But many illegals dont make it any further. Before the crisis this didnt matter too much. There was work on building sites and in the fields. Manual labour that Greeks have become used to paying someone else to do. But most of this work has gone, too. Five years ago, I met Mahjid, a Pakistani with legal status in Greece . Hes lived here for 15 years, ran a successful building business and sent enough money home to keep his family happy. He even captained a fledgling cricket team. Now he hasnt worked for six months and is leaving for Germany . The Bangladeshi in my local shop keeps asking me why I havent gone back to Britain . He thinks I am mad. Even the Albanians are leaving! he tells me. If Britain thinks the Greek crisis wont have an impact there, it is wrong.

The luckiest immigrants do make it to the promised lands, but many fail. Trapped, they rent mattresses on crammed floors from unscrupulous landlords for 12 hours a day and hang around the few open spaces Athens has to offer. One such space was a local square, which has the largest Orthodox church in the Balkans. The immigrants used to congregate here, but suffered too many attacks. Now three foot high letters are written on the ground in front of the church spelling Foreigners Out. Nobody will remove it. Greek reaction ranges from pity and patience, to anger and racism. The neo-Nazi Golden Dawn party has its headquarters nearby while they havent made it to parliament yet, the dangerous mixture of increasing immigration and falling living standards ensures their growing popularity. The immigrants are a constant reminder of how desperate things can get. I dont bother recycling tin cans any more. The bin outside my apartment is gone through five or six times a day. Some people are looking for food, but most are metal scavengers. A small army operates all over Athens . We used to take unwanted clothes to charity shops but I cant see the point now. If I leave anything outside the door it will be gone in minutes. The description of Britain as a nation of shopkeepers could equally apply to Greece ; except those small family businesses are closing in their thousands. Walk along a central Athens street and up to half the shops will have a small sign in the window with red writing saying for sale or for rent. Every sign represents another family for whom life has just been turned upside down. I wrote before the summer about the difficulties of daily life. Back then, the frequent strikes were frustrating, but could be lived with. People said: Wait until after the summer, then we are really going to see how tough it gets. They were right. The Greek granny begging, the daily assault course of strikes and the hopeless plight of immigrants are only the visible signs of growing despair. It is in the family homes that the full impact is being felt. Greeks can appear loud and gregarious, but their family life is intensely private. You never admit to difficulties within the family. Protesters may have grabbed headlines, but they didnt speak for many of the decent, hard working Greeks. These people are suffering with quiet dignity, and its taking its toll. It may not sound like the end of the world to lose 250 euros a month from your pay, but it is when the salary is only 1,000 euros. Salaries are going in one direction, while prices are going in the other. VAT has had a 10 point hike and the cost of milk rises by the week. We are no longer talking about lifestyles being altered: people are struggling to put food on the table. And thats before they get hit by emergency property taxes. If you dont pay them your electricity will be cut off, as the state is using the electricity company to collect the tax. Looming over the day-to-day difficulties is the threat of losing your job, especially a state one, that used to mean a job for life: 30,000 jobs are to be axed immediately. The days of the goldplated state jobs are numbered. I spoke to a friend who runs a psychiatric hospital. He acknowledged that depression is rife. We are all depressed now, he said. Its just a question of degree. Some people make the problem worse with drugs or alcohol.

Suicide figures are difficult to pin down, partly because the Orthodox Church says that it is a sin and refuses to bury anyone who has taken their own life. But if the Hellenic Statistical Authority can be believed, the first five months of 2011 saw a 40 per cent rise, while help lines report a massive increase in calls. Good humour and generosity were once a Greek trademark. But thats all gone. People are depressed, scared and exhausted by the relentless pressure of heavier cuts and taxes. Every Greek granny remembers the hardships and suffering of the war and its aftermath. Hundreds of thousands of civilians died from starvation. The civil war that followed and the brutal military dictatorship that lasted until 1974 are recent events. Greeks were led to believe that those nightmarish times were over, that the future would be better. But we are only at the start of this crisis. What will happen next year when unemployment doubles and people lose their homes? The Communist calls for revolution dont look nearly as far-fetched as they did six months ago. While civil war doesnt look likely, a return to the military days must be a possibility. If the Greek people reject their entire political system and the state falls apart, what will be left? The great danger is that the people are being pushed so far that the unthinkable becomes possible.

Opinions
The Cradle of Frustration (Greece)
By Voda I have recently returned from a trip to Greece . The economy is in shambles! Every fourth store is closed in Athens , Salonica (Solun) and Florina (Lerin). The stores are open only from 9:00am to 2:30pm . People work only a very few hours each day. Even the government offices work only a few hours a day. Then it is siesta time. The Greek government entered the EU in 1981 with lies. The EU was told by Greece that they have so many fields with olive trees and many other false reports concerning production and industry. It took the EU from 1981 until 2011, 30 years to realize that the Greek government lied atrociously in order to become an EU member country. In the 21st century still Greece denies that any minorities exist in Greece . Apparently according to Greece the entire population in Greece is Greek. I wonder how long it will take the EU to realize that in Greece they do have minorities such as Macedonians, Jews, Roma, Turks, Vlachs, Pomaks, Albanians. EU how long are you going to tolerate the Greek lies? There are signs posted in Greece , everywhere on the walls in villages and cities is written Macedonia is Greece . In Florina (Lerin) I heard one morning school children about 11 to 12 years old were chanting "one two three Macedonia is Greece ". This is what they are taught in schools! Also in Salonica

(Solun) the Greek newspaper Stohos wrote "Greeks do not forget that the capital of Greece is Constantinople and that Izmir is a pure Greek city". What nonsense is this? In August 2011 another Greek newspaper wrote Gevgelia, Bitola and Skopje are Greek cities and we want those cities back from the Republic of Macedonia . My question to the EU is which country has territorial ambitions or pretensions Greece or Macedonia ? The Greek government is spending EU money to teach the Vlachs in the Republic of Macedonia how to speak Greek, but in the Republic of Macedonia the Macedonian government is teaching the Vlachs in their mother tongue the Vlach language. Why does the Greek government not teach the Vlachs in Greece the Vlach language? Why Greece is interfering in the internal affairs of another country? Why are the Macedonians and other minorities in Greece not allowed to learn their mother tongue? Recently in Lithuania the Greek basketball organization tried to bribe the referees when the Greek team was to play Macedonia . But they were caught and this cost the Greek basketball organization 15,000 euros.

Concerns
We better start learning Chinese, so we can understand the orders our new masters are giving us. The Gillard Government con job, lie after lie to the Australian people. Consistent lies how could anyone believe this Government. As received. Some hard facts on China today China has 19% of the worlds population, but consumes ... 53% of the world's cement ... 48% of the world's iron ore ... 47% of the world's coal ... and the majority of just about every major commodity. In 2010, China produced 11 times more steel than the United States . New World Record: China made and sold 18 million vehicles in 2010. There are more pigs in China than in the next 43 pork producing nations combined. China currently has the worlds fastest train and the worlds largest high-speed rail network. China is currently the number one producer in the world of wind and solar power. China currently controls more than 90% of the total global supply of rare earth elements. In the past 15 years, China has moved from 14th place to 2nd place in the world in published scientific research articles. China now possesses the fastest supercomputer on the entire globe. At the end of March 2011, China accumulated US$3.04 trillion in foreign currency reserves - the largest stockpile on the entire globe. Chinese consume 50,000 cigarettes every second

Not an enviable record though Also a lot smarter than us. While they manufacture 80% of the worlds solar panels, They install less than 5%. And, Build a new coal fired power station every week and in 1 year turn on more new coal powered electricity than Australia 's total output Already the largest carbon dioxide emitter, output will rise 70% by 2020. Glad we're saving the planet!! Makes you wonder who the hell these moron politicians are working for? It's not the Australian people that's for sure. Posted by George S.

Macedonian celebrations irk Greece

Statue of Alexander the Great, unveiled to mark 20 years of independence, stokes neighbourly tensions. Last Modified: 09 Sep 2011 07:49 http://english.aljazeera.net/news/europe/2011/09/20119965240131690.html It has been 20 years since the Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia gained independence and as thousands celebrate, the festivities are stirring controversy at home and abroad. Greece , which has always opposed its neighbour's use of the name Macedonia over concerns it may have designs on the Greek region of the same name, is now objecting to a $7 million statue of military conqueror Alexander the Great, who both countries claim as their own. It says Skopje is forging history, by stealing Greek names and national heroes, while some Macedonian citizens believe such extravagant gestures are better spent on helping the poor. Al Jazeera's Claudio Lavanga reports from Skopje , the Macedonian capital. Source: Al Jazeera

Greek Basketball Federation Attempted to Bribe Officials in game vs Macedonia?

Wednesday, 07 September 2011 http://macedoniaonline.eu/content/view/19076/50/

According to preliminary information, an official from Greece 's Basketball Federation attempted to bribe FIBA referees Luigi Lamonica of Italy , David Chambon of France and Lithuanian referee Yurgis Laurinavicius.

All three referees were said to be stunned by the offer and the fact that Greece would sink so low, refused the bribe and reported the case to FIBA's headquarters. FIBA had tried to keep this under the carpet, at least until the tournament is still ongoing, however a source within the organization had released it to Lithuanian media. MINA finds the official of the Greek Basketball Federation has been immediately suspended, his accreditation was taken away while the Greek Basketball Federation is fined 15,000 euros! As a reminder, Macedonia defeated Greece 72-58. The fact that Greece attempted to bribe the referees speaks volumes how important was this match to them. As for the actual act of bribery... one can only feel sorry for this morally bankrupt nation.

Choices
Hard Hit by Crisis, Greek Businessmen Cooperate with Macedonian Co.
Friday, 23 September 2011 http://macedoniaonline.eu/content/view/19192/46/ Businessmen from Chalkidiki , Greece have demonstrated interest for cooperation with Macedonian companies in the field of construction, food industry, agriculture, textile, real estate etc. They attended Friday a business forum at the Economic Chamber of Macedonia, where they established direct communication with Macedonian companies. "We believe there is lots of room for cooperation and that is why we have 35 companies here today. We believe meetings with local companies will yield good results. This is the goal of the two chambers", said Georgios Gilis, chairman of the Chalkidiki Chamber of Commerce. Gilis does not think that Greek investors would withdraw from Macedonia if the situation worsened in Greece , believing they would overcome problems. "Greek export has risen in the recent period, and on the other hand the European bank says it would continue to support Greek banks. Therefore, I believe there will be no problems in this regard", stressed Gilis. Asked if the name row has an effect on bilateral cooperation, he said politicians should focus on that issue, but the businessmen urge both governments to sit on the negotiating table.

"As businessmen we call upon both governments to negotiate and I am certain that sincere talks will give good results to everyone's satisfaction", added Gilis. The next meeting between the Macedonian and Greek businessmen will be held in Chalkidiki.

Free Advice
Reality Hits I prefer them to be called New Greeks, with or without capitals. I am referring to them as New Greeks in my personal writings, and I am clear about why. The principle reason is that they are not the descendants of the ancient Greeks; they derive from various ethnic, religious and cultural groups who, for reasons I won't go into here, adopted a sham heritage, they adopted a bogus identity for the privilege of being part of a modern nation state. Their identity is a sham, and they have no valid historical claim to any territory in the region, let alone Macedonian territory. I am happy to refer to them as new Greeks for other reasons. It is no insignificant matter that they speak a language that was native to no one - a dead language, imposed from the outside. All of the contemporary evidence has these supposed 'ethnic Greeks' doing Albanian dances, speaking in Albanian ... etc. The evidence, thanks to T.M is overwhelming. A Westerner might argue that something of ancient Greek lived, or survived - well not in the village communities of New Greece. This had to be imposed. There is nothing natural about them. They are in a nutshell, New Greeks. Pelister aka Paul

Stories
Australian Macedonian Advisory Council Inc. v LIVV Pty Limited trading as Australian Macedonian Weekly (AntiDiscrimination) [2011] VCAT 1647 ( 30 August 2011)
Last Updated: 6 September 2011 http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/cases/v...2011/1647.html VICTORIAN CIVIL AND ADMINISTRATIVE TRIBUNAL HUMAN RIGHTS DIVISION - ANTI-DISCRIMINATION LIST VCAT REFERENCE NO. A41/2011 CATCHWORDS

Racial and Religious Tolerance Act 2001, section 7, whether article in ethnic weekly newspaper incited hatred or other relevant emotion on the ground of race APPLICANT Australian Macedonian Advisory Council Inc. (AMAC) on behalf of James Papadopoulos, Con Kouremenos, Christine Stavropoulos and Ian Pelekanakis RESPONDENT LIVV Pty Limited trading as Australian Macedonian Weekly WHERE HELD Melbourne BEFORE Noreen Megay, Senior Member HEARING TYPE Hearing DATE OF HEARING 3 and 4 August 2011 DATE OF ORDER 30 August 2011 CITATION Australian Macedonian Advisory Council Inc. v LIVV Pty Limited trading as Australian Macedonian Weekly (Anti-Discrimination) [2011] VCAT 1647 ORDER The complaint is dismissed. Noreen Megay Senior Member

APPEARANCES: For Applicant Mr. T Hurley of counsel For Respondents Mr. J W Rapke QC, senior counsel REASONS Background The complainant AMAC is an incorporated association and the other complainants are, or were, office bearers of the association. According to its website, AMAC is an Hellenic-Australian non-profit political synergy, established in 2008 for the welfare and advancement of the GreekAustralian community. The chief concern of the AMAC is to edify, preserve and promote Hellenic civilization in Australia with specific emphasis on the origin, history and culture of Macedonia . Where possible, it clarifies distortions of events aimed towards the falsification of Macedonian history through the illumination of historical truth, thereby safeguarding the kernel of Hellenic heritage for the sake of posterity. The respondent company publishes a weekly newspaper entitled Australian Macedonian Weekly. The newspaper is published mostly in the Macedonian language with the occasional article in English. It is produced in paper form and is sold by newsagents and other retailers. The hard copy version uses the Cyrillic alphabet. An electronic version appears on a website and its readers can choose between Cyrillic and Latin alphabets. Its editor (and sole director and shareholder) is Mr. Ljupco Stankovski. He prints 5,000 copies each week with approximately 2,400 copies being distributed throughout Victoria , the balance throughout Australia where there are large Macedonian communities. The 19 May 2009 edition (at page 27 of 60) carried an article headed Who in this celestial world gave the Greeks the right to take away the Macedonian language? Apart from page 26 (which included four English language articles on a related subject matter), a small article on page 60 about a Melbourne Victory result and various advertisements, it was the only other English-language article in the entire 60-page edition. The article in question is said to be written by someone who calls himself Gandeto and is datelined 14 May 2009 . The editor was sent a copy of this article from overseas. He received it on 16 May 2009 and having read it, decided to publish it. On 17 May he suffered a stroke which left him in a coma for two months and in hospital until the end of the year. Following publication of the article Mr. Kiritsis, the executive director of the complainant, wrote a series of letters to the respondent. Those letters were dated 29 July 2009 , 12 August 2009 , 15

August 2009 , 25 August 2009 , 9 September 2009 , 16 September 2009 and 1 September 2010 . Only two of them referred specifically to the article in question; the balance took the form of complaints about the publication of some geographical maps and an earlier article entitled Sex, Alexander the Great and a dog called Dora the content of which is unknown to the Tribunal. There is no doubt that the major cause for concern expressed in those letters was the latter article, not the Gandeto one. On 14 August 2009 AMAC was informed of Mr. Stankovskis stroke and on 14 September 2009 his son sought further particulars of the complaints. Notwithstanding the grave illness of the publisher, the complainants took their grievance to the Press Council on 30 September 2009 but as the Tribunal understands matters, their complaint was not able to be dealt with. On 24 September 2010 they filed a complaint with the Victorian Equal Opportunity and Human Rights Commission. Attempts to conciliate the dispute were unsuccessful and on 27 January 2011 the matter was referred to this Tribunal pursuant to s.117(3) of the Equal Opportunity Act 1995. Because it will be necessary consider the article in its historical and social context, some explanation is required. The article commences with a statement attributed to the Greek Prime Minister Harilaos Trikoupis who led Greece from 1882 to 1895. The quote is as follows: When the Great War comes, Macedonia will become Greek or Bulgarian, according to who wins. If it is taken by the Bulgarians, they will make the population Slavs. If we take it, we will make all of them Greeks. One again the flavour of the article from the following paragraphs headed Does it make any sense? Harilaos prophecy came true and in the Great War of 1912-13, Greeks with the support of the western nations who reeked with chauvinism and hypocrisy took Macedonia for the first time in their history. Ever since then, this thieving nation meticulously engaged its fascist army in destroying anything Macedonian and replacing it with Greek. To put a permanent imprint on a land they never owned before, they uprooted the ethnic Macedonians from their ancestral lands; burned and defaced any Macedonian artifact found connected to the past, transplanted refugees from Asia Minor and spread their gruesome poisonous propaganda throughout the Macedonian land. By erasing the Macedonian legacy, these fascist Greeks felt that they can eliminate and wipe out all potential witnesses from ever challenging the newly established status quo. While with time, I think, we can forgive their zealousness for replacing the Macedonian toponyms. We can also overlook their crime in ethnically cleansing people from their homes. We can ignore the fact that they have burned our books written in the old Macedonian language. We can, perhaps, disregard the atrocities committed during the war; well even discount the murders perpetrated in the name of Hellenism; we can forgive the delusional Greek zealots from erasing the Macedonian written language from the Macedonian churches and monasteries. Furthermore, we can close our eyes to the everyday torments inflicted on those ethnic Macedonians who elected to stay in their ancestral homes and take a chance under the hated Greek occupation. I think we can, somehow, manage to convince ourselves to let everything stay in the past

The article continues: But what we cannot overlook, what we cannot ignore, what we cannot disregard, cannot forgive, cannot close our eyes to, and we cannot ever remain silent about is the fact that these Greek zealots, these Greek deranged bastardly monsters took the Macedonian language away from our Macedonian children. That is what well never, in a million years, be able to overcome and put behind us. That we cannot do. How can a stinking Greek teacher and spy-for-a priest religious person denigrate, disparage, malign and ridicule the language of a child spoken by his mother and grandmother. How can a first grader be made to feel inferior because he does not speak Greek? How can a butcher-for-apriest refuse to baptize a child with a name given by his parents? ....... Who gave a right to these freaks of nature to impose their ugly nature on other populations .... What evil alien abstraction possessed your dark soul to deprive a child from learning its mothers songs? What barbaric wickedness obliterated your senses to deprive the children from learning their traditional cherished bedtime stories and songs, saved and propagated for generations on hand? Just what morbid urge, what dark indomitable fear prompted you to act with such horrible ferocity against defenseless population entrusted under your care? Fast forward from the 19th century to 1913 and then to 1945 which saw the commencement of the communist Republic of Yugoslavia under Prime Minister Tito comprising Serbia, Croatia, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Macedonia, Slovenia and Montenegro. Tito died in 1980 and without his influence, ethnic and nationalist differences began to flare and the disintegration of the union began. Slovenia and Croatia were first to declare independence followed shortly thereafter (in January 1991) by Macedonia . It became a parliamentary democracy. In an article annexed to Mr. Stankovskis statement, Professor Loring Danforth (the Professor of Anthropology at Bates College Maine USA ) set out the background to what is now colloquially known as the naming dispute. As Yugoslavia finally began to collapse in the early 1990s, the citizens of the Republic of Macedonia , in a referendum held on September 8, 1991 , voted overwhelmingly in favour of initiating the process of establishing a completely sovereign and independent Macedonian state. The fledgling state of Macedonia , however, faced a difficult struggle for international recognition because of the fierce opposition mounted by Greece to what Greeks claim to be a misappropriation by a Slavic people of the name Macedonia , a name that was, is, and always will be Greek. In December 1992 the Republic of Macedonia applied for membership of the United Nations. On 8 April 1993 the General Assembly decided to admit as a Member of the United Nations the

State being provisionally referred to for all purposes within the United Nations as The former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia pending settlement of the difference that had arisen over its name. The naming dispute persists and remains unresolved. According to Professor Danforths article the Greek nationalist position is that because Alexander the Great and the ancient Macedonians were Greeks, and because ancient and modern Greece are bound in an unbroken line of racial and cultural continuity, it is only Greeks who have the right to identify themselves as Macedonian, not the Slavs of southern Yugoslavia, who settled in Macedonia in the sixth century AD and who called themselves Bulgarians until 1944. Two reviews serve to inform the ongoing discussion of the competing parties. Human Rights Watch (formerly Helsinki Watch) published a review of information gathered by a fact-finding mission in the Macedonian region in northern Greece in July 1993. Human Rights Watch is a body established in 1978 to monitor and promote domestic and international compliance with the human rights provisions of the 1975 Helsinki accords. In February 2009 a report by an Independent Expert on Minority Issues ( Mission to Greece ) was presented to the Human Rights Council of the United Nations General Assembly. The Tribunal is not required to express any view on the conclusions contained in these reports save to note that they indicate incidents which, if correct, would serve to authenticate many of the claims that underpin the denunciations in the article in question. The legislation The purposes of the Racial and Religious Tolerance Act 2001 (the Act) are set out in section 1. The purposes of this Act are (a) to promote racial and religious tolerance by prohibiting certain conduct involving the vilification of persons on the ground of race or religious belief or activity; (b) to provide a means of redress for the victims of racial or religious vilification Section 4 sets out the objects and provides (1)The objects of this Act are (a) to promote the full and equal participation of every person in a society that values freedom of expression and is an open and multicultural democracy; (b) to maintain the right of all Victorians to engage in robust discussion of any matter of public interest or to engage in, or comment on, any form of artistic expression, discussion of religious issues or academic debate where such discussion, expression, debate or comment does not vilify or marginalize any person or class of persons;

(c) to promote dispute resolution and resolve tensions between persons who (as a result of their ignorance of the attributes of others and the effect that their conduct may have on others) vilify others on the ground of race or religious belief or activity and those who are vilified. Section 7 makes racial vilification unlawful and provides that(1) A person must not, on the ground of the race of another person or class of persons, engage in conduct that incites hatred against, serious contempt for, or revulsion or severe ridicule of, that other person or class of persons. (2) For the purposes of subsection (1), conduct (a) may be constituted by a single occasion or by a number of occasions over a period of time; and (b) may occur in or outside Victoria . Race is defined in the Act to include (a) colour; (b) descent or ancestry; (c) nationality or national origin. Section 9 deals with the irrelevancy of motive and dominant ground and provides (1) In determining whether a person has contravened section 7 or 8, the person's motive in engaging in any conduct is irrelevant. (2) In determining whether a person has contravened section 7 or 8, it is irrelevant whether or not the race or religious belief or activity of another person or class of persons is the only or dominant ground for the conduct, so long as it is a substantial ground. Section 11 sets out some exceptions and provides (1) A person does not contravene section 7 or 8 if the person establishes that the person's conduct was engaged in reasonably and in good faith (a) in the performance, exhibition or distribution of an artistic work; or (b) in the course of any statement, publication, discussion or debate made or held, or any other conduct engaged in, for (i) any genuine academic, artistic, religious or scientific purpose; or (ii) any purpose that is in the public interest; or (2) For the purpose of subsection (1)(b)(i), a religious purpose includes, but is not limited to, conveying or teaching a religion or proselytizing.

The complainants case The complainants contend the respondent has breached section 7 of the Act, They say that the article constitutes racial vilification at three levels, namelyThe article as a whole; The structure of parts of the article; and Some specific words and phrases in the article. They contend that the article describes the beliefs of modern/contemporary Greeks and is not expressing views of antiquity. They conclude this is so by virtue of reference to modern Greeks, Greek zealots and references to Greece being undemocratic and run by a government composed of zealots that only the brave few resist. They contend that the paragraphs repeated in paragraph 9 herein contain a peroration or exhortation leading to the denunciations set out in paragraph 10 herein (after the section in bold type) and the dramatic effect of the writing makes the words more effective in inciting hatred against, serious contempt for, or revulsion or severe ridicule of the Greek race. Further, other paragraphs contain statements that criticize the Greek race as one which is unable to maintain a real democracy, that endangers and oppresses ethnic minorities and can only produce a government that is run by hot headed brainwashed nationalists who dwell in the Middle Ages. They maintain that the concluding paragraphs of the article constitute a patronizing statement that the Greek race is only capable of creating a country deficient in human rights, poor and on a downward spiral. Their other contentions relate to various phrases which the complainants contend hold the Greek race up to hatred, serious contempt, or revulsion or severe ridicule because they portray members of the Greek race as having a capacity to perform and accept things that civilized persons do not. Such phrases are : a thieving nation these Greek deranged bastardly monsters stinking Greek teacher and a spy-for-a-priest a butcher-for-a-priest freaks of nature deranged monsters evil alien abstraction what evil spirits possessed your moronic conscience predisposed to such ghastly monstrosity The Tribunal heard viva voce evidence from Mr. Ian Pelekanakis who is a member of the complainant body and also its treasurer. In addition the Tribunal accepted into evidence three statements in support of the complainants case. One was from Leyshon Betts and the other from Professor Melville-Jones. Neither is of Greek descent and both stated that in their view the article breached the Act because of its offensive and abusive language. A third statement was received from Peter Jasonides who is of Greek extraction; in his view the impassioned tone of the article and its disparaging characteristics were malign and stimulated racial hatred. Mr. Pelekanakis told the Tribunal that the articles author had used alleged historical events to

abuse todays Greeks and to portray them as racially inferior, evil and wicked. He said the article had been brought to his attention and he had then purchased a copy of the paper. He neither reads nor speaks Macedonian. The article was discussed at length at board level resulting in a decision that something had to be done about it. In cross-examination he agreed that the naming issue was a running sore and that it had remained so since 1991. He insisted that the article had a dehumanizing intent and was an attempt to portray Greeks as racially inferior, evil and wicked. The respondents case Mr. Stankovski gave evidence as to how the article came to be published and why he thought it suitable for publication. It is clear that he is still unwell but his explanation is best summarized by some paragraphs from his written statement. He stated ....because of the small overall population, the [Macedonian] community, whether at home or abroad, is very cohesive with a strong sense of ethnic identity. It is united by the Macedonian language, by its own church, the Macedonian Orthodox Church. There is a high level of intermarriage between Macedonians. Extended family groups are common. In Melbourne the community is highly organized around the churches, cultural groups, sporting clubs and social activities. In Melbourne , two newspapers as well as ethnic radio and television programs reinforce community cohesion and identity. The internet is used by many groups of Macedonians, and facilitates contact internationally. A Macedonian resident in Canada emailed the article complained of to the newspaper. The article that was forwarded to us was published in Canada a few weeks before we received it. We published it in the same format in which it was forwarded to us. As editor I considered it appropriate for publication as in my view, its content was a matter of public interest for the Macedonian community. The issues raised were topical and current and of concern to Macedonians in Australia and worldwide. In addition, the article coincides generally with Macedonians ongoing attempts to join the European Union, NATO and the United Nations under its constitutional name (the naming dispute) ....... The article was published in the honest belief that it would be of interest to Macedonian readers, and that it was a matter of political significance and as such was worthy of discussion. There was no ulterior motive in publishing it. I believed in the truth of the statements made in the article, even though the language may have been extravagant in parts. It was my view that the public interest in the publication lay in educating and acquainting Macedonians in Australia of the history, heritage and nuances in dispute. I also felt the publication was able to remind Macedonians of the importance of these issues. In cross-examination he was asked the following: Q. If someone said of Slavic Macedonians that they were evil abstractions or freaks of nature,

you would agree with me that is something that would hold Slavic Macedonians up to ridicule or contempt A. Yes Do you agree with me that if an article is written in Hobart which said something of American Indians that they were freaks of nature or evil alien abstractions would not those America Indians be entitled to say that they had been ridiculed? Yes. In re-examination it became clear that Mr. Stankovskis grasp of English was less than fluent and that his ability to explain the meaning of various words was less than adequate. It was also apparent to me that he was unwell. There were other witnesses for the respondent. The Tribunal heard from Aneta Kotevski and received various statements. Predictably each of the witnesses was either born in Macedonia or one or both of their parents were. The thrust of their evidence was that the article was to be read within its historical context and pointed out that the article assumes a certain knowledge of history and in particular of the annexation by Greece of Macedonia in 1913 and the subsequent and long-running naming dispute. Discussion The evidence before the Tribunal is predictably partisan and frankly of little assistance. The Greeks say the article vilifies them and incites hatred; the Macedonian Slavs (if I can call them that without being accused of using a pejorative term) say it is an article of interest to Macedonians and its utility is to educate and inform Macedonians living in Australia . The first matter for me to decide is that of the right of the complainants to bring this action. As I understand the claim, it is brought pursuant to the representative provisions of the Act. Section 19 sets out who may take a complaint to the Commission. The relevant sub-sections provide as follows: (3) A representative body may complain to the Commission on behalf of a named person or persons if the Commission is satisfied that (a) each person named in the complaint (i) is entitled to complain under subsection (1)(a); and (ii) has consented to the complaint being made by the body on the person's behalf; and (b) the representative body has a sufficient interest in the complaint; and (c) the alleged contravention arises out of the same conduct.

(4) A representative body has sufficient interest in a complaint if the conduct that constitutes the alleged contravention is a matter of genuine concern to the body because of the way conduct of that nature adversely affects or has the potential adversely to affect the interests of the body or the interests or welfare of the persons it represents. (5) An authorization under sub-section (1)(b)(i) may be given (a) in writing; or (b) in any other manner approved by the Commission. I accept the evidence given by Mr. Pelekanakis as to the genesis of the complaint, the reason for it and his explanation of how the subject matter of the complaint is viewed as a matter of genuine concern to the organization of which he is a member and office bearer. This is so notwithstanding that the emphasis in most of the pre-complaint communications related to other matters. The starting point for any analysis of matters arising under the Act is the Preamble to it, an unusual addition to the legislation in itself. The opening words of the Preamble areThe Parliament recognizes that freedom of expression is an essential component of a democratic society and that his freedom should be limited only to the extent that can be justified in an open and democratic society. This makes it crystal clear that Parliament intended this Act to be interpreted with care and a degree of rectitude. Indeed, Neave JA, in Catch the Fire highlighted that approach at paragraph 173 where she stated The legislation aims to strike a balance between protecting freedom of speech and protecting people from vilification on the grounds of their race and religious belief. It would inconsistent with this aim to interpret the legislation so as to make it impossible for people to proselytize for their own faith or to criticize the religious beliefs of others. That line of argument was considered in some detail in Walsh v Hanson [2000] HREOCA 8 and the sentiments expressed by the Commissioner bear repeating. The case involved Pauline Hanson and her One Nation party and the publication entitled Pauline Hanson The Truth. In the publication there were claims that aboriginals practiced cannibalism and that they ate babies. Complaints were made about parts of the book although many aboriginals objected to it in its entirety. Ms Hanson defended the book (although she was not the author, she owned copyright) saying people needed an alternative to the noble savage picture of aborigines being taught in schools and universities. Having concluded that the nature of the publication was political, the Commissioner had this to say It is without doubt a grave matter to restrict or control the free expression of political thought. Such restrictions have frequently been imposed in the name of some good said to be so important that its promotion or preservation justifies the restrictions. I think care has to be taken not to suppress genuine political expression, even when that expression, either in form or content or

both, may be repulsive to the majority of the community. It is a concomitant of political freedom that political activists, especially those at the extreme ends of the political spectrum of ideas, will from time to time, even frequently, hurt and offend other members of society. It seems to me that we must be mature enough to accept that as a price that we must pay for the privilege of living in a society where political expression is to remain free and unfettered. This is so no matter how odious to the majority some of the fringe manifestations of that freedom may be. The leading case in this jurisdiction is Catch the Fire Ministries Inc & Ors v Islamic Council of Victoria Inc & Anor [2006] VSCA 284. This was an appeal from a decision of this Tribunal that two Pentecostal pastors, and their evangelical organization Catch the Fire Ministries, had engaged in religious vilification of Muslims in statements made at a public seminar held in 2002 and in articles published in 2001. In his comprehensive judgment Nettle JA traversed the terms of the Act and made a number of salient points which have resonance in the case before me although I am not persuaded that I should just replace the word religion with race and assume that Catch the Fire contains a complete dossier of answers for matters arising where race is the sole element. This is because there are some necessary differences. For instance, in most cases, religion is a choice whereas race is not and one might ponder whether standards should be applied differently when considering whether racial laws (in circumstances where the person being racially vilified has no ability to choose) have been breached. That said, his Honours instructive judgment provides comprehensive guidance on a number of facets of the matters before me. Under the heading The meaning of incites his Honour dealt with the prevailing view that had arisen from the a decision of the NSW Administrative Appeals Tribunal in Kazak v John Fairfax Publications Ltd [2000] NSWADT 77. In that case, the Tribunal was considering the effect of s.20C of the Anti-Discrimination Act 1977 (NSW) which provides It is unlawful for a person, by public act, to incite hatred towards, serious contempt for, or severe ridicule of, a person or group of persons on the ground of the race of the person or member of the group. At paragraph 13 his Honour stated: The New South Wales Tribunal took the view that the word incites in s.20C should be given its ordinary meaning urge, spur on, stir up, animate, stimulate to do something. It also held that the operation of s.20C was not limited to what it called actual incitement and thus that it was sufficient to engage the operation of s.20C that conduct appear as likely to stimulate hatred, serious contempt or serious ridicule. That meant, it was said that one was to ignore any special characteristics or proclivities to which the audience or potential audience might be subject and to assess the matter by reference to the standard of the ordinary reasonable reader. In other words, one was to assume a person of fair average intelligence who is not perverse, morbid, suspicious of mind or avid for scandal.

In my view, however, that reasoning is not altogether apposite in relation to s.8 of the Act. That accords with the plain and ordinary meaning of the word and also with the criminal laws conception of incitement, upon which s.8 appears loosely to be based. I also allow that incitive conduct is capable of contravening s.8 without necessarily causing hatred or serious contempt or revulsion or serious ridicule. As with the common law criminal offence of incitement, I view s.8 as directed to inchoate or preliminary conduct, whether or not it causes the kind of third party response it is calculated to encourage. In that sense, the section is prophylactic. But that said, I do not accept that one should exclude from consideration the nature of the audience to whom the conduct is directed. It strikes me that even if the reasoning of the NSW tribunal remains entirely apposite in the case of race, in the circumstances of this matter, in its particular factual context and the Court of Appeals commentary about audience, I should not deal with incitement on the basis of whether or not the article is likely to stimulate the relevant emotion absent any consideration of the potential audience. His Honour went on to state that the idea of the ordinary reasonable reader arises from defamation law which has as its object the protection of individuals against false allegations calculated to lower them in the esteem of others. He continued Contrastingly, s.8 does not prohibit statements about religious beliefs per se or even statements which are critical or destructive of religious beliefs. Nor does it prohibit statements concerning the religious beliefs of a person or group of persons simply because they may offend or insult the person or group of persons. The proscription is limited to that which incites hatred or other relevant emotion and s.8 must be applied so as to give it that effect. Neave JA took a slightly different view and concluded that because of publication on the web site and because anyone could have read the material on the website, the Tribunal was required to consider whether its effect was likely to incite hatred and other relevant responses among a broad audience. Nettle JA went on to consider the nature of the audience to whom the conduct is directed. At paragraph 16 he continued: If conduct is to incite a reaction, it must reach the mind of the audience. And if conduct is to be perceived as inciting a particular reaction, it must reach the mind of an audience as something which encourages that reaction. So, for conduct to incite hatred or other relevant emotion it must reach the mind of an audience as something which encourages those emotions. So, therefore, the question of whether it has that effect will depend upon the perception of the audience. 17. Of course, where statements are published generally as they might be in a book or newspaper or by posting on a web site, one may need to have regard to all manner of persons who are likely to see them and absorb them. But it is otherwise where the audience is select. 18......Parity of reasoning with the law relating to misleading and deceptive conduct suggests that s.8 has in view the effect of conduct on a reasonable members of the class of persons to whom the conduct is directed. But for the reasons already expressed, the perception of a reasonable

member of the class of persons to whom conduct is directed will not always be the same as the perception of the so-called ordinary reasonable reader. .... 19. So to say does not deny the ordinary reasonable reader a role in the assessment of religious vilification. As will be seen, he or she or at least something very like them has a large role to play in the application of s.11. But for the purposes of s.8 I think the test is different. It is a question of whether the natural and ordinary effect of the conduct is to incite hatred or other relevant emotion in the circumstances of the case. It is abundantly clear that it is necessary to construe the article as a whole and not to take individual phrases in a piecemeal fashion and construe the effect of each individual phrase. The cases are ad idem on this point and it follows that I reject the submission of counsel for the applicants that I should consider the individual slurs one by one. It is necessary to view the entire article against the backdrop of historical context and the dispute which has arisen between the two communities and the antipathy generated by that dispute. The question to be asked is whether the article, as whole, in its historical and social context, amounts to incitement to hatred of the Greeks as a race? Not the ultra-nationalist Greeks who may have perpetrated the acts complained of, but the Greeks as a nation, as a race of people. And of course in answering the question, one must consider the nature of the audience which is likely to see and absorb the statements in question. In so doing , I must also consider whether there are parts of the article which contain what is referred to in the cases as an ameliorating effect. The writer states that he solutes [sic] all the progressive Greeks, who today, at their own peril bravely support the ethnic minorities in Greece . I solute [sic] their courage to stand up to the hot-headed, brain-washed nationalists. One might draw a variety of inferences from the text of the article that the writer does not seek to brand all modern Greeks with attributes equivalent to their forbears but in the main I viewed those inferences to be of little moment. The Australian Macedonian Weekly is, as mentioned before, printed in the Macedonian language. A perusal of its website indicates copies from 2006 onwards are available on archive. A random search of several editions over the time reveals that English language articles are a rarity. Indeed the majority of editions are entirely in Macedonian. So even though the editions are on the website, they are not likely to be accessed by the public at large or indeed by folk who do not read the language. In my view that limits the extent of the potential audience. Furthermore, as Dr Kotevski said, without a knowledge and understanding of the history, a casual reader would not in any event comprehend the nuances contained in the article. Dr Kotevski, whose evidence I accepted on that point, is a daughter of a mixed Macedonian/Greek parentage. Neave JA contemplated whether s.8 required consideration of whether the ordinary reasonable reader would be incited to hatred or other relevant response and referred to the finding in the Kazak case that s.20C of the Anti-Discrimination Act 1977 required consideration of whether the ordinary reasonable reader [could] understand from the....act that he/she is being incited to

hatred towards or serious contempt for, or severe ridicule of a person or persons on the ground of race. At paragraph 157 she had this to say ; Section 8 is not directed at religious vilification in the abstract but is concerned with the effect of the alleged inciters words or conduct on those exposed to that behaviour. If that were not the case, a person could deliberately inflame the emotions of people known to have prejudiced views towards a particular religious group and then avoid the application of s.8 by saying that the behaviour would not have incited an ordinary reasonable audience. With one minor qualification, I therefore agree with Nettle, J.A.s view that s.8 requires consideration of the effect of the conduct on a member of the class to which it is directed. The minor qualification relates to Nettle, J.A.s reference to a reasonable member of the class to which that conduct is directed. Despite the common use of the concept of reasonableness, both in the common law and in legislation, I have avoided that formulation because the concept of a reasonable member of the class may be inappropriate in the context of racial or religious vilification......it may be more appropriate to consider the effect of the words or conduct on an ordinary member of the class to which it is directed, taking account of the circumstances in which the conduct occurs. I would therefore agree....that the test for the purposes of s.8 is whether the natural or ordinary effect of the conduct is to incite hatred or other relevant emotion in the circumstances of the case. For his part Ashley JA (dealing with the differences between his other two colleagues) at paragraph 132 stated: First, concerning the question of incitement, I prefer the formulation that it should be decided by reference to an ordinary rather than a reasonable member of the audience class..... ......I agree with Neave J.A. that the import of a publication, so far as incitement is concerned, may be disclosed from consideration of its entirety rather than by discrete examination of its component parts. All three of the judges in appeal spent some time considering the applicability of the test formulated in Bropho v Human Rights and Equal Opportunity Commission [2004] FCAFC 16. That case involved the publication of a cartoon that lampooned the dispute about the return of the head of an aboriginal leader from a museum in England . The ensuing complaint alleged a breach of s.18C of the Racial Discrimination Act 1975 (Cth) which provided 18C(1) It is unlawful for a person to do an act, otherwise than in private, if: (a) the act is reasonably likely, in all the circumstances, to offend, insult, humiliate or intimidate another person or a group of people; and (b) the act is done because of the race, colour or national or ethnic origin of the other person or some or all of the people in the group. At first instance in Catch the Fire, the late Judge Higgins, then of this Tribunal, without expressly stating the source of his view, appeared to rely on the decision of French J in Bropho

that the words done because of in s.18C of the Racial Discrimination Act, required a causal connection. The Commonwealth Act contains exemptions in like vein to those found in s.11 of the Victorian Act. So, although the exemption sections are almost identical, the sections dealing with the actual breach are not so similar and that very difference makes the application of Bropho to the interpretation of s.7 somewhat fraught. What the case does highlight however is that the Court approved the formulation of Kiefel J in Creek v Cairns Post Pty Ltd [2001] FCA 1007 and that her Honour in turn relied on Waters v Public Transport Corporation [1991] HCA 49; (1991) 173 C.L.R. 349,401. In considering the meaning of the words on the ground of religious belief as they appear in s.8, Nettle J.A. noted the construction placed on the words by the judge at first instance that the meaning of the words on the ground of was not dissimilar to because as it appeared in s.18C of the Commonwealth Act. He thought there were problems with this interpretation. In particular, at paragraph 23, his Honour stated: ..... it appears to me that s.9(1) of the Act, by expressly providing that a persons motive in engaging in any conduct is irrelevant, confirms that "on the ground of" in s.8(1) is to be interpreted as the majority interpreted those words in the Equal Opportunity Act in Waters. In effect, it gives statutory force to the view first expressed by the House of Lords in R. v. Birmingham City Council and later adopted by Deane and Gaudron, JJ. in Australian Iron & Steel Pty Ltd v. Banovic and then by Mason, C.J. and Deane and Gaudron, JJ. in Waters, that intention or motive to discriminate (or in this case to engage in conduct which incites hatred), though it may be relevant so far as remedies are concerned, is not a necessary condition of liability. Again, at paragraph 30 his Honour referred the problem of adopting the Bropho test and summarized as follows: With respect, there are several aspects of that reasoning [the Tribunal at first instance] which I take leave to doubt. The first of them arises out of the adoption of the Bropho test and, consequently, the Tribunals conclusion that the words "on the ground of [religious beliefs]" imply a causal connection between religious beliefs and impugned conduct. In effect the Tribunal decided that the Seminar contravened s.8 because the Tribunal was satisfied that Pastor Scot was moved or caused by the religious beliefs of Muslims to make the statements which he did at the Seminar, and that an ordinary reasonable person who was not malevolently inclined or free from susceptibility to prejudice would be inclined by Pastor Scots statements to hate Muslims. But, for the reasons which I have given, I do not consider that that was the question which needed to be decided. In my view the question was whether, having regard to the content of the statements in the context of the whole of the Seminar, and to the nature of the audience in the sense that I have described, the natural and ordinary effect of what was stated was to encourage the hatred [or other stipulated emotion] of Muslims based on their religious beliefs.. It seems all three Justices of Appeal concluded that the approach taken by the majority in Waters was correct in relation to s.8 of the Victorian Act; i.e that the meaning of on the ground of in

s.8 referred to the basis of the feelings likely to be incited in the audience and not to anything that motivated the vilifying conduct. This test is identical in respect of the element of on the ground of adopted in Kazak. The language used in the article in question was described by Mr. Stankovski as extravagant. That strikes me as an understatement. Frankly it is more properly viewed as an intemperate and (in many parts) hyperbolical rant aimed at the acts of past participants and present ultranationalists. But the test is not whether the article could have been written better, could have been expressed in less pejorative terms, or as counsel put it, in a more felicitous tone. It is not for this Tribunal to determine whether the acts complained of in the article are an accurate recounting of history; the truth or otherwise of what might be seen as extreme allegations is of little relevance. It is not material whether the following extracts are or are not be a correct version of history although it is fair to say that against the nuances of history such allegations might appear perfectly appropriate but do not necessarily incite hatred. ..destroying anything Macedonian and replacing it with Greek; to put a permanent imprint on a land they never owned before, the uprooted the ethnic Macedonians from their ancestral lands: Burned and defaced any Macedonian artifact found connected to the past; transplanted refugees from Asia Minor and spread their gruesome, poisonous propaganda through the Macedonian land; By erasing the Macedonian legacy, these fascist Greeks felt they could eliminate and wipe out all potential witnesses from ever challenging the newly established status quo. The complaints made in the article are not, in any event, complaints against Greeks per se; they are complaints about the actions of some Greeks perpetrated in the past and denunciations about perceived past wrongful acts.. How can a stinking Greek teacher...? whilst offensive is not made against all Greeks although made in relation to a teacher who refuses to let a child speak its mother tongue; How can a butcher for a priest? refers to an un-named individual, not to all Greeks; it is not a statement that all Greeks are butchers. And so on. What is being criticised here is the conduct of the priest, the conduct of the teacher. Paraphrasing in accordance with section 7 what Neave J.A. stated as the correct construction of s.8, the following applies: The phrase on the ground of race does not refer to the ground which caused the alleged inciter to act, but to the ground on which people exposed to the alleged inciters words were incited to hatred or other relevant emotion against another person or group. It is not necessary to show that the audience was actually incited to hatred, serious contempt for, or revulsion or severe ridicule of a person or class or persons on the ground of their race. A breach of s.7 occurs if the words or conduct have the tendency to incite that response. In considering whether s.7 has been breached, it is necessary to take account of the effect of the words on an ordinary member of the audience to which they were directed. The cases agree that the ordinary meaning of the words incite is to urge, spur on, stir up, animate, stimulate to do something. So in the context of s.7 the question that must be asked is whether, having regard to the content of the article as a whole set in its historical and social context, to the nature of an ordinary member of the audience it might reach, whether the natural

and ordinary effect of what was stated in the article is to stir up, etc or stimulate and encourage the hatred of, serious contempt for, or revulsion or severe ridicule of Greeks on the ground of their race. I am not persuaded he complainants have made out their case; by that I mean that I am not persuaded that the offending article, when read by a person (within the limitations of the contemplated audience) of fair intelligence who is not perverse, morbid, suspicious of mind or avid for scandal is likely to stimulate hatred or the other emotions contemplated by s.7. I am mindful of the comments of Neave J.A. that when information is transferred to the internet, it reaches a broad general audience. But such is not the case here. I can say this with some confidence for the following reasons. Mr. Stankovski told the tribunal that the article was aimed at Macedonians living in Australia . His evidence by itself might not be enough but there are other factors bearing on the subject. On its face, this is a Macedonian newspaper, published essentially in the Macedonian language in Cyrillic script and aimed at the Macedonian community. Certainly when published on the website it can be accessed by people who do not read Macedonian but such a reader would be limited to finding and reading the isolated English language articles appearing amid the myriad pages of Macedonian text. Counsel for the respondent contended that because so much of background to the dispute which was the genesis of the article was not dealt with in the article and that knowledge of the history of the dispute was assumed, serves to confirm that the intended audience was not the world at large but a rather more select audience, Macedonians, and I think there is much force to that submission. For the average Macedonian reader, this article is probably just preaching to the converted and is not likely to stir up such raw emotion as to breach the Act. I suspect that the average non-Macedonian reader who might stumble across the article on the website or who might flick through it at the local shop would just wonder what it was all about without being incited to any extreme emotion about Greeks. It is true that in modern multicultural Australia people might wonder why it was necessary consistently to re-open old ethnic wounds and to do so in such forceful terms. Although I would not wish to be taken as approving the tenor of the article I am not persuaded it breaches s.7 of the Act. In my view the words of the article do not have any tendency to incite hatred against Greeks or to incite serious contempt for, or revulsion or severe ridicule of Greeks on the ground of their race. A commitment to free speech is an essential concept of all liberal democracies of which Australia is one. In this country we do not have a version of the USA s first amendment which protects the most rabid ideology in the name of free speech but the legislation under review here (and its federal and other state counterparts) serves to place some restriction on racist and other extreme expressions. That said I am firmly of the view that restrictions should only be placed on discourse in the most egregious of cases. I can do no better than to echo and adopt the sentiments of the Hon J A Nader QC, the Commissioner who presided over the Hanson case. His comments on political discourse and its place in our society and the need for political expression to remain free and unfettered are set out in paragraph 40 herein. It has not been necessary for me to consider the effect of section 11 because I have not found a breach of s.7. However without wishing to be taken as having considered the matter with any particularity, and assuming one were to be satisfied that the respondent had acted reasonably and

in good faith, I would have some difficulty in deciding that the article was a publication, discussion or debate for any purpose that is in the public interest. My instinct is that the section requires a consideration of whether the subject matter is in the interest of the public as a whole, as distinct from one that excites the interest of two ethnic groups of the public. But I am not required to decide the point. The complaint is dismissed. Noreen Megay Senior Member

Book and other Reviews

Please check out Slave Nikolovski Katins website at: www.slavekatin.com Write your comments to Slave at: slavekatin@gmail.com

Eye On Macedonia on CNN

Skopje , 10 October 2011 (MIA) - CNN will start special coverage programme Eye on Macedonia from October 10 to 19. CNN news anchor Jim Clancy will be live every day at 6.30 p.m. with special program hosted from different locations in Skopje and Macedonia . The focus of CNN programme on Macedonia will be Skopje 2014 project, economic development, industry, changes in education and infrastructure, new "Alexander the Great" Airport, the singer Esma Rexhepova, company for special film effect FX3X, the director Milcho Manchevski as well as education system and unemployment in Macedonia. Macedonia at its geographic location as crossroad between the East and the West is very important country for business, culture and trade, CNN said in promotional video clip. Skopje 2014 is ambitious project aimed at raising the cultural profile of the capital and to improve the infrastructure, "Alexander the Great" Airport window towards bigger economic growth, CNN reports. CNN's Eye On presented different countries as France , Germany , Poland , Turkey , India , Oman , Bahrain , Indonesia South Korea, Japan ...

Dear Mr. Stefov, Here is my latest publication about ubication of Perseida in Macedonia, http://www.macedonia.se/en/Load/60/drenovo_kavadarci/

http://www.macedonia.se/en/Load/61/bryanium/ http://www.macedonia.se/en/Load/62/perseida/ http://www.macedonia.se/en/Load/63/deuriopus/ http://www.macedonia.se/en/Load/64/euristum/ You are free to distribute this information on your forum. With best regards Kiril Arsov

Feedback
Mr. Gandeto. Dear Sir, I fully agree with your comments but who is to blame? Why do you refer to ancient Achaia, by the name Greece or Hellas when you know the truth very well, as you explained it: Johan Gustav Droysen invented these terms in Germany in 1834? Why do we play their crook game and engage in history, when such a nation never existed? Why don't we concentrate on present day issues, confiscating our properties in northern Greece under what law? The history topic is just a ploy, a distraction from the main issues... Back to Australia 's recognition our name? In 1995 our Macedonian council all top brains including Mile Terzievsky PhD, Dr Who is Who Meets our foreign minister Alexander Downer to discuss the recognition issue. When some delegates raise the question, the minister replies: You don't want Australia 's recognition and produce a letter Memorandum, saying The Government in Skopje is not a Macedonian government. The letter was inspired by then "VMRO-DPMNE". That letter satisfied Mr. P. Kiritsis. Let us do a self analysis. The Greeks in USA have produced a book called: "The Orthodox Study Bible" This is a plagiarism presenting the Bible as a book of Greek history. How many of you USA Macedonian scholars protested? None. Mr Gandeto, I would like to send you some material, my personal studies. If you send to me your address, I will post it to you. You with Risto, are doing a very good patriotic job. Personally, I would like to contribute, as a Dete Begalets, being older than you So Makedonsky pozdravi, dovidenie, Dedo Mano

Mr. Gandetto, I am saddened by the stance taken by our intelligencia in relation to the Greek Lobby antiMacedonian propaganda. The answer of our Macedonian Australian Council is negative and they, headed by Prof, PhD, Dr who is Who, Mile Terziovsky was exactly the same as Mr. P. Kiritsis. They met the foreign affairs for Australia , Mr Alexander Downer and presented him with a similar Memorandum: "No embassy from FYROM to Australia ", because the government in Skopje is not Macedonian. It is pathetic you would not believe it. That was the response of the VMRO-DPMNE. And the council Mr. Kiritsis represents, when registered in Australia , should have been opposed by Macedonians who have registered the name "Macedonian" 100 ago around the world, as copy rights, while Greeks maintained, there is no word " Macedonia " wake up gentlemen and forget ancient history which is a false battle field to distract us from the actual present problems. Dedo Mano

Dear Gandeto, I just read your posting in detail and it saddens me when you talk about ancient "Greeks" or Hellenes" you and most of us fall in to the trap created by Anglo-Franks, a fictitious Greek state: "Hellada" the highest state of humanity ever reached, the 6th heaven. This is a ploy to cut off Macedonia and Russia from ancient Macedonian heritage. All else is simply bull-crap. How many wars, the West conducted against the East? Crusades, Napoleon Hitler and now Nato? If you want more discussion about this topic lets do it offline some other time. Now please concentrate on present issues. What right has France to bring Turko-Greeks into Macedonia and confiscate our properties? We, Macedonians under Greek occupation suffered the most. All talk about ancient history is empty talk, has no legal binding, don't waste your time its a dead horse. Have Macedonia s invaders, since 1878, paid anything for devastating Macedonia ? No! This is the real issue to show them that they all are crooks. The West with the 200 years of fabricating "Hellenism" has distorted our minds, and to keep your job at University you must be a "Hellenist". Have you read Martin Bernal "Black Athena", Zdravayte, Dedo Mano PS. If you want a debate, you welcome.

Dobro jutro, Risto! It would be good if you or your co-workers would read the paper: Rozhanskii, I.L. and Klyosov, A.A. (2009) Haplogroup R1a1: haplotypes, lineages, history, geography. Proc. Russian Academy of Genealogy (ISSN 1942-7484), 2, 6, 974-1099. . . , R1a: , , , , -, 2, 6, 2009, , 974-1099. Accessible at: http://www.lulu.com/items/volume_68/8049000/8049785/2/print/7842510_Lulu.pdf especially pages 1087-1090 where it shows that Slavic people were already living in the Balkans 10-12 thousands years ago. Other papers of this type are accessible at the site: http://aklyosov.home.comcast.net/ Thus it proves that no settlements took place in the 6th/7th century AD for Macedonians to be Slavic people. You were there many millennia before the Greeks appeared on the scene. Pozdrav, T. Mr Gandeto, I am glad you are exposing the Greek brutal treatment of Macedonians since 1871, when Macedonia was divided in religious spheres and armed bands from Greece , Bulgaria and Serbia fought for the spoils and massacred Macedonian population. Europe did not care because they declared us non existent. Read the document by Dimitris Lithoxou from Lerin called: "To apporito ntokoument", debating the secret memorandum by Philipos Dragumis to the Secret Service in Greece , 1948. Risto Stefov has a translation in the book : "Makedontsi kolku ne ima na svetov". Dragumis an Albanian from Bogatsku, prescribes all the necessary measure to prevent a return to "Human Rights for Macedonians whom he prefers to keep us as an anonymous group of people the enemies of Greece . He suggests they should call us "listes", criminals and kill them at will, because killing criminals no European will take any notice. Now, we returned back to the human rights. All the items you expose, the European godfathers should be confronted with, rub them on their nose and stop calling Greece "Democracy". Now in USA not all religious denomination enjoy equal rights. Only last year Greeks have re-written the Bible :called "Orthodox Study Bible", as a book of Greek History from Adam and Eve. Wherever they mention Macedonia , or Alexander on the foot note they explain: "Alexander was Greek", Macedonia is a geographical piece of land with no ethnic connotation.

Gentlemen of the Macedonian stock academics, I have not heard any complains from you. Greeks are proselytes, and still proselytising others to Greek Orthodoxy by force, which is illegal according to UN charter on Human rights, but I have not seen any complains by Macedonians. Are we completely dummies? USA State Department on Human rights exposed this many times. Are we unaware of this? Dedo Mano

E-mail(s) of the Month

About the
Dear Risto, Of course modern Greeks are not direct descendants of the Ancient Greeks -- whatever that means. If they had not mixed with other people at all, they would be susceptible to a number of diseases that are the product of a narrow gene pool. Of course Hellenism engulfed a large part of the Mediterranean Basin , Asia Minor , the Middle East , and even spread out as far as India or Persia . The point is not about ethnic purity but cultural continuity. Greeks, whether pure or mixed with Slavic or other populations are the people who self-identify as the cultural descendants of a nation speaking the same language and occupying the same region over a number of millennia. Now because you in particular need to identify with a civilization you have no cultural connection with, namely the Hellenes of Ancient Macedon, you hatefully spew irrelevant factoids and partial accuracies over your blog. As an initial matter, I suggest you fix your English diction. I am at your disposal if you ever want an editor for your blog. Not for any other reason, but because you truly make the Skopjan cause a great disservice through the way you write. Renaming Athens to Beijing will make me no more Chinese than renaming Skopje to Macedonia will make you Greek. Embrace your nationality and stop assigning superior properties to Hellenism. You are a Slav -- live with it already. Regards, Andrew M.

ree lie

Humour

With due acknowledgement to the Melbourne Age - Posted by Jim T.

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